the best treatment is cutting at ground level .... and applying roundup to the cambian layer ... and NEVER buying another ...

the systemic.. presuming it was ok for said use.. should have killed mom.. hopefully before eggs laying.. which should eradicate new creepers next season ... timing of your application might be an issue ...

unfortunately.. mom looks the same.. dead or alive.. so you are left wondering ... you wont know until late spring or next summer if there is a next generation .... but the systemic should still be there.. and take care of those sucker then ...

regardless.. i had a couple small pines with fletchers scale.. and the bayer tree and shrub systemic eradicated the problem ... but the investment in the treatment.. was cost efficient IMHO ...

on the other hand .... i cant see using $10 of treatment on a 5 dollar shrub every year or two ... the scale issue is HUGE!!!! on these plants ...

get rid of it.. and use the opportunity to put something better in there.. werent you complaining that space is at a premium ... here is a new spot.. carpe spacem ...

ken

Dormant oils are to be used during the winter on deciduous plants. Evergreen plants cannot tolerate an oil application during periods of very cold temperatures.

I am curious about your 'homemade' horticultural oil. Sounds like a real doozy!

But Ken...my Sarcoxies are BEAUTIFUL!

Rhizo, I don't know if your post is being facetious because half the leaves fell off, or if it was meant to be literal..gotta love the written word....but this is the homemade recipe:

Posted by ians_gardener (My Page) on Wed, Jul 14, 10 at 1:38

To kill the scales, spray with a solution of 40 parts water, 1 part liquid dish soap and 8 parts rubbing alcohol.

Soak the scales thoroughly with this solution and the next day hose off the dead scales with high pressure from your hose....You may have to repeat this process in a day or two to make sure you got them all.....just be careful not to apply this spray on a hot sunny day.....

Ian
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Note where he says, "just be careful not to apply this spray on a hot sunny day....."

We'll...it WAS the month of July after all (but it wasn't in full sun)....

What's a girl to do?

Ken, when is the ideal time to apply a systemic (I also use the Bayer systemic)?

I'd spend the big bucks and buy some real commercial hort oil. I use it on my bay tree for scale, and haven't had any problems. There are several listed dilution rates, and the closest match is for citrus scale on orange trees. It kills the scale, then the next thunderstorm washes it off.

My comment ("must have been a doozy") wasn't facetious. Horticultural oils, when applied according to label instructions, should never cause defoliation. It's when we disregard those directions that we get into trouble. Of course, a home-made concoction won't have any instructions.

Your recipe is not oil based at all, by the way. In this instance, I suspect that the culprit in the defoliation was the dish soap. Not only was the amount of detergent excessive (yikes!), but many dish detergents can cause real problems for plants, even when used in small amounts. Again, home-made concoctions can be hazardous to our plants. (Not always, but sometimes.)

I agree with the advice given by mad gallica. Spend a little money on a good commercial horticultural oil product and use it wisely. Every gardener, organic or not, should have some in their arsenal.

Thanks for the correction - I meant to say horticultural spray, not oil.

Two more questions -

Does scale go "dormant" in the winter or does it die off?

Once I know the problem is no longer a problem, am I using the horticultural oil as a preventative, or as a treatment?

In my experience, Scale goes dormant in the winter. It certainly doesn't die off.

oil is sprayed on active scale.. smoothering the new hatchlings.. or crawlers.. ergo .. TIMING IS IMPERATIVE ....

in z5 .. if the tree is dormant.. then i suppose one would presume that the scale must be dormant also ... though i will defer on that .. i just dont care enough to check.. lol

regardless.. its useless as a preventative ... it must smoother a non-scaled babe ... that is how it suffocates them.. they have no hard shell to protect them ...

anyway.. why are you still dealing with this.. its pollution to oil spray a plant you already used a systemic on.. isnt it .. or did i forget the facts ...

or i am all wrong.. lol ... let me tell you though. ... not once in 20 years.. have i actually timed it all perfectly ... lol .. and that i why i prefer the systemic route ... i am not going around.. plant to plant.. with a jewelers loop.. looking for them ... i usually think of them in july.. when i start seeing the hordes of ants milking them for the honeydew ... by which time the oil is useless and actually hurts the plant ...

ken

The problem with the systemic is 1. I don't know how effective it was, if at all, because 2. my neighbor has an entire row of lombardy poplars directly on the other side of my fence...just inches away, so don't know if the poplars...or POPULUS to be pc (LOL)...are sucking up all the available moisure...and the systemic...just a thought

are you messing with me.. or just missing the PROPER APPLICATION OF PESTICIDES????

we do not respray ... until we are sure there is a need for such ... and you wont know that until the crawlers come out in spring....

though you might go out there now.. and gently scrape one off.. and see what is under the shell ... a dead one would be totally dedicated ... a live one.. would presumably have a body under there ...

do NOT redo the bug pesticides.. until you are sure it is NECESSARY ...

ken