Marvin Ultimate would be in the same price range as the Kolbe Ultra's and just as good. Any and all Marvin or Kolbe are fine products in my opinion.

We bought very expensive Kolbe windows and doors and have been VERY UNHAPPY with their service and follow up and window function. Several of the windows do not open and close properly and the expensive wood front door we purchase has warped. We have been now told that they don't guarantee against warping on their doors. We spent a great deal of money on what we were promised were the best of the best and I would not recommend using them based on our experience.

pinkphd which model Kolbe windows did you get? I'm looking at the Ultra - mostly sliding, though some casement or push out casement.

following

We ended up going with the Marvin Ultimate for doors and Marvin Elevate for windows. Black interior and black exterior. Kolbe just seemed much pricier overall. When I was shopping I also happened to meet the sales rep and she was really fantastic. Our window rep gave us a few examples of houses in our neighborhood that had recently used either line and she encouraged us to drive around and see what we thought from an aesthetic point of view too.

So fiberglass on the outside, wood inside? I cannot keep all the Marvin lines straight. Are you happy with the fiberglass?

Yes correct! Hard to say just yet because they haven't been installed yet. Another reason that helped us make the decision is that a contractor we were considering vouched for Marvin saying that they were the brand they liked working with the most (based on ease of installation and quality) out of Kolbe, Anderson and Fleetwood. Not sure if that means much but wanted to share...

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Yeah, sounds like Marvin has lots of fans..especially in these parts! And of course the Marvin sales guys love them. I'm trying to figure out if I should get the Elevate or Signature (aluminum clad/wood) bid out...and what makes more sense for my house since we live near the coast. Did you look at the Essential line (all fiberglass)...any thoughts on those? Do people think they look too plasticy inside or is there another issue? Seems if you can afford the wood inside, everyone keeps steering me toward those.

I have the same question. We like the look better of the essential line (thinner profile, modern look). Sales people seem to steer us away, saying it is 'Builder Grade'. To use my only worry is the lack of air leakage data (not sure how they preform there). They aren't quite as energy star rated, but they are real close, and the fiberglass should last longer with no risk of warping from contracting/expanding vinyl. This is where we are leaning, but hard to find much info about it.

Unfortunately we did not really look at the Essential line... I can't remember why now though.

I ran into a few threads about people having problem
with the paint peeling on the Marvin fiberglass line. It was from maybe 2014/2015. Maybe that’s enough to frighten people away from fiberglass?

"It was from maybe 2014/2015."

Have not heard of one case since then so there is that.

Oh shoot! I’m getting a revised bid on Kolbe right now. Would Windsor be worse? They are less expensive but heard the quality was less. What kind of problems have you had?

Mrrauch - where in the states are you building? I just reached out to our Kolbe window dealer to ask about their current experience with Kolbe and she said sometimes on the East Coast there can be more issues - but I think she was talking about after installation.

Have you even been able to get them installed?

"Would Windsor be worse?"

Mrrauch's issues sounds more dealer related than Kolbe and with nothing to back up shown to back up the claims. Windsor is worse all the way around. Fit & Finish, Performance, Quality and Customer Service are all lacking. I do not sell or work in residential house and have not in a number of years but I have friends in the industry, so no dog in this hunt.

Hi hapahole - I am building in NYC, a townhouse in northern Manhattan. Since posting, I have finally gotten in touch with someone at Kolbe corporate. The dealer and regional sales manager (directly at Kolbe corporate) were not taking charge of the situation, and were "half-responding" to my emails, but not really answering my phone calls to address the problem. After calling for two consecutive weeks the main customer service line at Kolbe, I got in touch with somebody and went "up the chain" by two levels, at which point they were extremely helpful. Millworkman is right, most of the issues were dealer related, but I was still incredibly surprised that it took so long to get in touch with anyone from the corporate office.

That said, here is what I have learned:

If you are ordering from Kolbe, you will get a very good product, but you will likely have to wait at least 14-16 weeks to get it. That is their current lead time. Don't listen to what the dealer tells you (ours told us 4-6 weeks, which is what we planned around). The dealer was just trying to "make the sale". We ordered from the Vistaluxe line, and this is the lead time I was told, directly from the company's factory. If you are ordering from the Ultra line, I would call them directly to ask for lead time, if the 14-16 week sounds like it could be an issue.

I have also been told by several builders, since we placed the order, that they don't use Kolbe because their lead times are always longer than their competitors.

If you are only concerned about quality, then Kolbe does make a good product, but if schedule is any concern, I would honestly still advise against going with Kolbe at that price point. To me they sound like a small company getting overwhelmed by the current construction boom. Once I finally got ahold of the regional sales manager (after going up the chain at corporate, two levels of people), he told me that he is "working two jobs right now". My thought is, that's great for the company that they are doing well during the boom, but maybe they should increase capacity, hire more people, etc... like everyone else is to keep up with the demand? Or else lower prices so you aren't paying so much just to "get the window when you get it". Kolbe's mantra is "handmade, custom" etc., no "factory automation" - but that can create issues when we are undergoing an unprecedented pandemic and construction boom.

Because of this experience, we placed a second order for windows from Andersen, which has a more standard lead time of 6-8 weeks, and lower pricing. My feeling is that the bigger companies are able to handle the demand a little better, more factories, more locations, better resources to deal with the supply chain issues.

Again, the quality of the windows is very good, and once I went "up the chain" and finally got ahold of someone at corporate, I was impressed with their service (though again it took about two weeks, even after directly contacting the regional sales manager, via phone and email). We have to order an entirely new panel to replace the broken one, which is going to take another 14-16 weeks. So all in all, our little patio door project is an 8 month job just on one single unit. But when it arrives, they are sending someone from their corporate office out to make sure the install goes smoothly, so we can skip the dealer.

Anyway, just my two cents, wanted to pass along my experience because one of the main reasons I chose Kolbe was because of reading about them on the Houzz forums. I have never used them before on a project, and now I know why. Most builders can't wait that long for the windows, unless you order it as soon as you sign a contract. I know we are in a global pandemic, etc., but if I had known that the company is not able to handle it, I would absolutely have looked elsewhere, and will be doing so in the future.

That said, if schedule is no concern, and you can wait 3-4 months to get the product, then I don't think you will be disappointed. The quality is good, and the corporate office service is nice. As long as your dealer is decent, or else your regional sales manager for your territory is responsive, they can correct any issues. But I would recommend getting in touch with the corporate office directly to confirm current lead times, despite whatever the dealer tells you. I was just told on Friday that they are at minimum 14 weeks AFTER they receive the order from the dealer just for manufacturing (so not including any shop drawings, shipping, etc.). I would plan your project around 16 weeks + for order and delivery.

One last idea. I didn't know this, but apparently Kolbe provides an official lead time estimate as soon as you officially place the order, and your dealer SHOULD notify you, and at that point you can officially either cancel or proceed with the order without losing your money. Our dealer did not know about this, and obviously did not do this for us. I would 100% recommend this.

I am in the industry too, and have been throughout the pandemic. I currently have 12 ongoing projects. But none of them are experiencing these kinds of lead time delays - for windows, doors, anything.

One more note - I've been told by Kolbe that their lead times of 14-16 weeks are lower than their competitors right now - Marvin and Lepage in particular I've been told (by Kolbe) are at 24+ weeks. Not sure if this is current info or not - Is anyone ordering from Marvin or LePage right now? I'd be really curious to see how everything stacks up in terms of pandemic lead times. I just think it's crazy that some of these higher-end companies are able to still charge higher pricing, while also extending their lead times, and we are all still okay paying it...I do know that the pandemic has had an impact on lead times, but I have just not personally seen any of my projects affected by it, really, and I have projects in NY, NJ, SC, TN. I just wonder how much of it is just an excuse, how much is demand, and how much could be real supply chain issues, or labor shortages, etc. I live in NY, one of the more strict states on lockdown, and I didn't really see any kind of shutdown in the construction industry. I'm assuming most window companies, especially in the Midwest, didn't really shut down. Does anyone have current info on lead times at other companies besides Kolbe and Andersen right now?

There is a post on the forum currently where a homeowner is looking at 12-14 weeks once he finally gets his windows and they are Andersen. All companies have extended lead times currently as are all building materials, other that lumber at the moment. Not currently in the residential business, but commercial is just as bad currently.

My local Marvin dealer is quoting around 24 weeks for new orders. We are waiting for 3 replacement widows that the dealer ordered wrong and those were supposed to be 9 weeks out, several weeks ago.

My feeling is that the bigger companies are able to handle the demand a little better, more factories, more locations, better resources to deal with the supply chain issues.

FYI for simple comparisons:

Andersen - multi-billion dollar company. Primary factory in Bayport MN manufactures all 400 and 200 series plus a percentage of 100 series.

Primary factory for 100 series is in Garland TX

A-series are manufactured in Menomonie WI

Renewal in Cottage Grove MN

E-series are out of Dubuque IA

Marvin - over one billion in sales. Primary factory in Warroad MN (population less that 2000 people).

Fiberglass units manufactured in Fargo and West Fargo ND, and in Roanoke VA

Kolbe - 200-250 million sales. Factory in Wausau WI

Interesting info - because it appears that the dealers are NOT telling us the facts because they know that we would not place the order if we knew that 16-24 weeks is what it will take. I am going to speak to my Andersen dealer to see if the lead time i was told (6-8 weeks) is accurate. Seems to be a major communication breakdown going on here, and everyone just wants to keep the orders going so they can make their commission.

But if everyone has 16-24 week lead times then what are you going to order instead? It is what it is and projects will just take longer to complete.

In FL, PGT makes most of the hurricane rated windows that get installed in the average construction project. They were having issues before covid due to buying out some competitors and trying to merge the businesses together. Covid hasn't made it better.

The other issue is that many of these companies get their glass from the same few sources ... and they are also having supply issues. Marvin get their glass from Cardinal Glass. We are going with Euro-wall sliders and the company rejected the glass that was supposed to go in our sliders. Still waiting for the slider doors.

I've heard some large builders in FL have stopped taking orders or will only take X number of orders each month, because they are so delayed due to material and employee shortages and high demand for RE.

If i had been told a 16-24 week lead time, (rather than 4-6 weeks) i would have started my project next year, rather than tearing up my kitchen and having a giant 10’X 7’ opening in the back of my house for 8 months.

I just got a Marvin quote in Los Angeles that’s 18-20 weeks.

Mrrauch - thank you so much for your detailed rundown on your project. It’s really helpful hearing your experience. I’m glad you were able to get a response from Kolbe finally. And relieved to hear the product was still good. When you said the window was broken, I was afraid it was made poorly and didn’t work well.

Sounds like where we need to be the most cautious is in dealing with the dealers to get accurate lead times. So thanks for the heads up about that process as well.

I just got a Marvin quote with an 18-20 week lead time.

I just spoke with a very helpful salesperson directly at the Andersen E-series factory in Dubuque. They told me that they are not seeing any delays in their E-series products, and that the 6-8 weeks that I was told by the dealer is reasonable. He said the only issues they have had is with some of their screens due to the aluminum, but other than that they haven't really seen any delays during Covid. It really must be that Andersen is just better able to handle the increased demand, while some of the other smaller companies are not.

And yes, Kolbe issues were mostly dealer- related, I believe the dealer dropped one of the panels. After the initial unresponsiveness from corporate (I think just due to how busy they are right now as a smaller company), I have no concerns about their overall quality. As long as you can plan around the extended lead times they will require, for example in new builds, then you will be fine. For me, with a lot of renovation projects, that can't really wait 4-6 months for doors/windows, it's looking like I will be sticking with Andersen for the near future, at least.

Thanks for all the help here - very good to know what the lead times are so we can hopefully avoid more situations like the one I am in right now. Accurate lead times from the dealers are so important for proper project planning, in some cases just as important as quality and price.

Mrrauch did you call the main Kolbe number on their website to get the more accurate lead time? I sent an email last week to the regional rep I had been emailing with questions in February, but I haven’t heard back from him yet.

Hi hapahaole - I'm not surprised that the regional sales rep did not answer. We had the same problem, even after calling their cell. I eventually called the main Kolbe number - the first week, nobody answered. The second week, finally got through, after a brief hold, but was told (at 4pm Central Time) that there weren't a lot of people in the building, but they would try to get someone on the phone. Luckily someone actually did call me back that same day, and they were very helpful. Hope this helps.

Was chatting to the window installer (who is installing our Marvin windows) about product lead times this morning and he said that PGT/WinGard/CGI lead times are out to 30 weeks ... 7.5 months, which is crazy!

(PGT is a FL company that has large market share of vinyl/aluminum impact rated windows)

Here it is, one year later. We ordered Kolbe VistaLuxe Windows and doors(California) and it has now been 8 months and still no windows. Hopefully, based on this thread, the quality will be worth the wait.

If there are any post installation updates on the Kolbe, I would love to hear about it.

I think the lead time was about 6 month or 7 months when we ordered. My memory is starting to get a bit hazy. I think we ordered in July 2021 some time. We started demo Nov 2021. They left our original windows in until the new ones arrived. They arrived in waves though... probably half arrived on time, then a couple weeks later we got a couple more, then a couple more. We had one corner glass window that was basically just a frame (glass is ordered from a glass shop locally). It was not square and had to be unistalled (our contrator did all the installing). He said the windows were not perfect (they are handmade by people), but that they were better than most that he's been installing. I found a local Kolbe guy (I think he's some sort of engineer, but I could be wrong). He was really helpful connecting me to the right people and getting a fix for the not square window. Kolbe's repair guy (he drives all over the western states fixing window problem) came out and cut the frame and put it back together so it was 90 degrees. We got it installed and then the glass guys installed some window piece upside down. Ugh... so had to order new strips of wood from Kolbe which took a few more weeks. Our window shop Window's N Things in Canoga Park was good and kept following up with Kolbe. I also called Kolbe directly and they were very honest with me about how long everything would take. Overall, I'm happy with my windows. It's just a process. Good luck.

Andersen 100 lead time for 30 windows is 8 weeks from order delivery.

My house was built in 1991 wiith Marvin Double Hung windows throughout. The quality is top notch. We have replaced a few of the window balancers - easily ordered from a local Marvin dealer and easily installed by us without even a screwdriver. Not a window has a broken seal. The insullation is great - no air leakage in our Minnesota winters. We do have the optional storm units that would not be necessary in a more moderate climate.