3500-4000 for a 4 ton Carrier HP system?

Coastal or inland location?

Dealer should offer improvement suggestions on airflow issue to bonus room.

What size living area is each zone?

Existing system is a Sgl stage HP condenser?

Post back.

IMO

This post was edited by tigerdunes on Sun, Nov 2, 14 at 12:20

Coastal area. Maybe 6 miles to beach.
2150 downstairs 250 upstairs bonus
Current is single stage
please offer input on pricing..

IMO it's a bad idea to decide on price and model before getting quotes. Get quotes first, then post back with their prices and the equipment/work they suggest. Prices vary greatly by contractor and by area, so it's hard across the internet to say which system would fit your budget.

The hurricane in your bonus room is typical of zone systems where the zones have a large difference in size. Zoning works best with multistage/variable speed equipment, which does not come cheap. If you want a very small zone, it's best to use the manufacturer's integrated systems like Carrier Infinity, Lennox Harmony, Trane ComfortLink, which can also get expensive. A room that small would be best handled by a mini split.

Your pricing budget is not reasonable for any quality system.

I am not going to spec out systems for you.

If you are leaning to Carrier, then call a Bryant dealer. Bryant is sister compant to Carrier and normally less expensive. exact same product.

I consider you to be in a coastal environment. You want a coastal shield. TraneAmStd offers all aluminum coils but this product comes with a price.

New Heat Pump System

Here is my general spec sheet for new system.
both outside and inside units should be replaced to have a properly matched system.

15 SEER, 12.5+ EER, 9 HSPF
best matching VS air handler
full BTUs in both cooling and heating for your rated size
R-410a refrigerant(same as Puron)
scroll compressor preferred
electronic demand defrost preferred
thermostat with "dehumidify on demand" feature
staged backup heat strips
new and correctly sized refrigerant lineset
10 yr warranty on parts and compressor

you want a thorough inspection of your ductwork system. size, overall condition, supply and return lines, insulation qualities, leak test, etc.

any hot/cold spot issues in your home should be addressed.

My personal recommendation is Trane/AmStd, Rudd/Rheem, and Carrier/Bryant.

Depending on your location, I would not purchase a new system that did not have electronic demand defrost.

IMO

Thanks for the knowledge. Working on bids now. Looks like my goal now is to get up and running again with the most I can afford and will get a mini split for the bonus in the next 6 months.

I wouldn't do a mini split for such a small zone/area. Not cost effective.

Get some control over the supply line with a damper control and adjust as necessary.

IMO

Ater getting real world pricing and a wake up call on cost....
Please give me your opinions on this system and price:
$5450 Total
Carrier Performance 15 Seer 4 ton heat pump
Carrier Performance series air handler FV4
Carrier Performance Air Purifier PGAP
Honeywell 8000 Thermostat

Nice system, but I would want a thermostat that has built-in dehumidification control so you can take full advantage of the variable speed blower in that air handler. Ask him to quote the Carrier Edge thermidistat or Honeywell IAQ.

What he is doing with the zoning system? As I said before I highly recommend that it be removed, it could wreak havoc on your new system if left in place, particularly with the variable speed blower. You cannot cram 4 tons of air into a 250 sq room and duct sized for such.

How did he determine the size of the heat pump? I'm hoping he actually did a calculation and didn't just go off the size of the old one.

This post was edited by hvtech42 on Sat, Nov 8, 14 at 11:30

hvtech42... thanks so much for your reply.. my guy is kind of old school.. he didn't do the calculations, however my previous system was a 3.5 ton and couldn't quite keep up with our needs. This is our first new AC system we've ever purchased. We moved from the previous homes before they had to be replaced. The AC guy has always treated us fairly in the past on repairs. He was going to use the Honeywell 8000 series because he said it would also remove the humidity and he trusted that brand the most. He said you don't need any other additions to the system to remove humidity, however online they seem to sell whole house dehumidifiers. I'm tight on cash the pricing seems good. Let me know your thoughts on the Honeywell 8000 and how humidity is removed. Our climate is super humid.

You're spending extra money on a variable speed air handler. Why would you cheap out on the thermostat, and get one that doesn't allow you to take full advantage of the equipment you're buying? The Honeywell 8000 can only overcool to dehumidify. The Honeywell IAQ or Carrier Edge thermidistat can control the speed of the blower and slow it down when more dehumidification is needed. In your climate I would not have this system without a thermostat that can truly control all its functions.

Your old system not keeping up could be because of a multitude of reasons that don't have anything to do with sizing. Maybe your ductwork is sub-par, in which case simply putting a bigger unit on will only make things worse. Speaking of that, if you had 3.5 ton before, did he even figure out whether your ductwork is capable of an increased size? Bigger is NOT better when it comes to HVAC.

You need to think about HVAC as a SYSTEM, not a couple boxes that need replacement. Failure to do that may get you a system that "works", but falls short in comfort, noise levels, and efficiency.

For John

I agree with above post. Don't cripple a nice system with wrong thermostat.

You want Carrier's Edge Thermidistat for handling humidity.

You need to verify AHRI matching number. This is what it should be.

6938245 Active Systems CARRIER AIR CONDITIONING PERFORMANCE SERIES PURON HP CARRIER AIR CONDITIONING 25HCC548A**30 FV4CN(B,F)005L 1400 46500 12.50 15.00 45000 8.50 27400 1 HRCU-A-CB 375 1140 Yes

And please note you want the 005L size var speed air handler with L suffix. This L designates aluminum coil.

If going up in size by 1/2 ton, I would hope dealer has inspected ductwork to verify it can handle the extra CFMs. I would think a 10 KW heat strip based on your location/climate.

Pay attention to above.

IMO

I didn't know the thermostat was incorrect. Going with what he recommended.
I have another company coming out on Monday. These guys are more money and have fancy trucks with logos and all. Going to let them look at the duct work and run calculations. They understood all about the thermostat. Looks like my guy may not completely understand the more modern systems.

The thermostat he suggested will work, it just won't take full advantage of the extra features on the higher end system you would pay for.

I'm a little lat to this conversation, but I have a few thoughts. First of all our house was built in 1939 and was remodeled with new wall insulation and double pane windows in 2005. We're in San Antonio so the humidity is significantly lower than at the coast, but still horrible. In San Antonio, as in Florida and all the gulf states, the AC must run 24 hours a day in the summer. 23 years ago we designed and installed a 2-stage (3-ton 2-ton) Carrier system that was supposed to solve the humidity problems. I'm an aerospace engineer and wanted to work with my installer, a mechanical engineer and friend of the family, to design this system. It never worked right. Apparently there was something wrong with our calculations or assumptions, because we had humidity running around 75% inside. We had over designed the system and specified way too much cooling for the house. After about 5 years I went with a custom modified condenser unit from a guy in Houston. The modified unit had solenoids that activated flaps to block the air flow and super cool the coils. The installer was skeptical that the unit would freeze, but in 15 years of use it did not. So that was fine until the condenser finally sprung several leaks. Fortunately Carrier had come up with the Infinity system which, in theory, does everything the kluged condenser did but did it as an integrated system. The 2005 remodel was to add another 800 square feet to the house. Finally the AC started working better with the added square footage. Two years ago I replaced the leaking condenser with the Carrier Infinity condenser, heater/blower, and thermostat. That finally solved my humidity problems. Humidity runs about 45-48% now. It finally feels great in the house. We can keep the thermostat set to 79 in the summer and, because of the low humidity, it feels very cool when you walk inside.

If you are thinking of getting a dehumidifier, you need to know that your air conditioner is a dehumidifier. That's all air conditioner's do is dehumidify. Cold air is just a byproduct of the dehumidification process. So if you need a dehumidifier after you get an air conditioner installed, then you are admitting that you didn't put enough thought or money into the AC system to begin with. Or that it isn't performing right. A well designed AC unit should pull your humidity down to the 40s. If it doesn't, then call the installer back to fix it. But if you skimped on the AC design up front, then you have yourself to blame for needing additional dehumidification.

All that was to say I think you might be making a mistake going with a Carrier Performance system. Look a little harder at the Carrier Infinity system. It is designed to pull more moisture out of the air.

" So if you need a dehumidifier after you get an air conditioner installed, then you are admitting that you didn't put enough thought or money into the AC system to begin with. Or that it isn't performing right. A well designed AC unit should pull your humidity down to the 40s."

interesting.
something to consider is that the house/ductwork can have
so much leakage that humid air is being drawn into the
house/ductwork.

big difference in sizing a system for a leaky house/ductwork
and a tight house with tight ductwork.

I think OP is on the right track with mid range efficiency
& variable speed air handler unit.
I'm in humid La. have 15 SEER heat pump
with vs ahu. my house & ductwork is tight.
in summer RH stays 52-55% range.
in shoulder seasons (little call for a/c)
humidity creeps up.
I have a whole house dehumidifier...ultra aire
70 pt dehumidifier that can pull RH down to whatever
% I chose.

ductwork should be evaluated for size/design
& mastic sealed to reduce leakage.

best of luck & Merry Christmas