10" pull-out. It's easier to pull out the whole unit then to open double pantry doors and pull out drawers. You see everything at a glance. It has a heavy duty, soft-close glide in the base.

Here it is on its maiden voyage--moving back into the kitchen. There's only two of us and we're not big on Costco. But we do love Trader Joe's! The top shelf is cereal boxes. Second shelf is canned and boxed food. Third shelf is pasta and rice. Last two shelves are household goods--light bulbs, trash bags. Baking supplies, oils and anything bottled are in a 28" wall cabinet. I have a spice drawer and under that a deep bread and snack food drawer. That's where Trader Joe's goes. It might be handy to have a drawer like that for your teens.

Do you think 2 18" pantries is enough? I remember my parents having a 24" pantry with roll-outs for our family of 3 (yes, I'm an only), and then they still had extra canned goods tucked away in the laundry room. I think you might need extra pantry space, in all honesty, especially if you are buying large quantities at Cosco. Could you make it work? Certainly. But it could be tight, or it could mean frequent trips to the store.

I encourage you to read up on prep sinks here if you haven't yet. No pressure. ; )

Wow may! Thanks for the photo, I can tell your kitchen is really beautiful! I like the idea of pulling the whole unit out, and it seems to hold a lot. Even if I get a door/rollout one, at least the smaller size will have only one door. It seems it may be annoying to have to open 2 doors each time. Oh, and I do love the idea of a trader Joe's drawer!!
Laughable, you're right, it would be nice not to have to store extras in the garage. About the prep sink...you'll have to sell me on that one! I can't picture putting 2 sinks so close to each other:S

All right, I'll try to give you some advantages:

1. Virtually everything you do in the kitchen requires water
-making tea
-washing dishes
-washing hands
-filling pots for pasta, oatmeal, soup
-draining pots
-water for making baked goods
-water for getting goopy, sticky, uncooked baked goods off of hands
-drinks
-filling pet water bowls
-kids washing out paintbrushes or cleaning up other artsy projects
-watering plants
-rinsing veggies for salad
-getting water for simmering or MWing veggies
-getting raw meat juice off of hands
-rinsing out recyclable containers
-kids' science projects

All of these things add up to a fair amount of congestion at the sink x 8 people plus guests. A prep sink helps ease the congestion. It takes your kitchen from a one person functioning kitchen to a multi-person functioning kitchen with less clogging of work at the sink. It lets you get something done in the kitchen while someone else does something else that needs water without having to cross paths or bump into each other nearly as much. Someone can be filling the dishwasher and washing up dishes while another person is making a meal or snack. All of the listed items above can now be divided between the 2 sinks.

We had 2 sinks in our previous kitchen and we frequently had people using both sinks at the same time. We still sometimes had a line-up of people waiting to get to the water source. Now, pre-reno, in our current kitchen we have 1 sink. It's the major traffic jam in our kitchen because we all need access to it all day long. Yes, it works for us. Well, we make it work, but we are really, really looking forward to having 2 sinks again!

Also, are you planning for a super single sink, in other words a 33" single basin sink? There are many die-hard lovers of super singles here, and I'm one of them. : ) If you are unfamiliar with these, please read up on them on here before committing to your sink purchase. They are fantastic!

You can use google to do your searches. Simply type "gardenweb kitchen super single sink" or "gardenweb prep sink yay or nay" or some such words to get gobs of info.

Hope this helps.

My parents raised a family of five kids on one 12" pantry cabinet! We ate a lot of canned foods back in the 50s and 60s too!

Sometimes that wall is all pantry and fridge, but what do you do with the microwave? I'm wondering if you could make that base cabinet 21" deep instead of 18", move the island 3", and make the sink aisle 39". Put a bar sink and trash pullout under the microwave to keep the teens out of your prep area? Dishes and silverware would be in the end base and wall cabinet, snacks in the fridge and pantry, so they'd only need to be in that aisle when they are doing the dishes.

Laughable, now I see! It's one of those things that once you've had, you can't imagine living without. Like google:) I can see how it would be very handy. You just may have converted me...

And May you're right, the micro counter would be a great place for that sink, especially if it's a tea station. And a trash pullout would be perfect there. Don't you think 18" will be deep enough for a microwave shelf?

OK, I have another option for the layout! Please see what you think of it. I moved the fridge to comply with ice/water/stone/fire. The meant moving the dishwasher to the other side of the sink. That meant the range door would bang the dishwasher door, so I switched it for a cooktop. Then I put a corner wall oven and one large pantry cab, and the 18" deep micro/tea station.
I know the corner oven hogs space, but it would look nice and flow better.
The island would be the main prep area with a trash pullot, and maybe even a sink;)

Pros:
-nicer looking/wall oven easier to use
-can keep pots under cooktop
-ice water etc for efficiency
-better landing area for fridge
-fridge closer to dining table...if you want to grab ketchup, juice, sriracha etc.

Cons:
-narrow aisle in front of fridge
-cleanup zone is now close to prep zones and cooktop
-fridge eats 3' of counter space

Can't wait to hear your thoughts!

Laughable, now I see! It's one of those things that once you've had, you can't imagine living without. Like google:) I can see how it would be very handy. You just may have converted me...

And May you're right, the micro counter would be a great place for that sink, especially if it's a tea station. And a trash pullout would be perfect there. Don't you think 18" will be deep enough for a microwave shelf?

OK, I have another option for the layout! Please see what you think of it. I moved the fridge to comply with ice/water/stone/fire. The meant moving the dishwasher to the other side of the sink. That meant the range door would bang the dishwasher door, so I switched it for a cooktop. Then I put a corner wall oven and one large pantry cab, and the 18" deep micro/tea station.
I know the corner oven hogs space, but it would look nice and flow better.
The island would be the main prep area with a trash pullot, and maybe even a sink;)

Pros:
-nicer looking/wall oven easier to use
-can keep pots under cooktop
-ice water etc for efficiency
-better landing area for fridge
-fridge closer to dining table...if you want to grab ketchup, juice, sriracha etc.

Cons:
-narrow aisle in front of fridge
-cleanup zone is now close to prep zones and cooktop
-fridge eats 3' of counter space

Can't wait to hear your thoughts!

{{gwi:2137703}}

Your sink and stove walls looked fine before. You don't want a DW in your busy prep corner. The fridge will block the light and access to the sink.

Since you have a deep corner, you want to keep your full depth fridge there. You only need enough room to open the door wide enough to pull out the bins for cleaning, so you could put a narrow broom closet in the corner, allowing you a lot of space to the right of the fridge for microwave and storage. Something like this:

[{{gwi:2137710}}[(https://www.houzz.com/photos/quail-creek-kitchen-transitional-kitchen-toronto-phvw-vp~5941061)

[Transitional Kitchen[(https://www.houzz.com/photos/transitional-kitchen-ideas-phbr1-bp~t_709~s_2112) by Guelph Kitchen & Bath Designers Paragon Kitchens

I have to ask, with the size of your kitchen and your need for storage, why you don't just use one stool at the end of your counter? Is it really too much effort to eat in the dining room mere feet away? Then that wall of cabinets/countertop can be the standard 24" deep instead of 18". It does look awkward to go from a 33" deep fridge to 18" deep cabinets on the same wall.

I think you were better off with the basics of the previous layout.

I might tweak it in this way. I'd put shelves for extra storage on the pantry side of the island, leaving room for one or two stools at the island for a helper or gawkers, but the rest of the folks I'd let sit at the table. The shelves would be 12" deep and could hold oodles of boxes of cereal, crackers, snacks, paper products, basically anything that you'd put in a pantry. I would want doors to cover all this up.

I might put the tea station by the cleanup sink toward the table (if and only if) I needed more pantry space. I really like the tea station idea since we often have big groups of people in our home and would really use this. It would be a great place to park a crockpot to bubble away all day out of the way, or a good place for a bunch of them for when we have potluck meals. But, I'd let storage trump the counter space there if necessary. It might be nice to put doors on this that slide back out of the way. This way, it could be closed and neat when desired, but it could also be open and have a counter for the tea and other small appliances plugged in all the time ready for use.

Remember people often use pantries for more than just food storage. It can also be the parking spot for portable kitchen appliances: crock pots, pressure cookers, rice cookers, food processors, blenders, bread makers, etc. Take into consideration what things you use and where you want them stored.

I'm getting an awful glare off my screen. Sorry about the poor image quality.

Here is a link that might be useful: Here's a post on single sink advantages

This post was edited by laughable on Tue, Jan 13, 15 at 11:54

Maybe I missed it but what do you mean by or what is included in your tea station? I'm a big tea drinker myself.

I have shelves near the micro (not used for tea) where I have a box for tea bags, canisters of loose t ea and a basket of bags of extra loose tea. It is all next to the sink which has instant hot water. My infuser sits on the counter 24/7.

How do you make tea? Just thinking if you put a prep sink by the fridge/mw I would put instant hot water there for your tea. Of course then it limits other uses of the instant hot water. Just an idea.

May, I really like that idea for a broom closet. I was planning to keep my brooms in the garage entry closet around the corner, but having this would free up that closet for other stuff.
About the island seating, I've never had an island before, but I feel like it would be so convenient for quick meals/breakfast, and easier to clean up/wipe down than the dining table would be. Right now, it feels like I'm CONSTANTLY clearing and wiping the table. I hate it. I really do. So my thinking is that the island is easier to clear off, and we'll mainly eat at the dining table when several of us are eating together, which is usually only at supper time, or lunch on weekends.
You're right though, it would look awkward to go from fridge to 18" deep...
Maybe my best bet is small stools that tuck in under the overhang? Or maybe reduce to 3 seats..

Laughable, thanks for drawing that out. That sink looks huge! I'll definitely look into those. I hate washing trays and pots in a tiny sink. Seems like I'll need a bigger sink base cabinet though..
The under island storage is also a great idea if I reduce the seating.

Debra, we drink tea all day...and night too. We use an electric kettle. I've never really heard of instant hot water, but we never liked the taste of hot water from the tap. We always put cold water into the kettle. I had an idea to split the water line behind the fridge, and extend it to the tea station to fill the kettle/coffee pot....kind of like those pot fillers that go over stoves...

I use an electric kettle too. I keep it between the sink and stove because I use it at the stove too. It's filtered water and I can boil it fast and use it for soups, etc. We tried it on the counter between the stove and fridge and that lasted about a week.

As for the broom closet idea--the pantry pull-out felt redundant, and it's not a cheap place holder. Mine was around $1000. But in that deep corner, with a fridge-depth cabinet, you'll need a pull-out. It could be as narrow as 9" or 12" and as tall as your broom and mop. Then your upper cabinet can hold easy-to-access household items like paper towels (6" wide). With a small kitchen, measure everything and know where it's going.

Island seating in a small kitchen--the way I look at it is either people populate the kitchen or food and kitchen supplies. Something's gotta give.

Believe it or not, a super single sink will fit in a standard 36" base cabinet. All I did was draw over your double with a basic single sink shape. But yes, they feel huge and are phenomenal for washing oversized items: cookie sheets, lasagna pans, cooling trays, electric griddles, refrigerator drawers, toddlers, and smallish dogs. : )

Try to pay attention to how many of you are sitting and eating at one time over the next few days. The island may or may not work. You might just be cleaning up *two* eating zones with island seating. ; )

i won't comment on the island as i have never had one.
i have an L kitchen with a long run of cabs where your frig run is. my 2 cents is that i had 30" pantry and hated it. i now have a long unbroken counter used as my baking center. i lost a 30" pantry, 48" of upper and lower cabs but everything fits in the new configuration of 2 30" uppers and drawers, 1 36" upper/lower drawers. drawers are so much more efficient than a pantry and i personally like a counter next to the frig for a landing area.
the other lost storage is see is your uppers could be taller. i have 39" uppers now and the amount of storage over 30" is incredible. 42" would have been better but i have 8ft ceilings so it would have been pushing it if there was any unevenness.
i can say that i do all my prep in the spot between the stove and sink as do many. i do not feel the need for another sink. that is just me. i would not want to prep at an island and walk my food to the stove so the L is great for prep.
btw went from a diagonal corner to an ez reach and it js so much better!

We have a whole house water filter so our tap water tastes fairly good. I can't wait long enough for water to heat. I can barely wait the 3 minutes or more for the tea to steep! I have been known to drink 12 cups a day.

ardcp,

I'm very much intrigued by the idea of using uppers and drawers with a counter instead of a pantry cabinet. You don't find the drawers for storing food stuffs at all awkward? Pictures?

I'm like you in that, "i can say that i do all my prep in the spot between the stove and sink as do many. i do not feel the need for another sink. that is just me. i would not want to prep at an island and walk my food to the stove so the L is great for prep. "

I DO have an island, (no sink), and it's great for buffets and snacks/ quick meals, and extra seating for guests. Even though it's close to sink & range, it just doesn't see that much prep work.

llucy- this is hands down my fave part of the reno...you can see where the yellow paint starts is where my counter ended as the yellow was behind the pantry. i bake a lot and needed more counter space but my kitchen is not wide enough for an island. this long space works fantastically and my mixer never gets put away now that i have tons more space. plus pantries are super pricey so drawers are a bit cheaper.
drawers are awesome! the middle bank holds all my baking stuff minus some baking dishes that are in an upper by the sink.
the 2 30" drawer banks hold all our snacks, crackers, chips...basically anything kids want to get for themselves. all the canned goods, sauces, pasta, oils, etc go in the cabinets above since it is just me that needs access to that stuff. it is so much better than the pullout trays in the pantry where stuff would fall off and get stuck behind. plus in the pantry you had to open 2 doors to pull out the tray so opening a drawer is way easier and nothing falls out.

I don't have an island either, but I did go from a two-level peninsula to a one level, gaining a 40" deep prep counter. It's handy for certain tasks, but most of my prep is still done on the smaller counter between the sink and stove. It's the path of least resistance. I would recommend a deep prep counter even without a water source.

Thank you ardcp.

I am not in a position to reno. I'm collecting ideas for the future. I don't buy in bulk, or have/will have several people living with me, so I know I wouldn't need a large pantry. I think what you have would work better for my 'style'. Thank you so much for sharing your picture.

I did put the diagonal corner cabinet in our kitchen, but I also had lazy Susans made for each shelf. The hardware for them is available in Menards and was about $8.00. A carpenter cut the rounds for me, and I mounted them on every shelf in the cabinet. They were sized so they took up the entire diameter of the shelf. Nothing falls off in the back, and I am able to reach everything on all the shelves.

If the doorway b/w the kitchen and DR is not a busy one you may consider a peninsula there with 2 or 3 seats, instead of an island.

I think this can work better in a crowded house and will give more open areas for prep+cleanup.

{{gwi:2137711}}

{{gwi:2137712}}

{{gwi:2137713}}

I'm so glad I asked...these ideas are all amazing. Sena, thank you so much for the images. That's actually a really cool idea, and I'm going to give it some serious thought. It opens up the kitchen a lot.

Ardcp that is really nice what you've done with your baking centre. Thanks for sharing the pics.

Laughable, that's great news that I can fit the super sink in! I'm going to have to sell that double bowl sink I bought online. I really don't want to wrestle with huge pots and trays again, and I use those a lot! Soooo glad I found out now.

Ok, one more question: the cabinet makers have given this as an option for the pantries:
1) bring the pantries forward so they're flush with the fridge (which is 36" deep)
2) set them 3" behind the fridge
And also put in fillers so the doors swing open easily.

Has anyone done this or seen photos of it? Would it be strange to have the cabinets floating off the wall like that?

While I generally love sena's mock-ups and her out-of-the-box ideas, I think this plan takes a simple kitchen and complicates it. I would prefer to prep with the natural light from the window and the larger sink rather than shift everything to the other wall.

I also think the deep corner is a natural for a fridge. Do you mean that your cab maker will bring the pantries 33" deep, flush with the fridge box? You can't go 36" and open the doors. Are you thinking of just a filler between fridge and wall instead of a cabinet? I like the fridge closer to the doorway to improve the work triangle. It would give you a long wall to design pantry and microwave around. But I'd want 24" base cabinets, or deeper, in which case I'd put the microwave on the counter and use ardcp's drawer storage solution and a trash pull-out.

Yay! I don't think you'll regret selling the double sink and switching to the single. They are soo nice for washing up those oversized items.

Have you considered doing 2 dishwashers? It's not much difference in price between a DW and a 24" base cabinet, if you can spare the storage.

I like Sena's plan. A LOT. It seems more spacious. There's no circling around the island to get work done or to retrieve something from the dishwasher. I might continue the wall cabinets where she put the tea station all the way down to the counter to look like a hutch, then tuck the tea stuff inside. The doors could zoop into the sides of the cabinet when you want to access the tea. Something like this:

[{{gwi:2137714}}[(https://www.houzz.com/photos/total-kitchen-makeover-transitional-kitchen-montreal-phvw-vp~6708979)

[Transitional Kitchen[(https://www.houzz.com/photos/transitional-kitchen-ideas-phbr1-bp~t_709~s_2112) by Montreal Interior Designers & Decorators Wow Great Place

Here isGWer Breezygirl's kitchen with a shot of her hutch cabinet-

Or... tea stuff could go where Sena's currently got the MW drawn in:

[

[Transitional Kitchen[(https://www.houzz.com/photos/transitional-kitchen-ideas-phbr1-bp~t_709~s_2112) by Melbourne Kitchen Designers & Remodelers kitchens by peter gill

Rhome410, another GWer, has a kitchen for her, (can you guess?), family of 10 people. She also has a hutch at the end of her run. See link below.

Here is a link that might be useful: Rhome410's blog post on her kitchen with lots of pics and info

Ok, so I think this is how it will be! Thanks to all for the oodles of ideas! Please let me know if there's anything else I can do to improve. The changes are:

-got rid of the stool in the congested area...keeping 3. Extra storage cab will go where the 4th stool was
-prep sink in island:P
-glass hutch at end of counter, like breezygirl's in the photo above...so pretty!
-single bowl sink (love it already:)
-easy reach in corner
-18" pullout pantry on left of fridge...30" deep
-30" counter with microwave shelf next to fridge...with trash pullout
-30" pantry on end

I think that's it! Let me know if I'm missing anything!
Oh, and the thought crossed my mind to put the fridge at an angle in the corner. I'm not going to, but curious to know if anyone has done this??

I think you've made some really nice improvements for your family's kitchen. : ) It must feel good to be making progress!

Before you commit to the island plan, it would be a good idea to mock up an "island" of that size and try to live with it for a few days to make sure you like it. You could start the island with a folding table as a base. Bed risers are great for raising a table up to counter height, but blocks of wood will work in a pinch. I like the bed risers because they have a lip on them that keeps the table pretty secure even when you lean into it. Or you could even use chairs, cardboard boxes, or whatever you have around that will approximate the size of the island. You can use some tape to tape off the size of the prep sink on top to make sure you like its location, too.

Your island widths are fine for a kitchen used by one person. It's the fact that you have 8 of you milling around in there that might make it feel to cramped. It would be good to know if you are ok with that *before* buying cabinets, installing water lines, and paying for countertop. If it does feel pinchy, claustrophobic, traffic blocking, or overcrowded, then you have Sena's plan to fall back on. : )

Now, let's talk prep sinks for a minute. There is a sweet spot for size. You'll want to find your sweet spot so that the sink is big enough to be useful, but small enough to not overtake your island. A lot of folks find that the bar sink size is too small to really be used for washing vegetables or basically doing anything more than dumping drinks and rinsing glasses.

For both of your sinks, if you have them undermounted with a positive reveal, you'll get some nice advantages. (I credit Bellsom with sharing these ideas with me on my current thread asking about a prep sink in a maple countertop for our island. ) Undermounted means that their is no lip around the edge of the sink on which crumbs and water can get caught. You can simply brush all of those goodies right across the counter and into the sink. A positive reveal means that when you look into the sink, you see the top rim of the sink all the way around the edge of the hole just under the countertop. If you have them installed this way, you can have a cutting board cut to fit on the lip of the sink and inset into the counter. This would give you the option of having more countertop when needed, if wanted. The cutting board could even be made with a cutout for shoving off peelings and cuttings down into the sink.

If you have more questions about sinks you can post a new thread about them. I am by no means an expert on sink reveals. ; )

That's a really wise idea to try live with it first. I wish I could do that but this is a new construction so I can't. I really do regret not making the kitchen wider. I don't think we'll ever build again, but if we do, I'll design the kitchen first, and the rest of the house will be designed around the kitchen!!

When I prepare meals I am the main cook, but I frequently get help from my 16 yr old daughter, and I usually have a few gawkers. All I can do is hope this will work out OK. The gawkers can sit at the stools, and the main cooking triangle area has a 53" aisle, so hopefully 2 cooks can be comfortable in there? Anyone else coming in will probably be grabbing something from the fridge or making tea or grabbing a snack, which is all off to the side.

So I think I'll be OK for meal prep. My main worry is for times like breakfast before school when everyone's zooming around like crazy preparing their own things! I only cook one meal a day. The kids make their own breakfast and lunch,...with my help if they need it, of course.

Other than that, I took the advice I was given to observe our kitchen use over a few days. It is verrrry rare that all 8 of us are in the kitchen at once. Really only at supper time. Other times average maybe 3 or 4 of us....lingering over tea...toasting bagels...making smoothies.

Ok, I just realized I've been babbling trying to assure myself that this will work out. I'll stop now:) actually I should be extremely grateful for what we have. In some parts of the world families of 8 live in homes smaller than our kitchens.

The counter hutch. Seems to me there will be a lot of after-dinner dishes piled on that counter for a family of 8. I would want as much clear counter space as possible in a kitchen this size.

I assume the doorway on the left is the garage. The prep sink is right in your landing zone for groceries. Imagine bringing in bags for eight family members. Where do they go? Likewise, everything that comes out of the fridge is going to land on that end of the island.

I think you need a larger counter than 30" for microwave, tea, and toasting. If you used a 42" counter, you could have your 30" pantry with a 8"-12" deep cabinet butted up to it with doors opening to the dining room. You'd have floor to ceiling height for more storage, a broom closet, or open shelves, and pretty end cabinetry facing the DR.

[{{gwi:2137715}}[(https://www.houzz.com/photos/getting-organized-with-fieldstone-cabinetry-traditional-phvw-vp~4351282)

[Traditional Spaces[(https://www.houzz.com/photos/traditional-home-design-ideas-phbr1-bp~s_2107) by Norfolk Kitchen & Bath Remodelers Absolute Kitchen And Bath

[

[Contemporary Kitchen[(https://www.houzz.com/photos/contemporary-kitchen-ideas-phbr1-bp~t_709~s_2103) by Barrington Architects & Building Designers Kate Marker Interiors

I agree, May, everything from the fridge will land there, and that is the garage entry. Perhaps the prep sink could fit at the tea station if I expand it. And the end cabinet turned sideways is such a great idea! I'm just afraid to add another cabinet onto our quote!
I also see your point about dirty dishes piling on that counter.

ps: all dishes/cutlery will be stored right next to the dishwasher for ease of unloading. Do you think it's inconvenient having dishes so far from the food storage? I can put dishes near the food, but then unloading is annoying...

Do you have a space big enough to make a "play kitchen", just to get a feel for it (in the living room, garage, basement?) I'm sure you could get a few kiddos in on the setup of it. ; ) Then go through kitchen scenarios together to get a feel for it. (You unload the dishwasher while I grab a snack. You make a salad while I make supper. Get out all the smoothie supplies and cups...is it smooth operation? (No pun intended.) Let's pretend we're bringing in the groceries...where do we set them, can we get them put away without difficulty?) And after all that fun, try setting up Sena's and see which one works better for you. (My gut feeling is that her's might be more practical, but hey, you might not know until you try.)

Do you have a cleaning closet and a spot for the broom, dustpan, etc.? Have you ever seen vac pans? They're very cool. If you plan to do a central vac, you can hook up a vac pan which is a dustpan that is built in (easily hidden at the base molding or under the toe kick). Sweep all your crumbs to that spot, give the switch a little kick, and everything is sucked up. No more fighting with a dust pan and all the dirty little escapees that hide under the edge of the dust pan and stick their tongues out at you as soon as you lift the pan off the floor. : )

And you're completely right, no matter what we have soo much to be thankful for!

You've gotten great advice and are well on your way to having a good, functional kitchen design. I just want to say that, yes, all everyday dishes/cutlery should be right next to the DW for loading/unloading ease. There is no reason to have dishes near the food, imho.

If you need to carry large stacks of plates...and with your size family, you probably do...you might find something like this helpful. See link.

Here is a link that might be useful: Plate Organizer/Carrier

And the great ideas just keep flowing! You guys are truly amazing! I will forever picture dust crumbs with tongues whenever I sweep now:) thank you soooo much. Or, to quote the little green aliens on toy story: "we are eterrrrnally grateful!"

PS: Sena's setup is really great, but I really like the idea of having 2 paths of flow in and out of the kitchen....and a semi-straight shot to the garage.

Would you consider a huge island, 69 in front of the range and 87-88 in front of the fridge wall? There'd be some unused part in the middle, but you may minimize it if you have some deeper than 24 cabs.

69 side: 21 sink-30 drawers-15 trash
88 side 24 for trash facing range (can be like laughable is planning to do, opening on 2 sides, 36 sink and DW.

Fridge wall: 21 or 24 wide pantry 39 fridge cab, then cab for MW and 18 deep hutch.

I hope you can read the aisles in the picture.

{{gwi:2137716}}

{{gwi:2137717}}

{{gwi:2137718}}

{{gwi:2137719}}

Just a quick copy and paste rearranging. I would look at having the clean-up area separated from the actual cooking area and make sure you have more than one spot a helper can be (with your size family) and have decent counter space also next to the prep sink. A prep sink without space where you can just do a quick turn to reach the stove seems less than ideal to me.

{{gwi:2137720}}

That's a really cool idea, sena. I don't know if I'd want such a huge island, but you're very innovative...I would have never thought of that. And thanks, lyfia for your idea. I did think of moving the range where you put it, but I can't move the window.

OK, I have ONE MORE idea!! I like to look at all options before deciding. Please see if it might be better than what I currently have. There is a narrow pullout pantry next to the fridge, and I can put a larger one in the dining nook for less frequently used items.

The main downside is that traffic flow to the garage is now convoluted. And, the microwave would have to find a new home.....
(the cabinets along the wall with x's on them will be gone...only green outlined items will remain)

Can you please sketch how the powder room and garage join to the kitchen? I have an idea, but I won't know if it's feasible until I see how the spaces join together.

I changed your Jan 15, 15 at 23:49 layout a bit. See if it can work for you.

Fridge wall: There's a 12" wide pullout, then fridge, then 30" wide MW cab and 36" wide, 15" deep cab.

Island: You have total 48" across the range including 1,5 overhang on each side, so there can be 21" sink cab + 24 drwrs. There'd be a pinch point (35" wide) b/w the island and the 30" cab next to the fridge, after that, aisle increases to 45" and 5' where you have a seat. Two more seats on the short side of the island. The 24" cab across the DW can be deeper than 24.

{{gwi:2137721}}

{{gwi:2137722}}

{{gwi:2137723}}

Sena: I love this idea! Thank you! I like the idea of having 2 of the seats on the end, and I can't believe you made this work with a wider island! You're all so amazingly creative. I also have the option of reducing that microwave counter to 18" deep to relieve the pinch point. And if I keep the narrower island, and keep only 2 seats, I can have much wider aisles. I feel like I have so many more options now. Thank you!

Laughable: I have attached our floor plan, although there have been some changes made to it, the garage/powder room/sunroom area remains the same. We had a very challenging lot to work with.

PS: what's drawn in as a dining room is actually a library, and the woodstove has moved out of the dining nook, and is now a fireplace on the family room wall.

Oh, that is going to be such a wonderful house for you and your family!!!

My idea was to move the doorway from the kitchen up closer to the wall of the library room so that you could have a long walkway with storage in the wall between the library and kitchen. But, it makes the rest of the kitchen a bit squishy. Meh.

I like the improved layout Sena just drew for you better! A 48" wide island has lots of space to get work done! Looks great!

I like the sink and stove wall, I like the island, but there's something about the microwave stuck between the fridge and pantry that feels off to me. It feels very congested along that wall--too many activities. I wonder if you could put a microwave drawer in the island. Then the island becomes the landing spot instead of installing a counter just for that on the fridge wall. Then that wall could be all pantry.

Practigal suggested a tea station in the dining room. You've suggested a pantry, so there must be room for cabinets and counter. Can you extend plumbing there? If not, how often do you refill your kettle?

Thanks laughable!

May, I like the idea of a microwave drawer, but I just saw the prices!!yikes!!! Are they made of gold? I could give up the tea station and just have pantries....but I think the way Sena has it drawn in not sure if the island will be a good landing spot for the fridge. ??

And I do have plenty of extra space in the nook. I could put a big pantry there. I'd rather have the tea closer to the kitchen though. To ease the congestion in that area, I could just put tea supplies on the main counter, and have that wall just fridge and microwave...

Couldn't you just set up a tea station on the nook wall adjacent to the kitchen? I can't tell how deep that corner is, but it's only steps away from the sink.

Maybe what you save on not having countertop on the fridge wall can go to the MW drawer. Might make a difference in the number of slabs you need to buy.

Oh, that nook wall!! I thought you meant the opposite end. That would have been perfect, except that there is a tall, narrow window (20" x 72") on the side of bumpout. And the large window in the nook is a 3-panel sliding patio door.

You're right about saving $$ on countertop though, I never thought of it that way....

I'll mull over the microwave for a while...I'm sure it will find a home. I'm feeling much better about the general layout now....thanks to all of you:)

Could you just put a little buffet server, cart, or console table in front of the corner window? I'd be nice to have one with a drawer for tea.

"Could you just put a little buffet server, cart, or console table in front of the corner window? I'd be nice to have one with a drawer for tea."
What a cute idea, May. I like it. : )

Eureka...it's a library sharing a wall with the kitchen?! As in walls lined with bookshelves? Then you could recess the fridge into that wall and conceal the bump into the library with the shelves. Pinch point be gone!

That is a really lovely idea, may! And the middle panel of the door is the one that slides, so that would work! A cute tea cart with wheels:)

Laughable, pinch point be gone would be so nice!! I did ask the framers to recess the fridge and they said it would be too difficult!! I don't know why. But that's an amazing idea to conceal it with built in bookshelves!! I love that so much:) you know what, I'm going to ask our contractor right now if he can get someone else to recess it. What a great idea!

There, I did it. I asked again. We'll see what he says tomorrow.

You are so proactive. That's great! : ) I hope they'll figure out how to do it. Many GW kitchens have had recessed fridges, so it can be done.

I forgot to mention that there are mw drawers on ebay. They're still not cheap, mind you, but they are a teeny bit more reasonable, perhaps.

Here is a link that might be useful: mw drawers on ebay

Recessing the fridge is easy. It's pretty much the same as framing for a door or window. I can't imagine any GC or his framing subs being unable to do it. Probably takes an extra 15-20 minutes over regular wall framing.

You will need to give them exact placement measurements so they know just where to create the recess.

I think they're just being lazy.