KT,

I hope you'll add a post script describing the clients you have or have had that appreciated you, sent great referrals, etc.

Rosie in Sugar Hill, GA

Mr. Hidden Complexities - This is a very simple project. You can probably do it in one day without plans. Can you stop by and give me a price?

The Covert Researcher- after an hour walking around the site and discussing her goals, I comment on some of the work that's clearly been done recently, asking if they did it themselves. "Oh no, we have a Mexican guy who does all our landscape and masonry work for us."

"So why am *I* here?"

"Well, he's not a designer, so I wanted to run my ideas by a pro to make sure we weren't making a mistake."

And of course this person gets offended when you tell her to whip out the checkbook to pay your consulting fee or you're leaving!

Dave

An aside to Rosie- I have no doubt KT, like any of us doing this for a living, has a solid base of happy customers and referrals. But this being the internet, this forum often shines light on what clients and providers really think of each other, for better or for worse. The good clients are a joy and a blessing. The bad ones make you sit there and think "you know, maybe bartending wasn't as bad as I remember. I wonder if I can remember enough to get a job?"

Reading some of the homeowner comments here have helped me better understand some of the reservations and baggage my clients are bringing with them. Hopefully this tongue in cheek thread will show homeowners what *we* see. And who knows? Perhaps someone, having read this, will realize "oh no- I'm THAT GUY!" :)

Dave

As a 'them' I always finish way past the allotted/desired time but way under budget. It's always done pretty much the way I want it done too. I guess I can be categorized as a do-it-yourselfer.

-Ron-

"Reading some of the homeowner comments here have helped me better understand some of the reservations and baggage my clients are bringing with them. Hopefully this tongue in cheek thread will show homeowners what *we* see. And who knows? Perhaps someone, having read this, will realize "oh no- I'm THAT GUY!" :) "

That, by Marcinde, is a great post. It is a two way street. We learn what others are thinking and have a chance to teach what some of us are thinking.

Sometimes people take it the wrong way. I recall a thread by someone here in Massachusetts who felt very dissed because no landscape architects or designers were responding to her emails. The thread was entitled something like "do I have the wrong address to get any service". Some people thought it was elitist snobbery. I did my best to explain why I thought that was happening. In the end, my advice was followed, although I don't think it was directly from my advice. As the discussion grew, other people started to reinforce those suggestions, but from different angles. In the end, she showed more effort and therefore that she placed a value on pursuing the design that went beyond sending an email.

People need to know that responding to them takes time and effort away from other things. Somehow it is not considered that the landscaper is committed to resonsibilities and clients he is already working for and being paid by. Leaving these commitments to chase future sales is more unethical than ignoring some prospects to complete responsibilities you already have.

Who do you want working for you? The guy who is more dedicated to making the next sale or the one dedicated to finish your job? Maybe that guy who runs right over on the sales call for you is going to be running out from your job to do more of the same once you sign on the dotted line.

Good topic. In this fast pace world some people want what they want NOW. There are also people who will wait for quality work and take that waiting time to research their project, weeding out dislikes, highlighting likes, learning about the different types of material, pros and cons etc. In this world of computers, there is no reason for a client to not have personal ideas to work through while waiting for the call back. In response to Dave's post, I have resentments regarding "free estimates" vs design something I need to work on. Anyway, designing with living things should not be free. Square footage estimates can be free without design details. I have gotten pretty good at sizing up a brain picker vs. an honest client. I have had a fair amount of work done on and around my house. I insist on quality and if I can't afford to do it right then I'll have to wait until I can. I have also had some pretty bad experiences working with labors who don't speak English. Never again.

I posted for the first time on this site looking for suggestions for a walkway and front porch that I need to redo, I think that was in early spring. I still haven't decided what to do but during my research, I have offered to pay any professional a fee for just responding to my emails and questions. Just like you pay a fee for a doctor consult.

I also think it takes homeowners some time and experience to get use to working with outside contractors and/or designers. As mentioned before, any business that deals with people will always have it's challenges. Learning from each situation and growing is how we become experienced.

Thanks for reading my opinions. Ally

After "becoming" a gardener, I cringe when I read the posts that say "I want an interesting landscape design that requires little or no maintenance"--I was that poster 20 years ago when I hired a landscape architect to do the hardscape and plantings (I can't call my small urban plot a "landscape") for my front yard.

I hope, and I think, that I at least treated him with respect, and I know that he was one of the more pleasant and competent contractors that I have hired over 25 years of renovation and DYI. The bones of his work are still the basis for my gardens and I learned quite a bit from him, as I try to do with all contractors.

And his plan did come pretty close to the mark of being maintenance free.

It's ironic that I have just come from reading a thread in another forum on how dreadful airline employees are to passengers. Post after post detailed how horrid NastyAir was, and how the poster would never, ever travel via that airline again.

So- I had to put in my experiences, gathered over a number of years of flying both domestically and internationally. I have never encountered a rude airline employee or TSA agent. Do I think that I inspire some sort of automatic courtesty that such people would not grant to others? .....not really.

So what's going on here? Someone in that same thread said "The trouble with people is that they only see their own needs." True, and probably inevitable with many individuals, given human nature. And I think the same principle applies in this thread. Selfish, even deceptive people you will always have with you.

On the other hand, it always needs to be somewhat clear when the complimentary part of the service stops and the meter starts running. My son works as a hotshot IT consultant. He can be shooting the breeze with someone at a customer's site over a cup of coffee, but the minute someone says "How about problem X?" he says "That's billable, you know." And he bills $375 / hour, minimum 1 hour. Fair's fair.

Notes: 1) I have never, and do not now work for an airline, in an airport, or any entity involved with the airline industry. 2) From the above, I exempt contractors doing assessments / estimates. They know going in that what transpires may or may not result in them getting a job. Likewise (obviously!) anyone advertising "Free Consultations" in the hope of getting calls. But I've talked to enough contractors who've done work for us to know that there is some very strange animal life out there, and they will assume that contractors are some species of lackey, don't need to be paid promptly, etc., just as this thread outlines.