Hi Pat.

I use hot water in the main wash. After I've done a pre-wash with warm water, so I don't set the stains. Yes, hot water will set the stains.

Technically hot water may set protein stains, such as blood, meat etc. However, hot water relaxes fibers and allows for a deeper clean. Using a good dose of percarbonate will take care of anything that may be set.

It really depends on the type of fabric, type of soiling and color. All my whites get a 170F wash, rarely a prewash.

Lower temperatures (within reason) and dark colors benefit from enzymes.

Denim, perm press and household linens (think couch covers or blankets) get 85 or 105F wash, with a long enough cycle to ensure proper biological action.

i knew that

Profile washes help prevent set stains along worh proper stain pre-treatment and a goid detergent with oxygen bleach.

profile washes start cool and slowly warm the wash water.

All that said, a quick check of garment your dont want to accidntly set a stain will usually prevent that from happening. Towels that no one sees that get mixed with undergarments always get washed at 60C (140F) or above in this house.

There is a difference between stain removal and germ removal with temperature and deterget. Germ removal is cool/warm temp water requiers chlorine bleach. Not all texiles handle chlorine bleach well. Most can handle warmer temps if they have been properly prewashed and preshrunk. Cheap clothing or animal protein based clothing(wool, cashmere cashmere, mowhair, etc.) will most likely shrink in hot water.

Underwear needs hot water too, however the elastic does weaken from hot water. Some washing machines have longer cycles and will clean just as good using a good detergent and warm water. Drying in the dryer also sanatizes.

Towels, sheets, whites, colored socks and underwear, lights, and certain synthetics.

Years ago I switched to cool water (eco-warm/65°F) and Tide or Persil liquid for everything.

Underwear lasts sooo much longer without the heat! I also dry on extra low. And jeans stay darker for much longer. Well worth the financial savings of not replacing clothes so often and having to throw out favorite clothes it in my opinion.

If I was worried about killing germs, rather than washing them away, I would consider something like Oxiclean Sanitizer on my underwear (which all synthetic and shouldn't fade from oxygen bleach) rather than damaging them with heat. I'm not a fan of quat based sanitizers like Lysol laundry sanitizer

But at 65 degrees towels would regain an odor after just a few uses so I started washing them on the sanitize cycle and they stay smelling fresh forever.

If I didn't want to use that much heat, I would a oxygen bleach with an activator - so either Tide with Bleach powder or Tide Ultra Oxi powder, Oxiclean sanitizer, Clorox 2 pacs or powder.

65ºF is far too cold. It's a crime to consider it 'eco-warm'. That is actually eco-cold!!! Enzymes really will not have enough time to act on stains since they will not have little activity (think about bacterial growth and temperatures). 75ºF I can understand. You would be shocked at the difference in performance between those two temperatures!

I do agree, however, that darker clothes last significantly longer when they are dried on a lower temperature and washed on one as well, though we frequently have issues with deodorant stains with our black/dark items because of it.

Tide keeps advertising their cold water detergent. I could never not use warm or hot water for all but the most delicate of things. Even if the product is designed to clean laundry I would still think that it would begin to leave residue on the outer tub.

Yeah, it is absurd to call 65°F eco-warm but it's what my washing machine calls it so I included the name. I personally call it cold or cool.

It works for me. Natural-ish and budget detergents didn't work at that temp - e.g. synthetic underwear and workout clothes could smell if they got wet, and all shirts could smell after months in storage, I believe from body oil that wasn't removed - but top of the line ones do and I only use detergents that don't leave much scent so it's not just my nose being deceived by fragrances.

I would imagine washing towels on sanitize and the machine's self clean cycle every 40 cycles handles detergent residue. I have never had any machine odors but living in a very dry climate and leaving the door open would prevent mold/mildew odors I think.

Hot water laundry depends more on which temperature any brand and model of washing machine allows HOT to be. In many, that is 100°F, and I have to remember that when people talk about washing on the hot setting.

Our FL washer has an internal heater, so knowing the exact temp for every setting helps owners make better washing temp decisions decisions. I dread the day it has to be replaced because not many machines do that. COLD on our machine is always 86°F. Bed sheets get washed on hot (140°F).

>>>"Yeah, it is absurd to call 65°F eco-warm . . ."<<<

>>>"COLD on our machine is always 86°F"<<<

Adding to that point, Code of Federal Regulations, Title 16, Part 423, Appendix A, "Glossary of Standard Terms", § 1(d):

" 'Cold' - initial water temperature up to 86 degrees F [30 degrees C]."

Same thing for the various international fabric care tags: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laundry_symbol

There is basically a disconnect between the temperatures contemplated for fabric care instructions, on the one hand, and, on the other, current fashions in the design of automatic temperature controls for many washers. In a lot of the modern discourse, we seem to have swapped the supposed virtuousness of cold showers for cold laundry. :>)

>>>"Not sure I can stop washing sheets and towels in hot water, but I'm beginning to re-think the need for hot water in washing underwear. Have you changed your thinking about using hot water?"<<<

While I'm generally doing what Dadoes described in his response to your post, I've changed my thinking a bit. But (and there's always a "but" isn't there?) its mostly in (a) how I think about how "hot" the hot wash should be and (b) the kind of underwear I'm washing.

With my rig, hot can be set any where from 120°F on up to 160°F. When I suffered through a bout of foot fungus --- turns out to be one of the banes of getting old --- I was washing cotton socks as hot as I could get the water. A large-scale israeli medical study from 2011 found that 140°F washes with oxy-bleach and hot dryers (or the equivalent of line drying under the Israeli sun) would pretty much wipe out tinea infestations. Worked for me but definitely not helpful to the elastic in the socks.

With bed sheets, I found even 140°F tends to cause un-removable creasing in hems in current bedlinens. (There is a long running thread here on that subject, btw; seems that a large factor in the creasing is the current weaving patterns combined with the greatly increased use of short-staple cottons.)

For underwear, I've found it more complicated. Plain white cotton generally gets washed hot up to about 140°F with oxy bleach which eventually kills the elastic along with any ordinary worrisome bugs. Haven't had to deal with clostridium difficile or any of the more exotic pathogens.

However, when it comes to "performance underwear" --- wicking and performance fabrics --- the hot washes pretty much destroy them and hot drying wrecks them . So far with not being subjected to the indignities of unfortunate gastro-intestinal incidents, I've been washing them in warm water (around 100° - 105°F) and line drying them in full sun. This so far (knocking on wood) has avoided that other bane of elderly existence which is tinea fungus spreading up the legs ("ringworm") and to the crotch area (tinea cruris). My doc tells me that it is quite common for tinea to spread upwards simply by pulling one's pants over one's infected bare feet. Yikes!

I believe what has made a major impact is the afore mentioned ATC. Prior to that invention and later regulation users primarily relied on their water heater setting to provide acceptable hot water. My first front load had ATC as an optional selection but I never used it. My next FL was completely ATC. Now I have a Speed Queen that gets its Eco rating with an optional Normal cycle that has a spray rinse rather than an agitated deep one. I have the WH that services the washer set very high so I can get a decent tub of hot water, which works for our needs.

Like Dorey mentioned earlier, there are certain things I don't want to wash in hot water to keep them from fading. I try and gather those things together so they can be washed in lukewarm water with like items. Of course I don't mean underwear of any description, but outer garments that we like and would rather not have to replace.

I know a washer having an internal heater is very desirable, but the time to heat the water added to the already long cycles does not work for me, but I acknowledge it is very ideal to other people.

"Eco-Warm" is more or less just a term from the manufacturer but is very poor to make the consumer think they are having a 'cool' wash when it is actually cold. I just can't stand how consumers are not fully aware of the temperature they are selecting anymore, unless they look for ATC details in the manual or service manual.

I am a firm believer in using hot washes for underwear, socks, sheets, and towels because of fungal and bacterial infections. My brother played hockey for 15 years and never had Athlete's Foot (Tinea pedis). Why? He switched socks daily and they were always washed in hot and dried on medium or higher. Even if there is some remaining bacteria or fungus, the amount of it remaining that could start an 'infection' is low enough the risk is very low.

I have had to deal with C. difficile in our household, but the average person, and one that is not on strong antibiotics, will not have to worry about it at that time. Though, my Step Dad did nearly have his hand amputated because he was changing the pump from his washer and it cut his hand slightly. He was on antibiotics for 6 months. Source of bacteria? Clothes, water, cold water washing, etc.

It's unfortunate that many new washers nowadays that can provide a full tap-hot fill do so only on the heaviest cycle selection, longest wash time, highest fill level, etc. There also may be an unreasonable limitation on choices between eco-whatever temperatures and the maximum tap-hot, or a sanitize selection on machines with an onboard water heater. It's often an unreasonable "all or nothing."