Basically it's now one space and a re-do of the entry into liv room-easy. However,with thoughts shifting to the bath-you had two-now one...it's not that per se,but the one has a winding path to get to it. Wasn't that your dislike about your original layout? I'm not too ecstatic about the plan ;I have dealt with long narrow living spaces:they present challenges.You will have two of them. You have a lovely home, I'm not sure this plan does it justice....just my gut reaction.

I might shorten up the north/south axis of the perimeter and of the island a bit, since the table is right there, and create a more formal, if vestigial, separation of the eating area from the kitchen. It need only be a wide open doorway that is no more than a bit of header on the ceiling and a bit of wall on each side to *indicate* that it is two separate rooms and then it won't feel like one long open space because your eye will stop at the ceiling.

I'd probably put more of a doorway on each side of the living room at the north end, because you currently have a series of offset truncated walls that make a connect the dots diagonal through the house.

Could you put a powder room at the bottom of the basement steps?

Yay! That's exciting news that you have an architect to work with now. : )

One suggestion for the plan as you have it drawn now is to put a prep sink in the island. It's a long haul from the fridge to the sink, and with the busy family that you have, 2 sinks in the kitchen would be wonderful.

I'm wondering if you'd want an informal seating area in your old dining room (I'm thinking soft, comfy couchlike seating), and then make the living room the formal dining space. Although, that would make everyday meals more of a challenge.... hmmmmmmm

thanks for the feedback so far, it is so appreciated!
herbflavor, the route to the bathroom is a bit longer, but we use that bathroom often right now, without issue (our current powder room toilet has some "issues" so we have gotten in the habit of not using it regularly.) It's not at all a winding path, and it works fine for us. Also, our phase 2 of this project is adding on a master suite upstairs, and that will give us another bath. SO we will still have 3 full baths. I will not put one in the basement--we've had issues with flooding in previous houses, and we swore we'd never do that again!

palimpsest, I am considering shortening up the kitchen part of the room, making it all a bit shorter. I just don't want to lose the storage. I do agree that a way to *indicate* it is 2 separate spaces is just what I am hoping for. Trying to find photos to help my DH understand what I mean.

An archway:

[

[traditional kitchen design[(https://www.houzz.com/photos/traditional-kitchen-ideas-phbr1-bp~t_709~s_2107) by other metros design-build Witt Construction

or some columns? like this but smaller, less obtrusive? With storage below?

Also thinking maybe a different ceiling treatment? Like a coffered ceiling perhaps?

I really have no idea what might work best.

Also, we do have a doorway from the LR to the FR, just a wide opening with casing all around. I thought we'd just try to mimic that on the LR to kitchen side as well. Here is photo of it, although the FR has since been renovated.

laughable, yes, it is exciting! And he was so excited! HE has worked with homes like ours before, I guess they are more common in chicago's north shore. He feels great possibilities and has great ideas! His enthusiasm is
contagious, and he's been doing this for 20+ years!

I considered a prep sink in the island, but I like the idea of the uninterrupted surface. I feel like an island prep sink would turn into a water-play zone for the next 5 years! Also, I feel like my prep area actually will be near the sink and range, in that corner or on that end of the island anyway. As for the eating area, I think we will keep it to our current DR area, and keep our LR as an LR. It works for us :)

Here is how to modulate a space without making a separate room, or in my case make it "Much Smaller than the other kitchens". I'll explain in a minute.

Here is the before of my kitchen:

Here are the afters:

The "before" kitchen was a single entry, closed off space with no counterspace except a corner and over the DW.

In the After, the fridge is where the old door was and the front side of the island (facing us) is where the wall was.

I intersected the kitchen with the archway to suppress it and put it in the location of an old sleeping alcove or dressing area. The island, the refrigerator and a certain amount of floor space are "outside" the kitchen visually, but are still a part of the footprint.

It has been perhaps too successful, because a number of people who have looked at this unit and others have said this kitchen is "so much smaller" It's not: it's about the same size or slightly larger, and is not a complete dead end. The footprint is not what people notice though, they just notice the archway. The archway cuts into a little elbow room on the fridge side and nothing on the other side. That door is in front of the stack W/D and not really in the way at all.

So even the most minimal of wall and ceiling interrupted and maximal arch opening will denote "two rooms"

Home- I'm wondering...what is the architect suggesting? Isn't he going to come up with a plan for you...and then we'd be looking at his plan? If it were a draftsmen, then I could see you trying to come up with a plan you like, but I'm curious to see what the architect suggests.

Also, how much does he think it will cost to move the stairs and rebuild them? That can be expensive, not to mention the loss of the powder room and opening up the walls, between the dining room, current stairs and kitchen.

Don't get me wrong...I think you've come up with a good possibilty and it's probably my favorite so far. But, that being said...if you're paying an architect, part of that fee is to see what his ideas are and what he would suggest...and what the cost would be to move everything versus adding on and making a bigger kitchen. I hope he comes up with some things none of us at GW have even considered! :)

And, since my farmhouse is over 100 years old...I've looked into this. Tearing open walls and moving stairs, etc. may uncover a bunch of potential problems that adding on will not. I'm planning to do both...so I'm sure I'll have all kinds of surprises(!) but just one more thing to consider.

I like it a lot, especially the generous, gracious flow that's developing, plus making the back entry very functional and yet still keeping the kitchen open to the the back garden.

My big suggestion was what you and Palimpsest have been discussing: Framing a large, handsome opening between the dining table space and the kitchen/dining space. Obviously, that's a winner. That way they will remain open to each other but the doorway will underline the different functions of the two dining areas and separate moods can be created for each space. (Also, all those stools and chairs won't seem like big seating overkill in one space).

As usual, I definitely agree with keeping kitchen creep under control and allowing the dining room to be beautiful and fully functional and appropriate to its setting in your home.

My one question is whether you need to build in effectively one furniture arrangement in the family room. I've always loved built-ins, but these days I think a lot of plans go too far. You lose a great deal of flexibility in a large room that should be able to multifunction as your needs change. In that respect, the FP placement is also very limiting.

In any case, it's so nice to see this coming along as it is.

lavender, yes! He will certainly be making his own suggestions and drawing up what I hope will be a spectacular, brilliant and earth-shattering plan for our space. But, in reality, he was describing what he *thought* he would be suggesting to us, to give us an idea, and I said it sounded very much like what I had already sketched up myself. So, I printed out my sketch and we conversed about it in some detail. He showed me things that I hadn't thought of and things that I had no idea about (as I have zero training or experience, only amateur interest and living experience). So, We'll see what he comes up with in another week or 2, but for now, I am considering what I have and what I expect. I'd like to be able to thoughtfully respond to what I have and what he suggests, too.

As an aside, he says he loves kitchen designing, so we'll see what his suggestions are on that front :)

Rosie and Palimpsest, yes, I am feeling quite good about the use of architectural elements to define the two spaces, rather than walls. I think the arch is a great example of this. (I saw a great example, using photoshop. An open kitchen, with a peninsula separating the kitchen from the DR. Then photoshopped in, a simple double arch near the ceiling, over the peninsula, and the space became two rooms.

We already have 3 arches in our ceiling in our foyer area, not to mention our arched telephone nook and our arched built-in shelves in the LR, so I think this is a logical way to connect the new space to the existing:
From front door into house:

from powder room toward front door:

Oh, and Rosie, that FR is already built-in with cabinetry and 2 walls and a FP in the corner. It is limiting, somewhat, but we love it. The window seat and bookshelf are more permanent, but the entertainment unit is take-apart-able and movable, if we so desire down the road.

Home- I'm so glad! I just wanted to make sure you weren't responsible for the overall plan...and I completely understand what you mean about wanting to be able 'to thoughtfully respond' which is why I've been trying to learn more about general construction. I have no plans to do any of my own remodeling, but I would like to have some idea of the process...to see if they're doing it correctly :)

You know, I'm still not sure what the living room is 'for' at this point. Is it a second seating area, a second dining area, a very pretty walkway to the family room? It's such a great location...I'm wondering if there's anyway the architect can give you one alternative, with the kitchen in the current living room space? I know you tried that before, but the basement stairs were still cutting up the other side of the house.

Now, if you put a combination 'living room/dining room' on the left of the entry...the dining room table (and maybe a buffet) would overlook the basement stairs and windows. You could even add a fireplace on the long outside wall...maybe gas? Then the current living room could be the kitchen and have much closer access to the family room. If you had the island for seating...the dining room table would be just across the hall and the family room would be just beyond the doorway.

Since you're changing the house quite a bit already (taking down walls and moving french doors, etc.) I wonder if the architect could come up with a way to use the window in front for the sink...and maybe take out those french doors from the entry (put a bench there, instead?) and move the entrance to the kitchen further back...across from the stairs. I'd take out the fireplace too...and have the one in the living/dining room, instead. Just another idea.

with the kitchen in the middle as Lass outlined,uyou could create an entry from the kitchen side into the long laundry/bath setup,even with some pantry space.Then close off the laundry/bath entry from family room which will free you for many more furniture placement choices in the family room. It will make the family room seem much larger.

You're getting good advice about maintaining and separating the dining room space. However, even with those adjustments, the fridge is a long way from the sink, and with a family, who presumably will one day work in the kitchen with you, a prep sink would be quite valuable in this plan. Even when I work in my kitchen alone, my prep sink is priceless. The proximity to the fridge and stove is just one aspect. I enjoy NOT working with food over dirty dishes. I enjoy that baking and cooking workers can work separate of the cleanup tasks. Placed as mine is, on the corner of the island, it is usable and easily accessible to the cook (prep, filling and emptying pots), the baker (adding water to recipes, washing gooey hands), snackers, dog's water dish filler, and just hand washers.

If anything, I just wish I'd gone bigger with that sink. I have a sink that's approx 14 by 16 inches an island that's 4 ft by 5 ft. I think that in an island of about 8 ft, like you show, it'd leave you LOTS of clear work space and offer you vital function.

Agreed. You'd need roller skates to cook in the current plan because the sink and fridge are so far apart. Worse, the lack of a prep sink on the island makes it a 100% one-cook kitchen, whereas a prep sink would allow it to easily support two.

Whoops. I should have looked at the old plan. Plus, you love it as it is, so once again you're maximizing your outcome by keeping what's right for you. Your house is very pretty.

And, BTW, it's really nice that your home will welcome you guys with the inviting entry you deserve. After all these decades it still amazes me to see the lonely elaborate foyers included in hundreds of thousands of new homes where the owners' main entry is actually something more akin to a back-alley/servants area. (!) This is also going to be "right."