Mark,

Were it me, I would do this. Open the jars, put the contents all in a pot, add that 1/8 cup of vinegar that you are missing. Bring it all up to a boil and cook for 10 minutes. Reprocess with a BWB. Alternatively, open all the jars and put it into a pot, bring to a boil, and pressure can according to the directions, provided you can find your part.

Either way you do this, you need to open everything, start with fresh flats, and clean jars, and recook. The processing times are based on starting with a hot product, so you have to open and recook. The fact that you added extra tomatoes and tomato product does not change the vinegar to low acid veggie ratio, which is the critical part of the recipe.

Sorry for your troubles, but at least you can salvage the batch.

Petro

Everything Petro said.

Carol

Wait! IF I read that post correctly....
The vinegar was only 1 TBS short and it was already BWB for 20 minutes (5 minutes longer that recommended).
Is this correct?

If so, why would anything more need to be done? I'd label and put them in the pantry, but I need to understand why Petro and Carol are recommending re-doing it?

I know it's Monday, but I'm confused!!!
Deanna

Deanna,

Mark waterbathed the salsa. That brought the center of the jar probably up to 212, but no one ever actually talks about what the target temperature in the center of jar actually is. It's probably not actually 212. In any case, being optimistic, we'll say 212. However, that temperature still is not hot enough to destroy botulism toxin producing spores or bacteria. The extra five minutes won't make it get hotter than 212 in a water bath. To destroy spores you need pressure canning temperatures of 240. Alternatively, you can water bath a product that has a pH below 4.6, to create an environment in which the spores/bacteria do not reproduce and create toxin. The approved recipe requires a full cup of acid to create that environment when using 4 cups of peppers/onions. He is not 1 tablespoon short, but 1 ounce, two tablespoons or an 1/8 of a cup. So he either needs to add the vinegar and reprocess in a water bath, or reprocess with a pressure canner. In either case, both sets of directions are dependent on starting with a hot pack product, so he has to open and recook to get the salsa hot enough to reprocess with the directions we have for this recipe.

Petro

Mark,

To follow the approved recipe, you would need to do as Carol and Petrowizard have said. The extra cooking time doesn't make up for lesser amount of acid; as Petro explains, they solve different safety problems.

That said, if it were me, I'd eat it as it was, with no worries. I know there is a margin of safety built into the amount of acid.

This is in no way a recommendation; I'm just telling you, as a tomato-loving online buddy and someone who has followed many, many, many discussions about canning acidity in general and this recipe's origins in particular, what my own level of comfort would be.

On the other hand, there isn't much down side to reprocessing with the extra vinegar; the hard work is in the chopping!

Cheers,

Zabby

OK, gotcha.
I told ya it was Monday....my bad math on the vinegar!!
I'm just gonna go back to sleep now.....

:+)

Deanna

For me the reduced acid was but one of many factors. While it's perhaps the most worrisome, there were other variables as well that play a role. I just feel it's simpler to re-process and not to have to worry about it, particularly as salsa is served "straight" i.e. without heating after opening.

Carol

Mark, We BWB can salsa all the time. My hubby, being dyslexic and prone to confusion and klutziness, has twice now forgot to put the vinegar in at all. (We do have some lime juice in our general recipe.) I have labelled those jar(s) "No V - eat first" and we eat it fairly quickly. We love salsa so it goes fast, we don't even can it in pints anymore, just quarts. We usually have ours packed full of fruit and tomatoes and not many peppers and onions, so we don't worry about it, figuring it is not THAT much different than tomato sauce. We usually make a peach, plum, or pear salsa or something like that with lots of fruit. Plus we have put in a good chunk of lime juice for flavor and extra acidity. So although to be absolutely safe you should do the whole reprocessing thing, I personally wouldn't bother. I am not an absolutely safe kind of person, I do dangerous things like drive around in a small car. :-)

Marcia

Thanks for all replies, feel free to continue commenting...

OK, the problem I have is redoing everything. I'm taking care of an 80yo mom with Dementia/Alzheimers that has a mind of her own, often defiant, (I got cussed out last night for the dishes and doing canning at 8:30pm) and the house is in great disorder... there's barely room for 1 to eat at the kitchen table (though it seats 4-6--her mail, food etc takes up most the room)), there's barely room on the counter to set a pot, the faucet barely trickles, the stove has a deep fryer sitting on it, etc.

I could go on but am embarrassed enough already! I was "handicapped" before her condition, now got carpal tunnel in both hands and cubital/ulnar tunnel in my right arm. I can barely sign my name or twist a screwdriver. She therefore does the dishes and with her vision & lack of patience, well... it's easier physically & mentally to buy new jars than see what I get after she'd wash them! When I'm canning, I try moving the deep fryer to the right burners and can on the left gas burners--the pilot lights are turned off on the right side. The jars barely have room on the center of the stove for a few hours--an old Universal from the '40's or '50's.

Is there a different way to heat them without emptying them? Can I put them in an oven at 250 with the lids off? nuke them?

P.S. I got a new relief valve today so can pressure can again...

(Zabby, you gonna make the Buffalo-Niagara tomato tastefest/party September 8th? Pick Deanna up along the way, I think she said she was walking...)

There is another option. Boil the contents of each jar for 10 minutes after opening. If there are toxins, that will kill them. There may be some textural changes, but since you'd have to reheat the product to re-process anyway, you're not losing in that regard. It would save you re-doing any of the jar-cleaning lid-replacement re-processing.

Just use up the opened product shortly; don't let it sit around for six weeks, even refrigerated.

You have my sympathy. My step-mom developed dementia. Just keeping her in the house when she was determined to walk out was a struggle. It's amazing how strong a frail 85-year-old woman can be.

Carol

Mark,

Stop right now! In the process of trying to find the answer to another question, I found Annie's original response to this question (how much vinegar). In the thread from '05, she says she was using 2/3 cup and was told by Michigan State that that figure was barely safe, so she was telling people 1 cup for a margin of safety. It looks to me that you at 7/8s cup should be just fine. Don't reprocess! Don't do anything. Here's the quote:

Petro

RE: Annie's salsa mix...big hit

clip this post email this post what is this?
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* Posted by annie1992 Z5 MI (My Page) on
Tue, Aug 9, 05 at 10:27

becksyard, originally I doubled the vinegar to 2/3 cup for a waterbath, based on the ratio of veggies to acid in a Ball Blue Book salsa recipe, but my local extension service pointed out that it was just "barely" the ratio for water bathed salsa, so now I've been telling everyone to increase it to 1 cup just to be safe. After all, who am I to argue with Michigan State University? LOL

Plus, as I said, this recipe has been a work in progress for several years now.....

Annie

Here is a link that might be useful: link to the thread

Mark,

Because I'm getting married two weeks later and there are some wedding-prep things that can only be done on the 8th (getting people together, argh, it's like herding cats!), I'm gonna have to let you & Deanna eat my share this time around.

But I'm SO already planning my next September around it, becaue I know it's gonna be such a successful event that it'll become an annual "do"!

Cheers,

Zabby

That's interesting Petro... I saw that thread when I searched for Annie's Salsa recipe a couple weeks ago... I guess the only thing that I remembered was the Prom Queen/Best Legs post and missed the 2/3 cup of vinegar!

Zabby... I hope others your way will be coming... I'm the one getting "cold feet" about it... this may be a one time deal--maybe even more rare than... than... getting married!

Mark,

No way! It's gonna be great.
I can help with the organizing next year if you like.

I was very excited to see that Barkeater said you can bring tomatoes across the border --- I had thought not.

Will think of you guys that day.....

Zabby

Boy, I wish I could go!
It's a pretty long walk though and since Zabby won't be happening along to pick me up, I'll not be able to make it!

Take lots of pictures and we can have a virtual TomatoFest right here!!!

Deanna

I will try to take lots of pics!

OK everyone, for those posting previous to Petro's repost of Annie's old thread, are your opinions the same or is it OK the way everything ended up?

Thanks too, Carol, for your understanding of my situation here.

Mark

Yep. Stock up on chips.............you're gonna be needing them!

Yep as in it's OK?

I think it is, but remember the "just barely". If it makes you more comfortable, you can boil after opening as I suggested. Think of it as "insurance."

Good luck. I don't have enough tomatoes ripe here for salsa yet. Maybe in a couple of weeks. I notice the deer have found some varieties they enjoy green, so I may be fighting them for enough to can!

Carol