The tree is in good shape and is about 25 to 30 years old. It is a clump of four trees.

About 12 feet from this tree is another birch tree. I would love to cut this tree down, but city rules do not allow! So this tree at least 17 feet away or more from the area I want to dig in.

It is a different kind of birch tree and not as healthy.

I have a treed lot and there doesn't seem to be any good place to dig, and I am desperate to plant! What are your thoughts about this area?

I suppose I knew what would be said. The tree has these roots for a purpose. I have lived in my house for over 30 years, but have only been very interested in gardening in that last five years or so. If it's not these birch trees, then I've got huge maple trees and an old cedar hedge. So pretty much no where is a good place to garden.

I thank you for your comments Bill. I will take care of the tree and its roots. I may cut one if it would make planting easier, but otherwise will refrain from doing so. I think I will plant into the gaps. I am hoping that there will be less roots as I go further along in this particular bed.

What shows in your picture, are the surface roots. What's not showing is the thick, deep mass of fibrous roots that this type of tree makes to take advantage of any water that penetrates the soil. I've never tried to plant under this type of tree but there should be a lot of information about this in the gardening sections of these forums. I would think frequent watering of plants growing under a Birch or Maple would be a necessity. Good Luck! :-)

I grew a bed under river birch for about ten years. The problem was when things get dry and you irrigate the tree goes 'Oh wow, new water opportunities' and the roots get more and more concentrated in that area. Then the plants have to compete more and more...and the tree will win.

The best advise I can give is (what was given before mostly) A) find another spot. or B) adapt your garden to woodland plants that normally grow under trees. If you want suggestions for B, please ask. I'm sure between all of us, we can give a nice list.

That however means that hostas probably are out...for the long run. Though your mileage may vary.

d, I thought the same thing. More water = more roots.

A really tough spot you have there nhl.

some suggest the root mass is twice.. and maybe 3 times what you see above ground ... removing this rather minor amount of roots is insignificant.. imo ....

but the problem is.. consistent with the above mentioned ..... is that every root your sever.. the tree will respond with new ... water aggressive feeder roots .... especially if when you water your new plants.. you water only the hole the plant was in .... where do you think the roots will grow??? .. in the new hole .... and never fert anything in the same hole.. for the same reason ...

i am wondering more about the fact that your tree looks telephone poled ... i wonder where the root flare is ...

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=root+flare&t=ffcm&iar=images&iax=images&ia=images

birch is not a favored tree in the hosta world .... and now you know why ... but what you have there now.. is looking good.. so you must be doing something right ....

ken

" ... removing this rather minor amount of roots is insignificant.. imo .... "

My thoughts too.

Birches work as garden trees for about 15 years and then after that they are too big and rooty to garden under or around much. Try to find someplace else to plant, where the birch tree is not so close.

All of the birches you show have paper birch bark, the one with that dead rotten section near the ground is definitely having a problem - if that is added soil held in place by rocks we are seeing in your picture that could be what happened to the trunk.

Anyway this species is everywhere in the north, I have to wonder about these city rules that you are making it sound like prohibit removal of any and all trees on private property - if you have not read a printed copy of the relevant ordinance maybe you should. If nothing else there could be some kind of exception clause, that you could for instance invoke to remove the damaged birch - I find it very unlikely that any municipality would tell property owners they cannot cut down hazard or otherwise failing trees.

I can't believe that my lengthy response has just disappeared before I was able to submit. I am so frustrated! I will have to rewrite it later today as my time is up for now! Sorry.

Rushing off to buy more Hosta?

Very funny, Embothrium! Does sound like a good idea though!

So it seems the consensus is that removing these roots, or some of these roots, will have an affect on the tree. It is not clear as to whether removal of all of the roots would have a negative impact. If roots are removed, I can expect that the tree may suffer, but without a doubt, it will be aggressive in its root growth to compensate for the loss.

I would find another area to garden in if I had a better one.

Native plants have been suggested. But my love is with hostas and, as my mother-in-law used to say, "where there is a will, there is a way!"

I think I have decided to remove one, if not two, roots at most. I will initially plant some small hostas with some of them in small spin out bags. We can see what next year brings. When it comes to gardening, I have learned is that one can never really count on one's plan coming to fruition.

My hope is that as I move further away from the tree, I will find less roots. But I am not counting on that! As I have found my passion in garden, my property has been a disappointment and a struggle in many ways. But so far I have been up for the challenge.

Bill, you mentioned frequent watering is required under birch and maple trees. So true! The area becomes bone dry so quickly.

dbarron, I agree that the roots of the birch are very clever. They just know where the moisture is. So watering just the plants doesn't work. We know that now, but we didn't know it in the early stages of growth of this tree. But hostas are not out for the long run! No way!

"A really tough spot you have there nhl." Thank you Bill. I gladly accept some empathy in this situation!

Ken, I won't forget---water and fertilize the tree along with the plants! I am not sure why you were "wondering more about the fact that your tree looks telephone poled ... i wonder where the root flare is ..."

Embothrium, birch trees work with gardens for 15 years! Wish I know that before! As for the other birch tree that appears damaged, I am not so sure that it was the added soil that caused stress to this tree. That tree was mature when we purchased the house 35 years ago. I think it is an aging tree and the ice storm we had several years ago broke some of its branches and stressed it out.

"I find it very unlikely that any municipality would tell property owners they cannot cut down hazard or otherwise failing trees." First of all, the city hires its own workers and they remove city trees on personal property. I don't believe the city considers this tree a hazard. They might consider it a failing tree, but they will not remove it until the decline is more advanced. And when that day comes---get this---I must replace the tree and choose from a limited list of trees of similar size! Those are the rules!

Thanks all. You've be very kind to share your thoughts and knowledge.

Hee, then use the other approach, inject the aging tree with a lethal cocktail and cause it to die before planting.

Replace with something with very deep root systems (versus shallow like the birch)

Or another option, move away from such planting nazis and buy a house where you can do as you will. I sure would.

They're all paper birch. Removing a few roots will be a waste of time and effort, the tree will still produce the same tough conditions in that spot right under it with or without a couple roots out of an entire root system.

Outside of desert environments - where the upper zone of soil is too hot, dry and bare for it most of the time - all trees concentrate the majority of their roots near the surface, where the air and organic litter are. The thing about birches is they produce particularly dense mats of small roots that suck up all of the water and nutrients beneath them. (Maples - another genus of trees frequently seen in cold climates - do this also). The bigger a given specimen gets, the harder trying to garden under them becomes.

You would likely cause more damage to those roots exposing them and leaving them as such right now. Did you cover them back up?

Think of b&b plants. You cut the roots and they regenerate dense feeder roots.

Birch is among the most difficult plant to garden under as it has a dense shallow fibrous root system.

Better off planting shallow rooted drought tolerant plants in the gaps.

As I said, Whaas :) Agree...otherwise, you're fighting all the time.

Gardens are better being in harmony, vs constant conflict.

dbarron, lethal injection? Sounds tempting! I most certainly will choose a tree with a deeper root system. Hopefully there will be one from the choices we have. Moving, not so easy. I say I want to live in the city, but husband says out of the city. We can't agree.

Embothrium, all paper birch. I didn't know that! Thanks! I'm not removing any of the roots in that area. I will work with them. You say all trees have surface roots because that is where the nutrients and air are. Makes sense. What I hadn't thought of was this: "The bigger a given specimen gets, the harder trying to garden under them becomes." Darn, wish I had realized that earlier!

whaas, no I hadn't covered up those roots. But I did today!

dbarron, "Gardens are better being in harmony, vs constant conflict." Yes, I hear you. But right now I have the strength to choose something different. But it will only be a matter of time and I won't be able to keep up. If I don't take the opportunity now, I may never have at least part of what I enjoyed in my garden.

Each spring I become sad knowing that I can't really garden the way I would like to. And then the plants begin to grow and my spirits pick up.

My husband will build three raised garden planters for me. I suppose they won't do our sugar maples any good either.