Your kitchen will be VERY dark. You're giving prime real estate to the master bath. Your other two bedrooms are very, very small.

Grill deck seems strangely far from the kitchen.

Traffic pattern from the non-master bedrooms to garage and/or laundry seems like it takes you right through kitchen and dining room, which I wouldn’t like.

Master bedroom is right of mud room and dining room, which wouldn’t appeal to me. I’d want it farther removed from public spaces and main traffic pattern into the house (and dirt/water/snow that comes in via mud room).

Anglophilia and Kristin- great point about the kitchen being dark - in general I wouldn't want an overhang on the porch either. And I'd not thought about the potential for the mess tracking to the master - and agreed about the grill deck, that seems odd.

Virgil - wholeheartedly agree regarding the site. I assume we'll need to work with an architect when we get to that point. I am a little concerned about actually putting all of the process together - our one friend who built passive solar with a masonry stove had to source their windows themselves and buy a kit stove and hire a mason separately. I've read more permaculture stuff than design, so I'm not sure what to expect or what to look for in an architect who might be a good fit.

I think the "open" part of the kitchen-dining-living I liked more for heating from the masonry stove.

Also, what does one typically bring to an architect when beginning the process? The part I do know of this process (the very discrete items I want) is just a list and photos, but part of the value of an architect highlighted in these threads is how they can create the more intangible experience of a home. My question is more how do I best prepare now for when we would look for and meet with an architect?

We met with our architect before making an offer on our property. We talked with him about what we wanted, what we like and don’t like about our current house, how we lived, etc. then he walked the property with us and gave us an idea of whether it would be a good site for what we wanted in a house. Bringing him in early was tremendously useful.

From cpartist's reply on [this building post[(https://www.houzz.com/discussions/building-and-where-to-save-money-ideas-dsvw-vd~4056449):

********

Here's a post I [cpartist] offered to someone else a while back. It would be well worth your time to read the threads.

Also I HIGHLY recommend the book, The Not So Big House by Sarah Susanka

As mentioned, you're spending 6 figures of your hard earned money. Why go through the hassle of building what is basically a tract house when you can build something that is special?

"Five Rules for Better Home Design

Questions on Changing around a floor plan

Architecture and Symmetry

Sarah Susanka and Bubble Diagrams

Some thoughts from one of the architects on this forum:

"...had some second thoughts about posting here as it might be interpreted as hawking for work which I'm not being plenty busy, but on the other hand I want you to be in a situation where you're spending a healthy six figure chunk of your hard earned money the best way possible and I write this advice for the lurkers too! Especially since there are no "do overs" in building a whole house.

So with that said and in lieu of a massive retype by me, let me point you to a coupla threads......

Get somebody CREATIVE to sit down with you for a design session as CP described above. Doesn't have to be expensive or time consuming. Here's a link to one: http://ths.gardenweb.com/discussions/3887104/what-should-i-expect-from-my-architect-long?n=17 Scroll down to my 5/12/16 post. And there's a photo there of what one of these sessions looks like. It's not a bunch of hocus pocus "man behind the curtain" stuff. And while you're here, scroll down 2 posts to my thoughts on trusting a CREATIVE designer and the place for preconceived ideas. My guess is, and I'd agree if you said it's pure speculation, with all the cutting and pasting you're doing you haven't realized that a leap of faith is required on your part for the best outcome.

And here's another link from someone on this board who did exactly that: http://ths.gardenweb.com/discussions/3598813/we-fit-an-architect-into-our-budget-and-it-was-so-worth-it?n=17

And, for a little self education, here's a list of great books on good home design: http://ths.gardenweb.com/discussions/3281434/book-suggestions?n=10

And last but not least, here's a great thread on what makes for good home design. Get a cup of coffee, a comfortable chair and spend some time going through it. It's long but worth the read. All of us design folks chimed in there (along with many others) so you get all the great thoughts and ideas in one convenient location http://ths.gardenweb.com/discussions/3285825/what-makes-a-house-have-good-design?n=39"

Kristin - that sounds very smart, especially about recognizing the potential of the site and just generally being on the same page.

Is this fairly typical? (Do architects expect this?)

beckysharp - thank you for all of the reading! I have read the Not So Big House, though it was a while back, so I'll check it out again. I do think that's the spirit of how we're approaching this.

Finding the right-fit, creative person seems to be it. I'd heard the advice for a friend regarding health issues that they should look for a curious doctor. Although an obviously very different field, I would love to find someone curious, creative, and interested.

A good architect will be interested in Passive Solar, even if they aren’t an expert on it. That won’t stop them from talking to the right consultant to make sure your project is on track. Just like the would consult a soils engineer for expansive clay soils on a site.

Or, there’s nothing wrong with you getting a minor in thermal massing and window glazing strategies for solar gain since it will directly affect your build greatly. A good Architect also isn’t threatened by a homeowner’s academic research, as long as the homeowner approaches the project as a collaboration where input from all manner of sources is welcomed.

Good projects result from happy people accepting help and being a partner.

We would have bought our lot no matter what but I do wish we had our designer on site with us and sharing the pros cons of it compared to bylaws and local rules. It would have better prepared us for what was coming!

The main problem with the plan is that it is not yours. Contact a local architect and make a new home that is yours; meets your needs and fits your site. Don't try to take someone else's plan and repair it to call it yours.

Finding the right-fit, creative person seems to be it.

As one of the other architects ^^^^^ on this forum once observed about finding the right architect, "It's akin to selecting a spouse, you will know when you find the right one. It's even easier, you don't have to sit through boring dinners or watch movies together."

Here is something to contemplate on home design:

"We know a house must have a bathroom and must be well heated. But few of us have been taught that sheer utility is not the end of things. Few of us are taught to look for beauty, that the ultimate value of a civilization lies largely in what it contributes to beauty. We hear a great deal about the improvement of the mind, but yet thousands of well educated people live in houses which are too atrocious for words." - Ruby Ross Goodnow from the book The Honest House

Thanks for posting that, Mark. I knew about Ruby Ross Goodnow because of her interior design work -- she gave legendary decorator Billy Baldwin his first job and he took over her firm when she died in 1950; and she ghostwrote Elsie de Wolfe's book, "The House in Good Taste". But I didn't realize she had written a book on architecture. This will be some good winter reading, so thank you again : ) .

For anyone else interested:

"The Honest House: Presenting Examples of the Usual Problems Which Face the Home-Builder Together with an Exposition of the Simple Architectural Principles Which Underlie Them: Arranged Especially in Reference to Small House Design" by Ruby Ross Goodnow, 1914

https://archive.org/details/honesthousepres00adamgoog

Count me in on also being glad to have had architectural input during the land shopping phase, even if he wasn't the architect we ended up with (long story). It colored our search.

Speaking of someone who managed to find a kakelugn (REALLY long story), if you're going to do that, find one and commit during the design phase. Mine is a heavy beast, and nearly 10 ft tall. Both needed to be accounted for. You'll also need to find someone willing to install it.

We might should "talk." I'm in the process of building a Swedish-inspired farm house on acreage. :-)

Sounds like a fun start to a project that can be well considered. Will you be looking for the eventual land in your area? If so, your time could be well spent researching local architects and their projects. You'll find one who shares your passion for solar, I'm certain. This person, once identified, can be very useful when selecting a lot for solar, considering the "solar score", looking at orientation/placement to maximize- among many considerations.

I have a friend who was dead set on her "urban dream lot" until her architect pointed out that she could be vulnerable to future development of the lots surrounding. Everything from "your light could be blocked by bigger buildings" to hey- that view could disappear, too, depending on what your neighbors do. Instructive for her. She didn't buy that one.

Next-some real time spent considering exactly how you want to live in the house- how it will function. What features, in past homes, have worked well for you? Which haven't? Do you plan on aging in place, and if so- will you have two stories, or one? How do you entertain? In common areas, how any people, max, would you need to accommodate with a gathering? Is that even important? Will you plan on your children having rooms in your home-even as young adults?

Office and or craft room? Do you have pieces of "forever furniture" that you'll need to plan space for? What sort of wall space do you need to accommodate art? When you're stressed, what sort of space makes you happy?

This "dream" time was assigned to us by our architect the last custom we had designed. We took it seriously, had some fun (do we want a slide from the second story- HA) and resulted in a really short design window for us, once turned over to our architect to make a reality.

Good luck and keep us posted.

Your kitchen will be VERY dark.

Take away the "very", and I agree.

Your other two bedrooms are very, very small.

Again, take away the adjective, and I agree. My girls' bedrooms are each 12x12, and they're comfortable rooms -- but you should decide just how much furniture you expect them to hold.

My daughter who's still at home has a double bed, a double dresser w/ mirror and two bookcases (one tall, one wide). In the other room, we have a queen and no dresser ... this room has held a queen + two dressers in the past, and it was tight with those three large pieces.

You say it'll be years 'til you build ... so your kids'll be teens /possibly be out the door by the time you build. These rooms are not large, gracious suites, but they are adequate.

I'd add windows to the "blank" walls in the kids' rooms; light from two directions is always a good thing.

I would add a pocket door to this "wing" of the house so the children (or guests in the future) can "close it off". This would also allow you to "close it off" to save on heating /cooling once the children are out of the house.

The bath is cramped. A person will essentially stand on the toilet to use the sink. I wonder if you could steal from the front porch /push the closet forward ... so you could have a larger, more comfortable bath with a larger vanity /better storage ... I drew in a shower instead of a tub for no particular reason.

Grill deck seems strangely far from the kitchen.

Yes, that is a problem ... with a screened porch on the side, I think I'd lose the rear porch /go with a deck or patio instead across the back.

Traffic pattern from the non-master bedrooms to garage and/or laundry seems like it takes you right through kitchen and dining room, which I wouldn’t like.

Yes, I don't think you have enough space between the kitchen and the dining room. I'd extend the dining room out a bit.

Here's what I'd do with this plan:

- Extend the dining room out so you have space for a comfortable pathway.

- Redo the garage entry so you have a multi-purpose room to the right as you enter ... on the right wall /wall shared with the garage you'll have a small coat closet and the washer/dryer (venting won't be bad ... run the hose down the edge of the garage /only one bend) ... across from this wall you'll have a long wall of pantry shelving ... you'll have a door between the laundry and the master closet, which is relocated towards the center of of the house.

- The master bath is now on the corner, allowing it to have windows on two sides ... and you have a nice linen closet that didn't exist before ... or you could extend the shower and/or tub to really huge proportions.

- You'll lose the French doors in the master bedroom, but I'd let the master "poke out towards the back", allowing for windows on three sides, and I'd place the head of the bed in the middle of the back wall.

Overall, I think this layout has the beginnings of a good empty-nester plan.

If you're going to hire an architect anyway, I might just ditch this plan altogether. I think there are better ways to get what you want, pay good attention to passive solar principles, and do so more economically than what you've got here. It seems like it has a lot of bump-outs, and is awfully deep for 2000 sq ft. If you sttreeettccchh it a bit, you can get more southern exposure, more light, and a better flow, I think.

Thank you for all of the responses! I very much appreciate the advice and guidance for my thinking and planning.

Sophie - thank you for the insight that the architect is not isolated. And it makes sense that they'd have more access, or ideas of how to access, other experts.

Alison, Laurie and Holly- great support for finding working to find "our" architect now. We have been looking for a few years, and being able to benefit from his/her insight on the site. My little dream is having a few chickens, but the towns, villages, cities all have different oddball requirements - like the city allows chickens on their small city lots, while the town surrounding requires 20 acres. We're on an acre now and we were able to have a horse, but no chickens. Anyway, that part I can research, but looking beyond the lot and having a sense of the potential of the space would be very helpful.

Mark - The main problem with the plan is that it is not yours - Well said! This is how we've felt with all the remodeling in previous homes and why we wanted to build. This is a good reminder to invest wisely in the planning and design.

Architectrunnerguy (and Mark?) - Much of my apprehension is related to finding that right-fit person, and the comparison to finding a spouse - maybe my apprehension isn't misplaced? (ha)

Holly - I would love to hear about your home! Do you have a thread here with your progress (I'll try searching)? Great point regarding finding the stove first. I'd found a few sites that seem to sell either new or recovered, but I don't have any idea about shipping (which I imagine would be a bit ridiculous) or installation.

Laurie - Great idea to use this time to further dream and visualize. Much of what we're thinking now is based on our previous homes. I'd read somewhere recently of designing on a human scale, and I appreciated your comment about considering specific furniture (piano) and art.

mrspete - thank you for your thorough critique! Though our ideas now are based on our previous homes, we're also limited by our experience. We've tried visualizing how different plans would work, but I'm not seeing a lot - I'm not seeing the problems because of my lack of experience or learning. The extra windows in bd 2 and 3; the pocket door to close off the extra bedrooms is smart (privacy for those visiting, reducing our living space as we age). And extending the space of the dining room - for a walkway I can see, which I hadn't been considering, as well as getting the immediate entry to the closet in the master. And the windows in the master bath. And planning for the bed in the master.

In our renovating our old house, as we've taken off layers of earlier remodelings, we've found there are ways the house was designed to work, ways it works better. We both get into the idea that technology is not neutral, and it follows that homes are designed as well.

edited to add - designed for the needs and wants of a specific owner, which would manifest as bias; the structure shapes how we live, not just our use shaping the structure. It's everything you've all been telling me :-)

I do have a thread (that dissolves occasionally into silliness, as all good threads do) here.

When I was looking, I got quotes for importing and installing a tile stove that ranged from $18K-25K. So I sort of gave up on the idea as too expensive for what I was doing.

Then, my husband and I walked into a local architectural salvage place and, lo and behold, there was a Swedish Tile Stove that they'd had for something like 10 years. I talked them down from the posted price. And also got a story: Apparently it belonged to a local philanthropist who'd been part of the Enigma project during WWII. The stove was supposedly a gift from the Swedish ambassador for his service - estimated to have ended the war about 1-2 years earlier than it would have, otherwise. It appears that the stove was installed (in somewhat truncated format) in his lake house. When his wife passed away, he sold the house, which was torn down to make room for something grander.

I don't honestly know how many of them are wandering about in the wilds of the U.S. the WI/MN area is probably more likely than most places to have one you might happen across.

However, once you find one, then you have to find someone willing to install it. Because the only part that really gets moved is the tile cladding. The firebrick core has to be rebuilt each time. (And, apparently, rebuilt every 40-60 years or so of active use.)

It's probably worth poking around in local salvage yards, if you have such a thing. Though they do seem to be something of a rarity.

I'll also point you at a blog post by Tim Andersen, which you might find inspirational: