much better view of the middle picture

Please do post the measurements of the future kitchen space so we can make sure you do have enough room for an island. Looking at the architect's plan it seems that there is, but let's be sure.

Pending the measurements, your friend's idea seems best. I would, however, add a prep sink in the bottom left corner of the island in order to create another, more compact prep zone. The island also looks like it juts out too close to the table - I can see collisions happening between the island stools and table chairs. Get rid of the overhang OR the shallow cabinets. What is the mark in the counter to the right of the sink in your friend's plan, trash? It would be best in the island, accessible to both sinks, or at least to the non-DW side of the cleanup sink (scrape dishes to your left, rinse in sink, drop in DW to your right).

BTW, the reason you don't like your current island and feel it is in the way is because it is in the path between your fridge and sink - a barrier island. Many people remodel to get rid of those. Actually, if you moved the fridge about 3' to the left on its current wall and left the rest of the kitchen alone, I bet you would like working in there a whole lot better.

I think I'd switch the locations of the pantry and microwave.

Why is the DW to the left of the sink? Could it be to the right of the sink instead?

What are the little circles next to the microwave?

10'10'' on that back wall to the door opening. We are willing to make the door opening smaller if needed (we'd like French doors there)but that does cut into the "eat-in" area. Door opening is 7'4". 1'11" to the wall separating the eat in from the family room.

8'10" inches of space b/t the dining room wall and hallway wall (so bottom of picture--dining room is to the left). But note, that is not drawn perfectly b/c that wall is actually 32.5" deep where the fridge is now.

12'8" from the back wall to where the hallway wall stops. So if you add in that 32.5" you end up with 184.5" of width to the kitchen in that area Now where our table sits now there is a small pantry that is 65" long but with shelves only 10.75" deep. it is set back and we do have anohter 16ish" to come forward with before we are at the wall that separates the family room from the kitchen area. The KD has talked about using this extra space and
bringing those cabs out and being able to have more usable space.

On the first picture (which was the first guy's "demo") the circles next to what is currently the panty (and the microwave in one plan) is just a wall with duct work we believe, the thermostat is on that wall.

I do believe that is trash to the right of the sink and dishwasher. Also, I have gotten use to the dishwasher on my right and wasn't sure I liked the architect's plan of it on the left.

I don't mind the pantry by the table but have thought if the kitchen stuff was in the "kitchen" part of the room and the "desk/kid/bills" stuff was in the "eat in area" it all might just flow better.

Hope I answered all questions! Thanks for taking the time to help.

Also, something to note, my fridge currently does not stick out like in the "current" plan, it is set back and is "in line" with the stove and microwave now. Hopefully we have that depth in the entire wall. We are guessing the cabs currently in place have been set against a "fake" wall if you will.

What is next to the DW in your friend's plan?

I would move the DW simply to get it out of the path between sink and range. in the architect's plan.

I am not sure you gain a lot by going to a full 36"counter on the peninsula in the architect's plan and it makes the seating a bit tight. You won't get counter seating there anyway, so I would drop it to 30" and open up a bit of circulation space in the eating area.

Your friend has a much better plan because she probably works in her kitchen every day unlike the architect!

I have a plan at the beach very similar to the architects plan (except DW is on right) and I REALLY don't like it. My two biggest gripes are that it's a mile walk from the fridge to the sink and I have to prep either with my back to everyone or at the peninsula (and then walk 8 ft to the stove). I like your friend's plan but with a prep sink in the island. Believe me when I say that a 14 ft walk from the sink to the fridge gets tiresome.

How wide is your kitchen table? As your architect has drawn it, it is less than 3' wide (judging by the nearby 3' wide peninsula). Either you have a very narrow table or he's drawn it that way, which is very misleading. If you have a table that is 42" wide, a space that is only 8'4" wide allows only 29" around the table for people to move past diners. That's really tight, especially since people will want to move past the table to get outside via your new French doors. A space that is at least 10' 6" would be better - 42" between table and counter or other furniture. You could shrink this width on one side if you discourage traffic with furniture placement (we've done this at our house, allowing only 30" between back of couch and table. It's tight but doable for us.)

Which brings me to my next question. How is your FR furniture arranged? How much space between furniture and kitchen table do you have?

Can the wall between kitchen and FR be removed? These look like they are decorative structures in your existing space with plans to extend the one along the back wall in the architect's plan. Is this correct? I'm not talking about removing the bit of wall that contains duct work, just the parts that extend into the room.

Is the DR to the left of the kitchen? Would you be willing to use this for regular meals and opt for counter seating for casual dining in the kitchen?

I have some ideas but no point in proposing them until I know a bit more about how you'd like to live in and use the space.

Can't sleep so what the heck, I played with your kitchen. ;-)

{{gwi:1866513}}

I ditched the stub walls between FR and kitchen and created a banquette wall, 5'6" long between FR and kitchen with 42" walkways on either side. Adding a banquette freed up space in the kitchen since you don't need to add walkway clearance behind the bench. The bench is 24" deep, plenty deep to add cushions on the back. Table is 42" wide and 60" long.

It's a bit tight between the chair at the top of the table and the right hand French door (4' from table to door) but you could make the left hand French door the one predominantly used and it won't be an issue.

There's 52" between table and island, which is 42" wide and 6' long. I added a prep sink as others suggested to the island. This will make the island function better and not act like a barrier. I placed it where I did so that it doesn't interfere with your drop-zone from the fridge but you could move it to the outer corner if you prefer.

I moved pantry/MW/command central (desk) set-up around and pushed the fridge back to line up with oven/MW as you described above. I placed a 30-32" wide pantry (depends on how large your oven cabinet needs to be) with pull-outs between fridge and oven/MW stack (30" wide oven, btw). This is my preference - less chance of door dings - but you can easily swap pantry and oven/MW location. Some people don't like ovens opening into a doorway but most people don't open their ovens nearly as often as they open their pantry so it could be less of an issue than you'd think. And if you go with a range, not a rangetop, the single oven will be used even less frequently.

The cabinet by the banquette is your bar/wine fridge/drop zone. Oops, I was thinking that by making it only 18" deep, I'd give you more clearance for people to stand here but wine fridges need 24" depth. No matter, you've got enough room to go 24" + counter overhang here.

I enlarged the window over the sink, centered the sink on the window and moved your DW to the right where you prefer it. The cabinet to the right of the DW can be a china hutch-type cabinet to the counter.

I ditched the upper angled cabinet to the right of the range/rangetop and made the cabs go straight to the sink wall. Better look, IMO, and you still get decent (perhaps more usable) storage.

I'd recommend switching Lisa's prep sink to the corner of the island between stove and fridge, so it's usable from both the stove and fridge aisle, and leaves prep space in front of the stove. Also, the trash could go where she shows the prep sink so it's accessible from cleanup and prep/cooking areas. We have that set up and it works great for us.

The prep sink will greatly improve kitchen function for your kitchen full of workers/helpers/guests.

The architect's plan is not what you want for multiple cooks. A peninsula traps people and ruins flow. My sister remodeled to get rid of her dead end kitchen, that gathered people in, but never let them out! ;-)

I don't have time right now to go into everyones questions but appreciate all the feedback and experience. The KD and her contractor just left and we found out we can go to the ceiling where all the sofits are. I've also taken some pictures so you can really see the space. I think we've decided the peninsula is a "no go". From my gut feelings of the space and feedback from others it just seems like the wrong plan for us. I feel a bit guilty b/c I think we lead the archetict this way.

Since I do not know of your entire layout, I'm not sure if the dining area you have in the kitchen is the nook or the only dining area in your house.

I am thinking along the lines of why in your current layout people cannot hang out while you are cooking? (Not sure if I misinterpreted your mail). Likely because of the fact that the island is too small and offers no seating (they do not want to be standing forever especially if they are sipping wine :-)), and also because you might be going around the island a lot, they need to constantly move around to make way for you.

Given this, the peninsula idea proposed would nicely separate the kitchen cook from the company. However, it may be too tight due to the proximity of the dining table close by.

Are you open to expanding the kitchen to the whole space currently shown? Are you open to posting your entire layout? Since you are in the midst of major renovation, it may be possible to reconfigure the space and get you the kitchen that best suits your needs.

Hope this helps!

Your kitchen table is definitely wider than the architect drew it! Your hardwood floors look very nice, btw.

Photos help me visualize a new idea, thought it might do the same for you. Here are pics (from houzz.com) to give you an idea how the banquette divider could work in your space. I'm assuming that the side walls aren't load-bearing and can be removed.

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[traditional kitchen design[(https://www.houzz.com/photos/traditional-kitchen-ideas-phbr1-bp~t_709~s_2107)

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[contemporary kitchen design[(https://www.houzz.com/photos/contemporary-kitchen-ideas-phbr1-bp~t_709~s_2103) by minneapolis architect Charlie Simmons - Charlie & Co. Design

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[traditional kitchen design[(https://www.houzz.com/photos/traditional-kitchen-ideas-phbr1-bp~t_709~s_2107) by san francisco architect awarchitect.com

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[asian kitchen design[(https://www.houzz.com/photos/asian-kitchen-ideas-phbr1-bp~t_709~s_2102) by san francisco general contractor Harrell Remodeling

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[traditional family room design[(https://www.houzz.com/photos/traditional-family-room-ideas-phbr1-bp~t_720~s_2107) by chicago architect Nathan Kipnis Architects, Inc.

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[contemporary living room design[(https://www.houzz.com/photos/contemporary-living-room-ideas-phbr1-bp~t_718~s_2103) by boston architect LDa Architecture & Interiors

Also check out the 2nd photo at the link below.

No worries if you hate the idea. Just trying to think a bit out of the box to get you a kitchen that lives large, with enough room for family and company.

Here is a link that might be useful: Attic Mag - banquettes

We do have a dining room (to the left of the kitchen in the plans). We decided early on we did want to keep a table in the table area of the kitchen. We do use both seating areas when we have more than 8 people or even just a few families and their kids. I know I could get more kitchen space and a giant island with seating but oh well my space isn't big enough to have it all....

Homey_bird: Sometimes when we have friends over people are in the way of the fridge because they stand on that side of the island. The island is in the path of the "sink--fridge path" so that does create a bit of a problem. I think it is the lesser of the two evils when my other option is the "U" peninsula where people would tend to congregate at the end of the island.

I wonder about the banquette idea; I'll have to ask my husband his thoughts.

Since you are discussing a banquette idea with your DH, you might also want to throw in island pr peninsula seating for consideration. That would make your kitchen a true hangout! Based on my own experience, the kitchens where there is seating close to the prep area are where I find myself hang out. If there's no such space then I find people slowly drift away unless they are doing something in the kitchen.