Have you considered a galley kitchen with a walk-in pantry?

Thank you. This is actually great. We had considered a walk-in pantry but when prioritizing - that was lower on the list and more of a “like to have” than a must. The major concerns for my husband involved light and open floor plan. He actually gave in to me by not totally opening the dining room to the kitchen. (He. Loves. Natural. Light). Sigh!

The other issue is my parents. They’re not really DR eating folks and find eating in the kitchen (think Waltons, dating myself here LOL) more comfortable. So the walk in pantry takes away the eat-in option.

This was impressive! More ideas?

You aren't exaggerating the seating issue. Island seating is uncomfortable for lots of people. Elderly people with joint or balance issues, young children, young and middle-aged adults with injuries or physical disabilities. Also, I would hate having my kitchen open to a guest sleeping area. Couldn't go make coffee until everyone woke up. And as a guest, uncomfortable place to sleep. Maybe your husband just wants to discourage overnight guests?

If you are willing to use the dining room for everyday seating, mamagoose's plan is great.

Can you move the diningroom door over so you can make an L shaped kitchen and keep the kitchen table? or the galley is great, especially if you want to open up the wall to DR so parents can sit comfortably. i don’t really understand why uou are talking about opening up to study or whether you are opening to DR.

Thanks mcarroll16. I actually was going to take my parents to a kitchen showroom to see if they could sit comfortably at an island if it had adjustable seating to see if it could work. Maybe if I had school aged kids it would work better - just never been a fan. I would need to think about it more just didn’t “take” to a tiered island - one side prep, other side table height.

To clarify - the kitchen/study wall would have pocket doors and while my parents (or any guests) were visiting - the doors would remain closed. It’s when or guest are not here, is when he sees that study - which leads to a solarium - an extension of the kitchen. He likes to entertain (I’m the introvert).

Do you think even with pocket doors that remained closed (he claims that I should not let noise etc dissuade me as you can always take care of that acoustically (hmm, dunno), would guests still find it awkward.

I’ll admit - I always had an eat-in kitchen. I’d have to get use to the only eating in the DR option.

Funny how some of these decisions are based on “feel”.

I like that walk in pantry! But what if you opened up to the dining room ( that gives you a place for lower seating and you will be more likely to use that area ) . Then do an interesting wrap around of counter for the stove area ( or some form of this idea )

If you use the study as a bedroom, I wouldn't want to open that up.

Good luck

lharpie - Thank you. Where would I move the DR door? And my husband’s idea was to open BOTH walls - to the study (the builtins would move) AND the dining room. So for an already small kitchen why we were opening any walls were beyond me. He grew up on the beach so natural light is sacred to him I guess! LOL and Grrr.

The compromise to me were pocket doors to study (not fully open) and two doors to dining room with wall in the middle - maybe two arched doorways or French doors - those were details but he knew he wanted it open.

Debbie Washburn - Thank you. Hmmm - I have a feeling that verdict may be leaning towards rethinking the opening to the study because of the bedroom use - even if part time.

My husband likes the idea of fully opening the dining room. I’ll confess - the DR has become a respite room for me ( beautiful south west facing light, quiet, wonderful view). My husband wants to see all that from the kitchen.

He’s also more of a cook and entertainer, so open is a plus. I’m Ms. Messy Sprawl Clean Later cook, so the thought of fully opening it up gives me hives. Hahaha! Beggars can’t be choosers so I’ll rethink the use.

I welcome being pushed from my comfort zones!

Widening the opening between the kitchen and DR was the one of the best decisions I made in my remodel. We moved an exterior (mudroom) door from the kitchen to the DR, so it greatly improved our traffic flow--it's great to have the open feel and connection between the two rooms. We are very casual about meals--my adult kids and grandkids prefer to sit at the island, even though when they were young we ate every meal in the DR.

Here's a plan that preserves the eating area for a table and makes it easier to move the fridge to the left of the sink. However, the prep triangle is wider and zones overlap:

You have the floor space for extra deep counters on the sink wall, to make a full-depth fridge look more built-in.

NKBA guidelines

New to Kitchens? Read me first.

Discussions--Extra-deep counters

Discussions--all drawer bases

Discussions--dishes in drawers

Do you have to have a DR door? The space could be very pretty with a large cased opening in the center, and then the table might feel more like a part of the kitchen. If you want to close it off, you could consider glass doors in a center opening. That will give you some flexibility. (Do your parents feel like DR eating is too formal? There might be ways to make it feel less so, even as simple as a casual table cloth.)

Here's another idea which would give the study its own closet, thereby making it an official bedroom for resale and appraisal purposes.

I'd love to see a little more counterspace on each side of the range. What if you took mamagoose's last plan, but also:

*extend the countertop out at least a foot past the end of the powder room wall;

*put a reach-in pantry cupboard on the back side of the powder room (that is, the horizontal wall that dead-ends at the study);

*used a smaller table, perhaps a rectangular one;

*switch the door between the kitchen and stairwell to a pocket door, so the door-swing doesn't intrude into the table space.

Sorry, lots of words when a picture would be better, but lack the energy today to draw this all out with my usual Excel improvisations.

Hi Chicagoans. Thank you. Yes, it feels too formal for them, but like you say there’s ways around it.

I’m wondering - if i’m open to opening the kitchen/dining wall (pun intended), should I go for broke and REALLY open it to get that full beautiful view. Photo 1.

Or keep part of the wall to at least keep some options in the kitchen for more cabinetry? Anything? Like in photo 2 with center wall but two archways one side.

Of course, not to scale - just for ideas!

Thanks, MamaGoose! Great ideas! Those builtins are really used that much and a closet would be sooo much more useful. Would you use the to the right of the sink for prep space. That’s a major issue for us right now. We can move the stove in from the window but we won’t gain more space - just rearrange the space we have.

And although you like openness, you don’t like the idea of opening the study wall? I “feel” its awkward - even if whatever door you put there remains closed for guests. Plus, practically we lose precious wall space in the kitchen but husband thinks that value of that openness for both light and access (when no guests) will be much more enjoyable.

Thoughts?

Mcarroll16. Thanks! I will try to picture your ideas - I think i picture them all and agree I need more counter space near the range. How about a virtual Monster drink! Haha!

Ha! I should try that. Although what I should really do is get the software and skills that some other Houzzers use to generate their drawings.

This was husband’s idea. Thoughts?

He thinks this checks every box - (study wall open, semi open kitchen dining wall, more prep space, more eat in feel for parents for kitchen , esp if the chairs adjusted their height for my parents)

Picture this island abutting the stove - we’d still move the stove away from window, add some prep space there, but then picture this island on the right side of stove. Hope this makes sense.

Not to scale of course!

I don't love it If I'm mentally drawing this out correctly, it feels like the table/bar seating area is going to fit awkwardly in, with at least one chair uncomfortably located in the traffic/work path.

I'm guessing your husband wants an island because he wants social time while he's cooking. So here's another idea:

1. Open up the kitchen/dining room completely;

2. Move the sink and DW south a little bit, maybe sink under the "south" half of the window;

3. Move the range to the north side of the same wall;

4. Move the fridge and pantry to the wall where your range is;

5. Put a short peninusula in between the kitchen and dining room, where you can have a few bar seats. Your dining room should be large enough to accommodate the bar seating. And with the whole wall opened up, people who want table seating can easily walk to the dining table.

You could also do a DW/sink/range on the outer wall, fridge/pantry on the inner wall, and keep a kitchen table where you already have one. If you keep a kitchen table, you would want some structural separation betwen kitchen and dining room. So maybe keep a partial wall with two wide doorways as you suggested above. Or, where you have cabinets on the "south" wall between the two doorways, you could put an island or buffet console for serving, or for people to stand at and chat with the cook.

Ok, I got motivated enough to draw. And once I started drawing, I realized it might make more sense to flip the DW and range. Depends on exactly where the sink is located along that wall. Here's the peninsula version of my idea above.

Thanks, mcarroll16. I like your ideas! The one issue is the pantry would cover the north facing window but I could come up with something different. I’m now realizing the benefits of using the dining room seating as the main seating.

Lots of great ideas here! Thanks for the work on this!

Here's another idea with a seating island, but it's easy to walk past to the dining table for more comfortable seating. This lets you seat 3 people at the island, with no one in the cooking traffic path. Easy to walk out to the dining table for comfortable seating. I think it maximizes your husband's goals more than it does your goals though. Is there another good space where you can hangout with privacy? Introverts deserve a good space too.

ETA: Paint erased the dotted lines indicating island overhang. I'm suggesting 15" overhang on the back side and the dining room side. So two seats on the back side of island, one on the dining room, for a more social seating arrangement.

Side thought - will you ever want them to have a private entrance?

what are the stairs for? they outdoors?.... ever want to build them a walk-in shower "added" onto the powder room?

Can the range be exchanged with sink/dw? Or go on west (right wall) (range)

Happyleg - We thought about that but when we saw photos of hoods over the range, we didn’t like it. This time I agreed with my husband - it was too much of an eyesore blocking the beautiful western light we get from the window that’s right above the sink.

Hi everdebz. Both sets of stairs lead to the basement. One across the kitchen and one outside.

Oh and we talked to a friend who installed a wet room, I think it’s called? We liked it. No shower curb. And then no need to enlarge the current bathroom.

I could find another hideaway, mcaroll16. I don’t mind the kitchen meeting more of his goals - esp since he’s the cook. It’s that open to the study/bedroom that honestly gave me the most pause. My parents are come about three- four times a year and stay about three weeks. Soo…most of the time that “study” would serve mostly as an hangout family room area for us both - big tv, sleeper sofa etc.

Oh, yeah. That's a long stay, you definitely need the study to stay a completely separate room. For your sake and for theirs.

I personally would not lose the study/guest room, especially if the whole reasoning is "more light in kitchen".  You can install some sort of decorative transom window o on the wall between the study and kitchen to allow for extra light, just be sure to have a shade of some sort on it in the study so it can still be a guest room.

I would open the kitchen towards the dining room. The idea to have a cased large doorway/opening with sliding doors is good. This will allow our to be open, for light, and mingle-ability, but you could close it off to reduce kitchen noises and hide messes. The sliding doors could have some windows to still allow for light when when closed for privacy.

Galley kitchens are my personal favorite, so I like mama_goose's idea. Be sure to go heavy on drawers for more accessible storage than offered by shelves.

@decoenthusiaste Thanks! May I ask why? I’m still researching but I thought U shaped kitchens were the ideal?

Would the below resolve the island eating vs eat in kitchen idea - if room allowed? Or does it look too awkward or like an afterthought?

This one!

If you've got the room, I think that style is a great compromise. For your kitchen, space is a big question. I would recommend doing physical mockup with boxes and actual chairs, to make sure the seating area has enough room to be comfortable.

Also, on your question about ideal kitchen shape, I can't answer for decoenthusiaste. But I've had 2 galley kitchens and 2 U kitchens, and galleys are much much better. U kitchens are either narrow enough that they are basically a galley with two awkward corners, or wide enough that they have two arms that don't communicate--that is, a single person cooking can't use both countertop areas without a lot of extra steps. Whenever possible, have a galley or an L + island, which functions pretty similarly to a galley.

Thanks mcarroll. You’ve been a great help. Im happy you think that would be a great compromise and not look like a strange appendage. A galley type kitchen is doable so I will put that high on the list as an option.

Since you're thinking about a galley and have access to plumbing on the shared bathroom wall, you could have prep and cooking on the same run. The smaller sink could also be used for coffee prep. The range is still fairly close to the window, and the size of the kitchen doesn't really justify a second sink, but with kids and guests helping out, separate prep and clean-up zones might be appreciated. You'd need to decide where to locate the trash pull-out--to the left of the main sink or under the prep counter:

Thanks MamaGoose. Near the prep area makes sense to me. And to throw a whole other new idea in the mix, that mudroom (sunroom) on the plans is open for discussion. It’s glass enclosed and there is “step down” from the kitchen to that area. Figure it’s ez to make it level to the kitchen. Also from the outside it looks like it was a box of windows placed on a concrete stoop?

Can that serve as an extension of the kitchen but also serve as a mudroom ? It’s just DH and me (with visiting parents of course) so not a huge need for a lot of coat or boot storage or those cubbies used by kids?

Omitting the door between the kitchen and sunroom would allow extra light and might help your husband accept that the study remains closed off from the kitchen. If it's leveled with the kitchen and all you need is a drawer under the window seat, then I think that's a good idea.