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betsy8989

Need help on drawers

11 years ago
My base cabinets have just been installed and I now realize the top drawers are not the same height. Furious at kitchen designer but don't want to delay project. Can I live with this?

Comments (87)

  • PRO
    11 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago
    Sometimes when things like this happen, I feel it is a PERFECT opportunity to be creative and celebrate that it happened! Most people love the larger drawers for dishes and pots and pans.

    Two of my cabinet line I sell, also offer two different three drawer cabinets, one like yours and the other the top drawer is the same height as the other cabinets. Double check your drawings and make sure that is what you signed off on.

    * Could be as simple as finding some off the wall, whimsical hardware just for those drawers. Example: Photo 1- Silverware hardware. Or find some old pots and pans were the lid handles or knobs on top of the lids can come off and work as knobs.
    * You could paint the center panels a complementary color that highlights the drawers. I would suggest adding that color somewhere else in the room, another door or crown molding, tile backsplash,.... Or Paint that panels a different color and then add Trompe le ouil painting similar to this dresser. ....... See Example: Photo 2.
    * Or paint black board paint in center panels of drawer fronts like in this photo. Write with chalk shopping lists, recipe names, "bon appétit ." See Example: Photo 3.
    * Add pie safe tin materials to center panels. See Example: Photo 4.
  • PRO
    11 years ago
    A few more ideas:

    * Tile the center panels with mosaic tiles. Repeat the same tiles on the backsplash in a strip to pull in together. Example: Photo 1.
    * Add wood onlays to the face of the drawers. Example: Photo 2.
    * Lumicor or 3Form resin panels. Example: Photo 3.
    * Change drawer front out to bean / pasta drawers. Example: Photo 4.
  • PRO
    11 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago
    A couple of more ideas.

    * Apply wood molding into a design on drawer front like this dresser front. Example: photo 1.
    * Add NuMetal or Chemetal laminated metal to center of drawer fronts. Example: Photo 2.
    * Find a warming drawer or refrigerator drawer that would fit one of the drawer openings. Example: Photo 3.

    * Or leave it the way it is..... Many cabinet companies offer two different three drawer cabinets, one is like what you have and the other is the top drawer is the same height as the rest of cabinets in the room. More and more people want to have deeper drawers for pots and pans or plate/ bowl dish storage in drawers this is why more and more cabinet companies have added this option to their collection.
  • 11 years ago
    Personally I like different type drawers. The comment from Wyland IDC makes a lot of sense. I always try to make Lemonade or better yet Margartias when I am delt lemons. :)
  • 11 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago
    I think you've received some really creative suggestions, if you decide to live with the drawers as they are. Personally, I always notice whether the various lines in the kitchen line up nicely or not. It's one of those things (like properly sized shutters) that once you've learned to notice it, you can't stop noticing it. So if that is your temperament too, then I think it may be worth asking for it to be fixed. But I think many of the Starmark photos that flopsycat posted look way more annoying, in their mixed drawer sizes, than yours. At least your larger top drawer is symmetrically placed between two smaller ones.
  • 11 years ago
    I am truly amazed by all the feedback on this! Houzz members are the best! I'll report back on what the designer says and how I proceed from there.
  • 11 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago
    I think trying all these DIY projects to cover up a mistake on a new remodel is just ridiculous. Like going to a hairdresser for a hair cut. The hair dresser cuts your hair lop sided and you say, OH, that's OK, I will wear a hat, lol Why not just cut the hair right!
  • 11 years ago
    Margo, you are always spot on.
  • 11 years ago
    LOL sunnydew- I am often found eating crow;)
  • PRO
    11 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago
    So I also check out StarMark Cabinet's website. StarMark does indeed offer both kinds of three drawer cabinets. So we really don't know if this cabinet was a mistake, until you can pull out your signed drawings/ paperwork. Make sure which kind of three drawer cabinets you signed off on at time of order and double check the perspective or elevation drawings.

    If it doesn't match the order or drawings, you will have leverage to make them reorder a new cabinet or negotiate a credit back, if you don't like it. If the order and drawings match the cabinet you have, they will make you pay for the new cabinet. It is industry standard for the designer to go over the order thoroughly, cabinet by cabinet, making sure that it is exactly what you want to order. Good luck and keep us posted.

    Photos were found on the StarMark Cabinet website.
  • PRO
    11 years ago
    @wyland .. Why make all kinds of effort to fix someone else's mistake? I would imagine that if the customer had requested this odd combo the "designer" would have noted it and made the client sign off that they didn't want the industry standard. Basically the selection in their order was incorrect and if you jerry rigg it to "fix" the mistake will still look like a mistake 2 months from now as well as 2 years from now. The cabinet should be replaced with what the client thought would be there .. Even if they weren't aware that it was being ordered incorrectly. I think the designer screwed up... Happens. Best to make it right.
  • 11 years ago
    Actually what i picked up on wasn't the difference in the drawer height, which i don't find much of a problem but the fact that the top line is off by 1/4" or so.
    And i see the same default in the green cabinets that flopsy posted.
    I think that with the precision tools used now this just shouldn't happen, so someone has made miscalculations sometime which have never been corrected.
    In fact i think it can even look better to have the horizontality occasionally broken if it's done right, but the top line detail would bug me like mad.
  • 11 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago
    Once the counter is on... also, i'ts drawers next to cabinets, they aren't necessarily going to match. I think you are stressing about nothing.

    When I had mine done, there was a drawing for me to see beforehand. Was your plan verbal only? If so, than it's a lesson for everyone, if you saw but didn't note, then it's yours to bear. I do think your kitchen wil be gorgeous and I don't think there is anyting bad about the look.
  • PRO
    11 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago
    Hell Rococo & Taupe, Inc..... I agree, if the order that she signed off on shows something different than what she received, they certainly need to reorder it for her at NO charge. If she was my client, I would. **** At this point IT MAY NOT BE A MISTAKE as per order. ****

    ***** Since flopyscat1 stated above my first post ***** that she found out that on StarMark Cabinets website, they DO SELL THAT SAME CABINET ........... Betsy 8989 MIGHT FIND OUT THAT IT IS WHAT SHE ORDERED AND IT WAS NOT A MISTAKE ACCORDING TO THE ORDER, this will depend on what she signed off on............. I was only giving Betsy8989 some creative ideas of things she might be able do to enhance the cabinet, if she gets stuck with it and doesn't want to pay extra to order another one. Each one of these ideas would be done by professionals only, definitely not for the DYI person.

    It is typical for all cabinet dealers/ kitchen designer to go over the customer's order with them thoroughly, cabinet per cabinet, drawing by drawing. I always make sure that my customers understand everything, so we are both on the same page. I then have my customer sign off on the floor plan, each perspective, each elevation drawing, I list every appliance model number and size, as well as the invoice. If something comes wrong, I replace it at my cost.

    I have been designing kitchens and selling cabinets for almost 30 years. I have seen maybe 3% of the people sometimes forgot exactly what they actually ordered. The signed paperwork makes it clear to what was ordered.

    Wow, it looks like flopyscat1 and I have ruffled some feathers. And I thought Houzz was for fun?

    Betsy8989, I hope that everything goes in your favor and that you can order what you want. Keep us posted.
  • PRO
    11 years ago
    Hi magada,

    Good eye! I do see where it look like it is not level on the top of the green cabinet on flopyscat1 post.

    If StarMark Cabinets are like most other cabinet lines, the drawers are 6 way adjustable. This is the very last thing that the cabinet installer will do, is to adjust all doors and drawers to line up. Sometimes they may need to take the drawer front off the drawer box and reinstall it to the box to get them to lined up.
  • 11 years ago
    Well Wyland, if you look at Betsy's top line it's the same thing. I didn't know they could readjust but i guess thats kind of obvious thinking about it. However, in other given examples they obviously haven't been adjusted.

    Good thing i'm as eclectic about kitchens as the rest, i just don't like fitted kitchens for myself : if i did install one they'd probably go on strike as i'd be behind them with the micrometer.

    Guess this comes from having done lead mounted stained glass geometries and especially manual and semi-manual precision serigraphy where even 1/4 of a hair's breadth out just screams and is unaccepted.

    AKA a total pain in the butt for such miniscule matters.
  • PRO
    11 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago
    With some cabinet lines, not many, the drawer box itself is built integrated into the drawer front. This kind of drawer construction is impossible to take drawer front off and re-adjust. If that is the case, Betsy could have a problem, or maybe not? Actually that could give her some leverage and a good argument for a new cabinet replacement.

    If the StarMark Cabinets drawer boxes are integrated into drawer front, but still can be adjusted like most other cabinet lines, there still is a chance that the 6 way adjustment can take care of the lining up the tops and the bottoms, along with making sure there is a equal gap between the drawers.

    The other given examples where they obviously didn't adjust them in the other kitchen photos;

    1) It could have been installed by DYI and they didn't know how to adjust them.

    2). Other times it could be the cabinet installer is too lazy (I'm so thankful there are only a few of them around) and they don't want to take the time to adjust them or they don't know how. Some think if the client doesn't notice, they can get away without doing it. If this happens on one of my jobs, they will not get paid until everything was adjusted.

    Hey, I use to do leaded stain glass to, more as a hobby though! That was years ago, I still have many of my project hanging around. It was sure a lot of fun. I know what you mean about the 1/4 of a hair's breadth.
  • 11 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago
    So here is the elevation drawing. I can see the drawer height difference now but i didn't notice it when i wasn't looking for it, i think because the shaker lines make it busy.
    ok, guess i can't upload it.
  • PRO
    11 years ago
    You forgot the drawing.
  • 11 years ago
    Let's try this..
  • PRO
    11 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago
    I would still talk to the designer. StarMark obviously offers both styles of three drawer cabinets units. Do you remember if they had shown you both options? If not, ask them why. Mention that you don't remember them explaining this to you and see what they say. It is worth a try.
  • 11 years ago
    Is this the actual size of your elevation drawings? Do you see it as an obvious mistake in the drawings or only after having them installed? Either way the designer should have pointed out to you the different alignment. I say talk to them right away & point out your concerns. It is something you will always be unhappy about. Decide how to place your hardware & see if that will exacerbate the difference or make it better. Do it right away or you won't have a leg to stand on. I have had several problems with my own last kitchen install done by a big box store. Some I noticed right away & complained about & others I didn't notice until much later, but with all cases I either didn't complain loud enough or soon enough & have therefore lived with the errors. Not happily either. Lots of money under the bridge & a lesson learned if I get another chance for a new kitchen, I will not allow errors. Good design is in the details. Every designer should know that.
  • PRO
    11 years ago
    Hi Betsy8989,

    Just saw last posting...... If this is how they gave it to you it's kind of sad.....See attached.....Wall elevation should be dimensioned out with proper nomenclature on each cabinet.....Along with that, it should have been supported by a plan (top) view.....Finally, it should have been made even simpler for a novice Homeowner (nothing personal, of course) by having numerous color renderings where you could have easily seen this discrepancy.....

    As Sandra said above, a good design is in the details.....And we'll add that a kitchen's only as good as it's design.....It's the most complex remodel in your entire house, by far.....Lots of room for problems and each mistake affects numerous other elements of the design.....

    Anyway, please keep us updated on how this works out and if we can be of any help don't hesitate to contact us personally.

    John & Brigitte
  • PRO
    11 years ago
    Look at the kitchen rendering JandB posted above. Focus on the handles on the three base cabinets to the left of the beverage cooler. The first cabinet has no drawer and a vertical handle near the top of the door. The second cabinet does not have a drawer and a horizontal handle at the very top, above the other handles. The third cabinet is all drawers and has a horizontal handle centered in each drawer.

    Doesn't that arrangement of handles look bad? I think it looks bad.

    Does the kitchen look bad? I think the kitchen looks great.

    It is a small detail that that does not effect the overall design. I highly doubt anyone will be bothered by the different drawer heights.
  • 11 years ago
    It is what YOU are satisfied with that matters. Take care of the problems as you find them & don't accept excuses. You get what you pay for & kitchens are not cheap. My stupid designer did not even give me all elevations & therefore he ordered the wrong height cabinets on one side as I had a vaulted ceilings which delayed the whole process because he had to reorder them the correct height. I had even provided him with all elevation drawings as I wanted my kitchen designed by me.
  • 11 years ago
    I would be, the plan shown to the Customer looks even the drawers don't, it would drive me nuts. I'm sorry but the drawer handles higher up, then one missing look like bad design and do spoil the whole kitchen. Nature uses symmetry for reason so should we.
  • PRO
    11 years ago
    Hi again Betsy8989,

    Mark has a good point about handle locations and relationships to surrounding cabinetry.....Sometimes in "form vs. function" function wins out, as in this scenario.....

    The full height door cabinet is sink base for prep sink.....Next to that is a pantry pull-out which requires horizontal handle on top.....The drawer base is standard.....

    Point is that when running a line of drawer base cabinets the top drawers should be the same height for the visual.....

    Know what?.....Bottom line is that it's what you want.....There's no set rule.....It's just how we always do it.....We're certainly not the "drawer police" and in the end you have to make the final decision.....As Pros, we're all here to help you and give you our viewpoints.....

    You've been getting a lot of good advice from established Pros so we're sure yours will come out the way you want it in the end.....

    Do us a favor and post (or email) some images of your kitchen when it's done.....We'd love to see how it comes out!

    John & Brigitte
  • 11 years ago
    I think Mark Bischak is clear-thinking, level-headed, realistic and practical. Not taking sides here, but I generally agree with him.
  • PRO
    11 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago
    In addition, if you cook like a five star restaurant chef, no one is going to notice the kitchen no matter what it looks like.
  • PRO
    11 years ago
    Hey Mark...

    That was good!....Let the food be the visual!.....J&B
  • PRO
    11 years ago
    The test is in the tasting.
  • 11 years ago
    Well the sales guy will give me the privilege of purchasing replacement cabinets at his profit! So I think I'm going to have to live with these. I don't cook like a five star chef but the kitchen is a huge improvement over what was there before. Lesson learned: either go Ikea or hire a professional. Thanks for all the advice. I'll post pictures of the finished kitchen!
  • 11 years ago
    Can't wait to see it- I'm sure it will be a fantastic kitchen.
  • PRO
    11 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago
    I'm so sorry that it didn't work out well for you betsy8989. The kitchen will look nice when it is completed. I would consider taking advantage of the taller drawer storage space.... maybe dish storage, pots & pans with lids, or casserole dishes. Yes, final project photos. We would to all love to see them.
  • PRO
    11 years ago
    The sales guy gave you the "privilege" of purchasing your own replacement cabinets???.....Good Grief-Who are these guys?.....Be sure they get the reviews they deserve.
  • 11 years ago
    Technically it's not correct but I think it looks fine to me.
  • 11 years ago
    Betsy8989-did he show you the original plans and that is what they said-if not I would fight further. Otherwise I think if I were told that I would have them reworked by a local craftsman and then make sure and let the sales guy know that's what you did. And I am sure your sales guy answers to someone too-maybe his boss would prefer to save you as a future customer and preserve the company reputation as well....

    On a meaner note-my uncle was a craftsman who was friends with a professional cabinet maker that specialized in very high end homes-well he did a humongous kitchen by hand for a well known A-lister back in the day (I won't say who). Mr Big and Mighty didn't like one drawer (the wood grain was ever so slightly different)-he refused the cabinet maker to re-work it and then since needless to say the relationship became rather tense he refused to pay for the whole thing period but also insisted on keeping them. Rather than take him to court-where in a fair fight he should have one-raher he would be against the stars lawyers & probably would have lost thus having added court costs on top of being out for cabs and labor-so the cabinet maker just chose to eat the cost which even back then was in low 6 figures
  • 11 years ago
    won-not one...
  • PRO
    11 years ago
    I am a kitchen and bath designer and carry Fieldstone cabinetry which is a Starmark company. The cabinets are made to order and are a great product. I recently renovated my own kitchen and used Fieldstone cabinets, the same door style as yours. Starmark does carry 2 different options in a 3 drawer base. One option has a larger top drawer like the one you received. The other is a 3 drawer based "aligned" which has the standard top drawer. Many customers like larger top drawers and opt for what you got in order to double stack cutlery or use for bulkier items. This is NOT an error in design but perhaps in not making you aware of the difference and giving you the option of choosing what you preferred. Many designers are not detailed enough in going over what they have design with the customer. However, I usually go through the design cabinet by cabinet and still have customers that don't pay attention or just "assume" they know what they are getting. In the end, the goal is to make the customer happy with the end result and therefor think they should at least meet you halfway.
  • 11 years ago
    Think this must have been an oversight with the designer. Think they should've been all same depth.
  • 11 years ago
    Your problem is fixable, remove the front and move it up in line with your other doors.
  • 11 years ago
    Never mined I I was only looking at the top drawer.

    You need to get them replace, you should have a warranty
  • 11 years ago
    I would think about whether or not it's going to bother you. I think if this were a DIY it would be fine to leave it. But the fact that you hires someone and paid them to "design" this kitchen for you means that there shouldn't be be an oversight. I would talk to them about getting it done right. You shouldn't have to have uneven drawer pulls to make up for someone's lack of attention to detail. It's understandable that you want the project to end, but I think it should be done right. If it were my kitchen I think it would bother me every time I looked at it.


    On the other hand. Take a look at some other kitchens on Houzz and see if you can find ones that have things like this. Maybe it will give you the solution you're looking for if you REALLY don't want it re done. If they do agree to fix it, it should not come out of your budget.
  • 11 years ago
    After seeing some of those photos from the manufacturer it doesn't look like they made a mistake but in fact just took the cabinet block and which I'm sure they have different options available and put it there because a three drawer option was suggested. They may not have an option where that top drawer will ever like up. It works in those images because they are next to appliances or full length cabinets but in your case it's smack in between reguLar cabinet formats and looks odd I would definitely look into changing it or just getting a two drawer Option. The fact that it's juuuust below the other drawers is an eye sore. And doesn't look like they put thought into it. Again next to an appliance fine... Like this.. Mmmmmm...Change it.
  • 11 years ago
    Creekside Cabinets, how have your clients handled the hardware dilemma on the different size drawers?
  • 11 years ago
    fix them
  • 11 years ago
    Can you put the drawers on the end? Then the 2 cabinet doors would be side by side & tops aligned. Then the drawer is not as noticeable. Like an above poster noted, usually they are placed next to an appliance. Ours are and it is not noticed at all.
  • 11 years ago
    I get why you'd be worried--I'm anal about stuff like that, too. But this issue will fade away when the kitchen is done. In fact, you'll appreciate the different size drawers for different items.
  • PRO
    11 years ago
    It's hard to tell from this angle, but are the 2 outside ones at the same height and the middle one is different? If so then I think it will look fine and be balanced once the countertops and handles are on.
  • PRO
    11 years ago
    We usually still center the pull. I realize the pulls won't line up but neither do the drawers. Masrk Bischack talked about the pull on the full height door not looking right in the photo that JandDKitchens posted. They placed the handle horizontally like the drawers because that cabinet is a pullout that functions like a drawer. We do the same thing on the trash bases. I promise, you are overly focused on all the details right now. I personally thinks it looks great. I don't think your friends/guest will think anything is not "normal", especially if you don't bring it to their attention. As designers, we try to point every possible detail because it is really hard to know what a customer will have an issue with in the end. In our defense, many customers make numerous changes, many times at the last moment. We try our best to still go over all those details but rely on the customer as well to look at the drawings in detail before they sign off. I would rather have a customer ask all the questions possible up front then to ask when it's all over. Good luck! You really do have great cabinets, WAY better quality that Ikea. If you compare your kitchen to another "white" painted cabinet 10 years down the road, the finish on your kitchen will still look great while others are peeling and cracking...