Who made the plan for you?

Parts of the big idea I like. For example, I like the kids space upstairs but I’m not sure the closets are usable as is. I also like the bath layout, we have similar, but would recommend a pocket door on the interior to save space. I also like that it’s not a deep house but it’s a very long rectangular box.

Something about Tue facade isn’t amazing to me. It might be the double balcony on the front. Makes it look like too much to me, I’m not a designer, so my lingo is weak.

I also feel like the kitchen could be better overall. But I’ll leave layout to the pros.

Good idea on the pocket door - we had considered the closets upstairs may not be completely functional and wanted to look into that as well.

Kids space upstairs can be great ... but not when it is over the master suite!

Switch His master closet with the master bathroom, so you can have a window in the master bathroom.

The elevation made me think it would be a much bigger house compared to the floor plan.

Good idea on switching the master bath and closet!

Is there something you would change on the elevation?

I like the livability. the patio is way far away from the kitchen. do you grill ? Consider how you use the patio. Maybe you will want a kitchenette in the game room. At least a fridge and sink so you can relax on the patio.

Some comments/questions:

• Why is the future space upstairs a full height space taking >50% of the level's square footage, instead of being a 1/2 story? Have you addressed spanning 23' or 31' and how that affects having very large beams and posts throughout the 1st floor Living/Kitchen/Dining?
• How is this house sited on the property? The location of patio is not near the Living Room nor Kitchen, but only has access from a Game Room?
• Is the front porch only for looks, being only 8" deep and far from Kitchen/Dining/Living?
• Is the Powder Room in the Game Room needing to be isolated just for the Game Room, and not utilitzed conveniently for the rest of house? Can it be worked into the Utility area instead of being so prominent in the Game Room?
• Is the Game Room prioritized in the way you live over the Living Room, as the Game Room has nice natural light, access to outdoor living, yet the Living Room lacks on those?
• Is the inefficient space from the "open to above" at the stair going to remain empty, and still cut into the natural space of the Dining area?
• Is there a need for any closets on the 1st floor, like coming in from the front door, coming in from the back yard or garage, linens, house misc like vacuums, etc?
• Is the inefficient space from the long arduous hallway from back deck to Kitchen going to remain empty except for the benches?
• Is the generator, which will be quite large, understood to have a large switch on the outside and most likely the main panel right on the inside of this hallway exposed to view from the open interior?
• Is the Laundry going to house HVAC alongside the water heater, or should there be a better placed Mech/Utility Room?
• Is it understood, from the rendering, that your garage is 5 steps lower than the 1st floor, and the windows are at least 3' higher than typical?
• Since you haven't hired an architect, do you plan to, or at least peruse examples of successful houses on the internet?

I agree with the person who says, Lots here to like ... but it's a little clunky /excess space in some areas /lacks elegance. As a first-draft, it's nice.

Things to consider;

- I'd like to see double French doors on the office /more open. Also double windows.

- Either a coat closet or a spot for a drop-table in the front entry.

- I don't see a coat closet by the back door either -- and that's where you really need a coat closet. I'm also a North Carolinian, and in spite of our mild weather, we still need a place to store coats out-of-season.

- The mudroom is more of a hallway; I'd like to see more space here for storage /a drop spot.

- We've only lost power for more than a couple hours maybe 4-5 times in my adult life. Is that worth building in a whole-house generator?

- You don't want your sink on the end of an island ... it needs to be at least 2' longer to encompass the trash-dishwasher-sink.

- You have a whale of a lot of empty space next to the table.

- I'd rotate the living room furniture 90 degrees /place the TV on the large blank wall /add another window for better lighting and place the sofa under the bank of windows.

- The dryer should always be placed on an exterior wall so it can vent directly outside. This is cheaper to build /easier to keep clean /more fire-safe.

- The stacked upstairs washer /dryer has no place for "waiting loads" or supplies, which means junk will always be piled outside the door. With all the wasted space in this plan, it's a shame to create a cramped utility work space.

- I'd flip-flop the laundry /bathroom to the front of the house /the master bedroom to the back. This would give you direct access to the patio from the master bedroom. The one concern would be windows placement on the front of the house.

- Note that the closet door prevents the sleeper on the right side of the bed from having a night table. You could have a narrow shelf built in and a hanging light fixture.

- The vanity in the master bathroom is not big enough to support duplicate sinks -- you're cheating yourself out of drawer space AT the sink, which is very important. And you have no other storage in the bathroom.

- Toilets in closets are always uncomfortable, and this one looks quite small, especially as it has no window.

- Move the tub so it's on an exterior wall /can have a window over it -- you don't want a window in the shower anyway.

- Do you need a game room AND the upstairs loft? What function will each provide? Note that the upstairs loft sound will come down the stairwell.

- No to divided kids' bathrooms -- they never work out as planned. The reality is that the kid at the sink will object to the other kid passing through. With only two kids to share, just go with one well-done 3-piece bath /no divider. Note, too, that this vanity is not large enough to support duplicate sinks, which aren't particularly useful anyway. Go with one center well-done sink and a bank of drawers for each child. Again, this bathroom has zero storage space.

- Kids' bedrooms look fine, though I'd increase the number of windows and give more space to the closets.

- Do you anticipate adding rooms in that unfinished space eventually? If so, be sure you build in 'real floors" now -- attic floors aren't substantial enough, and it'll be cheaper (though not cheap) to go ahead and do it now.

My sister built a home with an upstairs space for her two teenage daughters and pulled from the design of my parent's home when she designed the space for them.

In my parents home the bedrooms each had a vanity with a sink. This helped keep traffic flowing when a bathroom was shared by 6 kids. You only used the bathroom for bathing or going to the bathroom - not for doing hair, makeup . . .

My sister designed her upstairs so that you entered either bedroom from the landing at the top of the stairs. The bathroom was accessible through the bedrooms.

Roughly something like this - WD on one end - shower in the middle, Toilet on the other end. small sink and a linen closet across from the shower.

Vanity across from 5' closet

This solution really helped reduce arguments over bathroom use and since one daughter was much neater than the other they were both happy with having vanity space that could be kept neater or messier without complaint. No fighting over who's hairbrush or mascara or whatever belongs to which kid.

The shape of your space is different than hers, but you may want to give the idea some thought and maybe use some of the loft space which has little purpose and provide more closet and vanity space for each kid.

The concept still works well even with both of the girls being grown and married. They come home and 4 can use the space without running all over each other. It is getting a bit more difficult since the older one has had two children. Still young enough to share a room with mom and dad, but getting tighter.

Thank you all- this is all great information.

A few major notes which I originally left out: (1) The (near) future plan is to have a pool off of the patio. (2) The future unfinished space was recommended by a contractor and we thought his comment made a lot of sense. He said the renovations he has been doing recently for adult children to live in their parents houses has been increasing rapidly due to the increasing housing costs for young adults, and he is now suggesting to all his new clients if possible to have an unfinished space to give more flexibility in the future.

Yes we absolutely need to add some coat closets - thank you everyone who commented on that!

As far as the front porch - yes it is more for looks, we expect people will use the side porch more frequently.

The mudroom "hallway" will either have benches and coat hooks or "lockers". Making it deeper would be ideal.

As far as the whole house generator - because the property is very remote, we lose power for at least a day if not multiple days a couple of times a year and hours at a time probably another 5-6 times a year. These are quite common in the area and we do understand the switch and panel implications of that.

Our houses in he past have had HVAC outside and this is our plan moving forward with this house as well, so no need for a full mech/utility room.

I like the idea of French doors on the office and double windows if we could make that work.

We have had some other friends/family suggest moving the sink to the cabinets and will look into that as well.

There is some space next to the table - we had thought we may put a piano/music corner there or a Christmas tree during the holidays?

I like the idea of rotating the living room furniture 90 degrees!

We have considered swapping the laundry room so we can put the dryer on the exterior wall to keep it fire-safe as well. We have also debated a lot on a combined washer/dryer upstairs or a laundry dumbwaiter to try and help make ALL the laundry the kids seem to have a bit easier to manage.

I am going to think about flipping the master bedroom/bath - that may work.

Also, thank you for all the upstairs bathroom suggestions - we will think through what we think will work best for us.

Thought on your updates:

- About that upstairs finished space: Ask your contractor to price your build with /without that finished floor space -- that much space i'm guessing will add about 75k, which is a lot to spend now in case your children want to live in your house one day (especially since you're rural, which usually means limited jobs). Understand that what you'll be doing is building finished space that just isn't furnished with flooring, paint, etc.

- While you're adding coat closets, add a broom closet somewhere -- if you don't plan for buckets, the vaccum, etc., they end up being squished in somewhere. Put outlets in the broom closet. Think about your seasonal items too.

- Consider that porches cost about 60% as much as indoor finished space -- that upstairs /downstairs porch will be very expensive.

- Think through those benches, etc. in the mud-hall. Don't leave them to chance.

- I'd consider solar panels instead of the whole-house generator. It's worth investigating, especially when you're considering heating /cooling such a large house ... and since you're planning a pool, go ahead and plan now enough electricity to heat it.

- Yes, I've lived in NC my whole life, and HVAC tends to be outside ... but you will still need a central air return indoors. What kind of water heater are you considering? Mine is under the house, which is typical here ... but if I were building new today, I'd want a tankless water heater, which you'd probably want somewhere central inside the house.

- Yes to more windows anywhere you can have them.

- Kitchen sink under the windows and range on the island could work well -- you'd have the vent hanging down, but that's workable.

- You have more space next to the table than a piano or Christmas tree will fill. This is a weakness in the plan.

- Are dumbwaiters still "code"?

Regarding solar panels ... they are great, and we put them on our FL house, but to act as a "generator" you also have to include batteries (we used Tesla), and the costs add up quickly to have enough battery reserve, to power most of the house overnight if you want to run AC.

Batteries even without solar panels can be configured to charge when rates in a tiered rate system are low and run your loads over the peak times. For periodic power loss for a longer period than a couple hours consider the battery in your ev of 60-100kWhs. You've already paid for that battery. Vehicle to load is native on some cars and trucks. There's now an aftermarket adapter for Teslas.

Why is the house 7 steps above grade? Wouldn't the garage also have 7 risers? You're bucking the trend with the size of the owner's bedroom.

totally just my opinion but if the kids move home in 15 yrs you may want to build an ADU on the property and not have them above you - I’d avoid extra space for ”just in case” - it can bloat a house and it still adds to the costs

I find it really interesting the folks against the kids space over master. What do you think kids are doing in their rooms at night that would bother their parents?

On the first floor, I would suggest adding a powder room closer to your great room, along with a closet for coats/etc for guest located close to front entrance. It can be piggy backed off of the washer/dryer area.

If you keep the powder room in the game room, I'd reconfigure it so that the door doesn't open directly into the space. People like a bit of privacy for the bathroom, and you don't want unpleasant smells to waft out into the game room.

I would also add a window in the Master Bath to get some natural light in there.

@WestCoast Hopeful, don't know how old you or your kids are, but these days older teens and college kids males will game on their computer and talk to other friends who are also playing. Even with headphones you can hear the teen/college kid talking loudly and laughing. They get caught up in the game/chatter and can get pretty loud. Also they stay up late and walk around like they weigh 3 tons!

I would not want my bedroom underneath their bedrooms or bathroom(s), specially if the parents go to bed at more normal hours.

Of course you could design the house with properly engineered soundproofing, but that is not what the average person will design, or want to pay for, if they can even find a contractor who know how to do it properly.

My kids are 18, 16, 13. No devices or tech in rooms at night solved that problem entirely. Bedrooms are for hanging out in, resting and sleeping. I would have zero issues sleeping below any of my kids. That said my preference would always be for bedrooms all to be on same level.

I wouldn't want my bedroom underneath or near my kids bedrooms either. We rented a house while building our current house. All bedrooms were clustered at one end of the house right near each other. It drove me nuts when they were home from college. I would hear them get up to use the bathroom, to go get a snack/drink in the kitchen or talking while playing video games. I am not going to tell a 20/21 year old they are not allowed to have electronic devices in their rooms at night. God help me if my daughter was above our room. She is heavy footed and it would probably sound like elephants were staying in the room above us. Even in our previous house when the kids were younger we were on the same floor but the kids rooms were at one end of the house and master bedroom at the other.

Regarding solar panels ... they are great, and we put them on our FL house, but to act as a "generator" you also have to include batteries (we used Tesla), and the costs add up quickly to have enough battery reserve, to power most of the house overnight if you want to run AC.

I'd investigate the cost in your area -- I'm guessing that for the cost of the whole-generator (which is going to be very expensive for a 4400 square foot house + pool), you could have a solar power system that'd work all the time -- can you still get a tax credit for installing solar?

totally just my opinion but if the kids move home in 15 yrs you may want to build an ADU on the property and not have them above you - I’d avoid extra space for ”just in case” - it can bloat a house and it still adds to the costs

That's sensible. More sensible than building space now + paying interest on it "just in case" the kids want to move home + can find jobs in a very rural area.

Hopeful, don't know how old you or your kids are, but these days older teens and college kids males will game on their computer and talk to other friends who are also playing. Even with headphones you can hear the teen/college kid talking loudly and laughing

True. My adult daughter has a weekly online meet-up with her college friends, and I hear them laughing. Doesn't bother me in the least -- I'm just glad they're still buddies and still having fun.

Well this goes to show that everyone lives differently. Wouldn’t be a dealbreaker for me to have a kids space over master at all. To each their own with their own expectations of their kids.

For me, I always appreciated being on the same floor with our kids. We could hear who was sick in the night, see whose light was spilling under the door after midnight (the project is due in the morning), and know who was stirring in time for school.

Why is the a proper laundry room for the parents but just a stackable in a closet for the kids?

I know you want the generator in a protected spot, but wouldn’t it be nice to have a door in that space instead?

Sometimes threads run with a single point that is low on the totem pole, and distracts from the meat and potatoes. I don't know why secondary bedrooms over the Master has become a focus when the entire plan is just not very good. I have already listed a bunch of design reasons disguised as questions, but they seemingly are not understood in terms of design.

At first glance, I saw a large one-room space, with bedrooms to the right that had been converted to a suite, an enclosed porch that was turned into a four-season room, and a second floor over one end that was added on years later, hence the odd stairs placement.

Or perhaps looking like an old institution converted to living space. Now THAT would be a start to a ”parti” as our old member Lavender Lass would say.

And thinking that the ”unfinished space” would be great for floor hockey, ping-pong, darts, scooter polo, bikes on a stormy day.

I did not see planning, rhythm, organizing principle, grace, or personality.

Wow - I hadn't logged on in a couple of days and am blown away by all the time all of you have spent with responses!

We will definitely consider the cost of the unfinished space vs ADU. Luckily there is plenty of space for an ADU so that may be an option if needed.

I had not considered solar panels vs the whole house generator. I think that was just our default since we know so many people who have them, but we are going to investigate these other options as well.

Everyone's opinions on master vs children's bedrooms is interesting. We are talking through some of the different points everyone as brought up. Right now having a master suite underneath the kids bedrooms isn't a deal breaker, and is how the houses we both grew up in were situated as well. We have never been near our children's rooms in any house we have lived in, and their bedrooms are actually under theirs now but realize they will get bigger so something to think about.

We are looking into switching the master bath / closet at a minimum, to add a window to the master bath and looking at switching the bedroom to the back of the house with the bath/closet at the front.

Definitely adding more closets to the main floor.

We do realize the master bedroom is not the current trend. We have lived in houses with huge masters and smaller-size and honestly just prefer the smaller bedrooms with his/her closets.

We are going to price the stackable washer/dryer upstairs and see how much that costs. The idea was that would help alleviate some of the laundry carrying up and down the stairs.

We want a decent height crawlspace, we lived in one house with a very short one and doing repairs, looking into what was wrong was awful. We are discussing if we could do this with grading perhaps more so than just making the whole house higher.

Why is the a proper laundry room for the parents but just a stackable in a closet for the kids?

Especially with all that excess space.

Concerns with stackbles: Can your kids reach up to use them? I am just under 5' tall -- probably the size of your kids -- and I can't effectively reach into the top machine. Of course, they'll grow, but you probably want to start them out washing their own things now. Also, consider HOW you'll pull that double-heavy machine out of the closet to keep the ductwork clean. The likely answer is, "We'll pay someone to clean the ducts", but that's just an added expense every year ... whereas, it's easy to clean our own vents if the dryer is on an exterior wall.
I know you want the generator in a protected spot, but wouldn’t it be nice to have a door in that space instead?

I would dislike another door on the front of the house, which is confusing to guests. I'd try to "design out" that excess hallway L ... but, if it stays, it would be nice to make that a bay window seat. With shoe storage underneath, which would allow people to sit and remove their shoes in that area.

I don't know why secondary bedrooms over the Master has become a focus when the entire plan is just not very good.

Agree on both counts.

I did not see planning, rhythm, organizing principle, grace, or personality.

True. I see loads of space but not good design.

We will definitely consider the cost of the unfinished space vs ADU. Luckily there is plenty of space for an ADU so that may be an option if needed.

That makes so much more sense. IF your kids ever need /want to return home, an ADU would give them more privacy, and -- at that point -- you could design what they'd actually need. Perhaps most importantly at the moment, you wouldn't be financing something that may or not ever be needed.
I had not considered solar panels vs the whole house generator. I think that was just our default since we know so many people who have them, but we are going to investigate these other options as well.

I know exactly zero people who have a whole house generator, but I know multiple people who are very pleased with solar panels. Consider that you don't have to go whole-hog wth solar. You can put in just enough to run the first-floor, or you can put in enough to power the whole house. You can even sell electricity back to the power company.
Definitely adding more closets to the main floor.

I've heard you want 10% of your house to be storage.
We do realize the master bedroom is not the current trend.

Current trend?

Here is the plan with a number of the suggested changes (thank you everyone). I still think there are imrpovements to be made for sure.

We haven't had a chance to dive into taking out the unfinished space/elevation views without that so that is next on the list.

I agree with one of the first commenters - I like the livability.

In the new plan I like the living room rotated.

Both plans having the side porch and garage entrance into the same drop zone area is smart - it seems like those are the doors you plan to use the most.

I do think you could rearrange the laundry / half bath / maater closet to made the half bath feel more integrated.

I like that it is still pretty open but you sont see the ktchen as soon as you walk in. The kitchen layout in the second plan is much better.

In agreement with most posters here - I would get rhat unfinished space priced out to see if you think it is worth it. It is likely a bigger increase than you‘re expecting.

I noticed the second plan has no laundry upstairs. Carrying the clothes up and down is going to be a hassle. I would leave even a stackable or an all in one washer and dryer or something upstairs.

Can you share the site plan and what the yard will be like? I see to figure pool listed but this seems very disconnected from the home.

The dining table is even more in the middle of the traffic zone, and the ceiling above it will open up to the second floor, right down the middle of the table. How will you handle lighting? and the table blocks the way to the stairs, and the the game room, and will have stuff plopped on it all the time.

The jackets and such are completely visible to the whole living space.

Where will guests hang their rain jackets and umbrellas?

Where are your house cleaning supplies? and will you use the space under the stairs?

What is a bookcase barn door? What’s shown doesn’t look deep enough to hold books. Is it supposed to camouflage the gun safe? Will it be lockable, as an additional safety measure?

The kitchen is now lacking in traffic flow: only one way in and out. And there is no good landing zone for the refrigerator. I thought the first kitchen was the best part of that plan.

This might turn into the story of the man, his son, and their donkey, and we are the village people along the way, leading to solutions to comments that are worse than before, and don’t work for you and your family. You will be better off with an architect who will sit down with you, your list of wants and needs, and a site plan, and have a real conversation and sketching session.

I would maybe move the entrance to the game room too - since it won't always be in use like the living room is (presumably)

If you can move the office with the roof line I think this moves the dining table to a better place, maybe add some arched openings or some way to distinguish it from the front door so you aren't waling into the dining table.