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homechef59

Replacing Failed Travertine Shower Stall Scope of Work Please Help

homechef59
4 years ago

I recently bought a home that was built in 2003. It is a truly custom home built by a builder for himself and his family. He actually lived in it for a few years and sold during the housing crash. It is well built and has some very nice finishes. It is located in a nice neighborhood with higher end homes for the area. It is generally in good condition and has been kept in good repair. But, it is showing some age. We are the third owner.


Last week we noticed a drip from the master bath shower stall into the recently encapsulated crawl space. We just encapsulated this area in October. The area was dry at the time of encapsulation. We made sure that there was no more water and called the insurance company. We had the remediation company out to look at the damage. They have determined that the damage is coming from a failed shower pan. They are going to cover the damage.


The entire master bathroom is covered in natural travertine. The entire shower is travertine. The flooring, the shower, the bath surround and the countertops are travertine. This particular travertine is now 15 years old. It is a very light blond color travertine. I have two or three pieces of each size tile that was used in the basement. It is no longer commonly found.


According to the contractor, I have two courses of action. One, I can try to match up the travertine. If I can match it, we only have to tear out the shower and rebuild the shower with the same material. I have two companies looking for acceptable to me travertine. Travertine is a miserable material to use in a shower. I would have never personally selected it. We will need to seal it regularly and it is very porous. I kind of hate to put this material back into a shower.


Two, if I can't match up the material, I can tear out much of the bathroom and start over with a new material selection. Lucky for me, I don't want to move any walls. I'm happy with the layout. But, the shower stall, flooring, tub surround, and countertops would have to come out and the material be changed. The tub and wall of mirrors hopefully could stay in place. I'm nervous about the mirror given that there are travertine backsplashes installed. The shower door, toilet, cabinets and plumbing fixtures would have to be removed and could be reinstalled. I could select new tile, counter and flooring. Everything is in good condition. I could see reusing the cabinets. They are nice. I would end up with a bath with new finishes.


I am an experienced renovator, so I have no illusions about how much mess and dust this will generate. What I have to do is make a judgement about the matching of materials and how much trouble I want to go to. Is it worth it to go all in or settle for almost good enough?


The offending leaking shower and the heinous bathroom sconces. (They are out of here regardless of the outcome. That green is pretty bad, too. I didn't pick it out.)


Bath · More Info

This is the counter top. It's in three pieces and has a backsplash. The wall is all mirrors to the ceiling.

Bath · More Info


This is the offending failed shower stall. It's nice, but it leaks.

Bath · More Info


This is bath tub surround. How big a PITA would this be to remove the tile and replace with another surface?

Bath · More Info


This is the floor. It's travertine, too.

Bath · More Info


Anyhow, that's what I've got. I'm trying to make a decision. Understand that insurance will pay for the bulk of the removal, material and installation. I've just got to decide the scope of the project.



Comments (38)

  • homechef59
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Left out the vanities and mirrors. This is only one end. There is another vanity.

    Bath · More Info


  • Susan Murin
    4 years ago

    Honestly, I would gut it now that it’s failing. It is not an optimal material and the room is showing its age in a variety of ways.

    homechef59 thanked Susan Murin
  • homechef59
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Susan, Be brutal. I'm asking for it. Please list the ways it is showing it's age. It's important to understand how someone perceives it. I'd appreciate it.


  • homechef59
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    That green is pretty bad. I can't imagine what the previous owner was thinking. Quite the combination.

  • Zalco/bring back Sophie!
    4 years ago

    It looks like it was very tastefully built during the Tuscan/Old World Look phase of home finishes. If you do not care for travertine, get rid of it now. Just don't jump on the all gleaming white marble look instead (I say this as someone who really likes that look, btw.)

  • Helen
    4 years ago

    The bathroom is pretty outdated - and I say this as a person who doesn't particularly care about "trends". I am probably prejudiced because I didn't like the travertine Tuscan look particularly when it was trendy either so in your position I would use it as an opportunity to gut and remodel to MY TASTE. Again I say this as a person who would NOT gut a bathroom in good condition just because it wasn't my taste.


    However, it does come down to budget in the end. If you can afford to gut and remodel to your taste, then this is an excellent opportunity to do so because attempting to match - especially with something as hideous as travertine just doesn't seem worth it. If your budget doesn't allow a gut, then is the time to try to figure out some way to rebuilt the shower that isn't travertine but complements what you can't afford to change.


    As for the new bathroom - what do you like? If you have faith in your current GC ask for his expert opinion on how to protect the mirrors since you want to keep them. Or do you?

  • Odell Home
    4 years ago

    I agree with others. Unless you like this look, i would support a complete revamp. Lose the travertine. The bathtub has a nice shape, was it a standalone tub by any chance? Also, the shower space looks a little too closed in for my taste, so i would check with a GC on how to open it or make it feel more open. Lighter paint on cabinets too perhaps.

  • cpartist
    4 years ago

    Time to gut it and do what you like.

    You can put a stone on the tub ledge that matches the new one you'll put on the vanities.

    Do you even use the tub?

    I would absolutely get under mount sinks.

  • Susan Murin
    4 years ago

    Ok, you asked! The very enclosed shower...the Tuscan vanities with the complex toe kicks, the slipper tub. It’s not awful and my conscience wouldn’t let me rip it all out if there wasn’t a good reason (though I could afford it it would feel wasteful)...but you’ve got a reason in your failing shower pan. Just the impetus you need! Each time I’ve done a major update of something I’ve looked back and asked myself why I didn’t do it sooner.

  • cpartist
    4 years ago

    I doubt you could even find matching travertine.

    homechef59 thanked cpartist
  • calidesign
    4 years ago

    I think you may be able to find the matching travertine, but as someone who had a full master bath in travertine, it is a porous material, hard to keep clean, and you will eventually have problems with pitting. I think you could just re-do the shower in a very simple cream color porcelain tile while leaving the rest. You can also find porcelain tile that looks exactly like travertine, and in your enclosed shower, the mix of materials could work. But this seems like a good opportunity to redo the whole space while it's being done anyway in a more updated style.

    homechef59 thanked calidesign
  • PRO
    User
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    What I would suggest for you would depend on how much you used and enjoyed that tub. But it would be a gut. And a rebuild that factored in aging in place. With NO porous holey travertine anywhere.

    For me, I‘d do a big curbless shower where the tub was located, and convert the old shower to storage, or one of the compact washer/dryer single units for a small second master laundry. With a drain there, that would be easy, and incredibly useful.

    Add a new comfort height bidet toilet, accessible behind a half wall, not an enclosedtoilet room, with blocking in place for grab bars. The vanities and closets and the rest would get redone, and might even get rearranged a bit. It depends on the actual layout.

    homechef59 thanked User
  • thinkdesignlive
    4 years ago

    Homechef - is this your forever home or are you concerned about resale in the near future?

  • homechef59
    Original Author
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    Will keep this home for 5 to 10 years. Retirement is 5 years away. Any money I put into it will have to be for personal comfort. Most of this will be paid for by insurance. I know I won't get any money out of it.

    I've owned many homes. The last two someone knocked on our door and bought them even though they weren't for sale. So, never say never.

    The shower already has great grab bars in it. We will reinstall those. The previous owner was elderly, but not infirm. I will never use the tub. I just plan on leaving it there for next owner. It's more trouble to tear out than it's worth. It's a soaking tub, no jets. That makes it a little more timeless.

    I'm really leaning toward white subway tile shower and tub surround with new countertop and sinks. We'll reuse the cabinets. If it looks too bad, we can always paint them. But, the cabinets are all throughout the house. The question will be the floor. There is a hairline crack right down the middle of the room. Do I really want to get into replacing the floor?

  • lafdr
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    I like the floors and would leave them and only redo the leaking shower. It won't be an issue for the shower tile not to match the bathroom floor, as most do not. I would double check with your insurance. We had a water leak and the insurance was very particular about what they were covering. So you saying it is up to you and they are covering it, doesn't match my experience. They also use pricing lists that are hard to figure out. Fine to push them to cover as big a job as they can. But do clarify what they will or will not cover. Sorry for the stress. It is an opportunity. You are talking about a total bathroom redo, take your time planning it and do not feel rushed. I am guessing there are other showers you can use while figuring out what you want to do.


    In my case, the insurance paid for the damage done by the leak, not the leak repair itself. In your case, what is the damage done by the leak? Has the insurance given you a solid answer that they are paying for replacement and repairs?

  • Sammy
    4 years ago

    Is your insurance company really paying for this? How can that be? Please tell me who your insurance company is and what type of policy you have so that I can switch.

  • Lisette Mauch
    4 years ago

    I am also amazed that your insurance would pay for all this, versus paying for just the shower.

  • drblount10
    4 years ago

    I agree with all esp Cook's kitchen. Budget allowing, get rid of travertine all but floor. Paint or get rid of vanities. Light fixture look ok but easy to change if you like. Some of the mirrors could go too and you just paint the wall where they were. A bigger shower would be nice, freestanding tub might help with space. Not sure what style you like but this can easily be changed from 90's Tuscan to updated traditional. Whites will look good. Or you can go further and redo all incl floor. Do you like traditional style or do you have a different style?

  • chocolatebunny123
    4 years ago

    My experience with insurance was similar to lafdr's experience. We had to have the drywall and tile torn out of our master bath due to faulty windows and a faulty gable that caused water and mold damage. The insurance company was very particular on what they would and would not pay for. For example, if we wanted to move the plumbing in the shower, they wouldn't cover that. They wouldn't cover removing the tile on the floor even though there was mold damage on the subfloor. We went back and forth with them and they wound up paying for part of it because we could no longer get matching floor tiles and we took the opportunity to get something new. We also had to reuse the jetted tub and vanity because they weren't damaged. We were even given an allowance on tile and if we wanted something pricier we had to pay the difference. So while the insurance covered putting the bathroom back together, we had to pay for the cost of new windows and a new gable. So while I'm thankful they covered something, we wound up spending much more than I thought we had to.


    If I had the budget I would get new floor tile and install radiant heat underneath (if you're in a cold weather climate). That is one of the things my husband wished we had spent the money on but we were spending so much at the time, we didn't want to spend any more than we had to.

  • homechef59
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Re repair: Correct, insurance will not pay for the item that failed, the shower pan. That just doesn't cost that much. They will pay for the damage that it caused. They will pay to demolish everything that comes out in order to make the repair. Their contractor has already agreed that the entire shower stall will have to be demolished. Because they can't match the tile, they have to pay to replace with something else of similar type and cost. That means most or all of the materials have to be removed and replaced because they don't match. Because the tub surround is the same material, it is covered, too. In this case, the flooring is considered a matching product, as well. The entire room will have to be painted by them, too. It's a cascading situation.


    We'll get all of this hashed out before we get going. There won't be any surprises.


    Thanks for everyone's input on this. I just met with my designer. Between all of you and her, we have now brought DH on board. We've convinced him that this is an opportune time to update it for the future.


    We are going to demo the shower, tub top and surround, remove the countertops and flooring. We'll reuse and reset the vanities We are going to install new flooring, tile in the shower and tub. We will reset the vanities with new countertops and sinks. We will reuse all of the faucets, controls, shower door and toilet. If they break the mirrors when they are working on it, insurance will have to pay for those, too. I hope they don't, I want to keep the mirrors.


    If I don't like how the vanities look, I can always paint them. I'm going to Rub and Buff the lighting fixtures with a new, updated silver finish.


    I'm definitely not throwing everything away. I'm just going to neutralize and update where needed. White subway tile, here I come. I like white bathrooms. That's the plan. Insurance will pay for most, I'll pay for the rest.

  • PRO
    Patricia Colwell Consulting
    4 years ago

    IMO this would be a good time to redo that whole dated room see what insurance will cover then do the rest your self I would use 12 x24 porcelain floor tile and also use the same ones in the shower a nice marble look white with gray veining would be nice. and get a nice alcove tub not drop in then you will have a bigger shower. The vinities should not be angled and I for one would not want to save the mirrors since your layout should be different than what it is and I think those vanities no matter what you do to them will alswys have poor storage and look very dated.

    homechef59 thanked Patricia Colwell Consulting
  • PRO
    Kristin Petro Interiors, Inc.
    4 years ago

    I recently met with homeowners who are in this EXACT same place. Travertine shower needs to be replaced because of mold (builder used travertine in a steam shower!), but they did not want to invest in a complete redo of the entire bathroom. So we suggested using a complimentary tile in the shower, not one intended to match the existing. You can then include an inset design of a travertine-look tile that references the rest of the space. In their case, they have very nice off-white quartz countertops, so that was the color we suggested using for the shower tile.

    homechef59 thanked Kristin Petro Interiors, Inc.
  • homechef59
    Original Author
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    Thanks Patricia for the ideas and input.

    I've decided that I'm not going to move any walls and I'm going to keep the tub in place.

    I get the point. I'm a shower person myself. I like the shape of the shower. It's larger than it looks. It's a warm shower, too. I hate a drafty shower. I don't want to spend money on moving walls and plumbing. Freestanding tubs are a trend. The current tub is in great condition and is a soaker tub, no jets.

    I agree that the octagonal pattern of arrangement isn't optimal. It's dated and was stupid in the first place. Age hasn't made it any better. The house is a custom design by Mitch Ginn. He's local to my area.

    If I start moving walls around, I'll have to deal with the big window and that will involve modifying the exterior of the house. I won't get any better functionality. One thing leads to another and next thing you know, it's quite a project with little expectation of improved flow or monetary return. As a close friend once said, it's good enough. I can work within the footprint as it stands.

    I'm going neutral. 4"x10" beveled subway tile in the shower stall with white grout. 1" hexagonal tile on the floor and ceiling. Classic, simple. It just doesn't get any more neutral than that.

    For the countertops, I'll use Calacatta Arno quartz with white undermount sinks. This is a new quartz product that has a very subtle gold marble stripe on a soft white background. It will tie into the current flooring and cabinets. The only remaining issue is the floor. I've got to talk to my contractor about that issue. One thing leads to another and so forth.

  • Fori
    4 years ago

    I'd redo the shower and leave it at that if I were paying for it (and LIVING through the remodel), if I liked what's there. I don't see anything wrong with it except for travertine in the shower. Obviously you (and the previous owners) are capable of keeping a travertine bathroom looking nice. I rather like the feel of travertine. I don't like the pinky color it often is but yours is a nice shade.


    Because the shower is tucked in like that, a perfect match is not needed. You could even change the door to something frosted or reeded and it can be even less matchy. Ideally you'd be able to reuse the tile that frames the shower opening. As mentioned above, replacing a few select pieces in the bathroom with a coordinating bland Corian or featureless man-made quartz would be acceptable, but I'd want to keep the job as small as possible. If just doing the shower with a plain porcelain tile was an option, I'd take it.

    homechef59 thanked Fori
  • calidesign
    4 years ago

    Beveled tile in the shower will be very hard to clean - just something to keep in mind.

  • PRO
    Kristin Petro Interiors, Inc.
    4 years ago

    We just used 4x12 beveled tile in an installation. Yes, more challenging to clean, but a cool look nonetheless.

    It's seems too contemporary and/or industrial to pair with your other finishes. Maybe consider a similar size tile but in a different texture, like this?


  • HU-9715195
    4 years ago

    Done a ton of remodel. Redo all the travertine and change to better material. I think you will regret a “bandaid” fix that requires constant upkeep when you can replace and skip the constant maintenance. If you want natural stone, marble is great and you only have to seal occasionally. Have your entire bathroom floor and several inches up all the walls (plus all the walls in the shower) done with a waterproof membrane. You will have no water issues going forward.

  • drblount10
    4 years ago

    Hello homechef59, any updates on your bathroom?

  • homechef59
    Original Author
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    Yes. We went on a two week cruise. The dogs were at boarding. During this time, the remediation company did the tear out, repair and replacement. It worked out beautifully. We had used this company previously. So, we had a pretty good idea of their work standard. I'm a control freak and they met my comfort level.

    Prior to departure, I had a meeting with the foreman. We discussed the project thoroughly. I placed an order on file with their preferred tile supplier in advance. I also left the tile setter a document with illustrations explaining what I wanted. They texted me pictures of the progress. It went really well. They did a great job with clean up. I couldn't be happier.

    We decided to go with a reduced project. We did not get into changing the countertop or flooring. We didn't get into the bath surround, either.

    When they did the tear out, it would appear that we discovered the leak very quickly. The Advantech flooring base had gotten wet, but was not soaked, or damaged. The tile setter advised us to keep it in place. He was afraid if he cut it out and replaced it, we would have cracking around the base walls very quickly. The material appeared to be in really good condition. We went with his recommendation.

    What we ended up doing was trimming the entry surround in the same manner as the other doorways in the room. Originally, the surround was made of tile. I thought the transition to a different tile would be too jarring. Thus, the doorway trim and base trim in wood painted to match the rest of the room. I think it works.

    I only have two complaints. One, the shower seat is narrower than it was before. It's really not much of a seat anymore. But, it works as a shelf and place to shave your legs. Two, the new tile wasn't quite as thick as the old tile and the shower door doesn't seal quite as tightly as before. It's acceptable, but not perfect.

    I had them take down the huge sconces over the tub and not replace them. I'm going to buy new ones to replace the old ones. I'm going to apply Rub and Buff to the lights above the sinks to tie them all together.

    The biggest improvement was the removal of the gross green walls. We painted them Sherwin Williams 2017 Creamy. It's a huge improvement. It's amazing what a coat of the right paint can do to update a room.

    Why did I not go for a full renovation? We have decided that our tenure in this house is only around five years. It didn't make sense to pour a lot of money into the bath. We would never get it out when we go to sell. This is plenty good enough and very functional.

    New doorway surround and paint job.


    Alpine · More Info


    New tile. We kept the old shower door, grab bars and shower controls


    Alpine · More Info



    Alpine · More Info


    The tile is a 12"x4" white porcelain subway tile with a bit of a relief.


    Alpine · More Info


    It doesn't get any simpler than hexagonal tile in white with white grout. We used an upgraded white grout that does not mildew throughout.

  • drblount10
    4 years ago

    I love it! I don't blame you for going with renovating just the shower. With the fresh paint it does look much better in the bathroom as a whole. Thanks homechef59!

    homechef59 thanked drblount10
  • jsbonelli
    4 years ago

    I really love the look of all white in the shower, but I found cleaning the walls and floor with white grout to be a huge burden. Hopefully you have better luck!

    homechef59 thanked jsbonelli
  • cpartist
    4 years ago

    Looks great and it does all tie together better with the new color walls.

    homechef59 thanked cpartist
  • homechef59
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    I started a new thread about selecting additional lighting and finishes.


    What Color Finish and Help Me Find Additional Sconces


  • homechef59
    Original Author
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    We are done. Here are some finished pictures.

    Old vanity lighting in oil-rubbed bronze. These no longer work in the space. They were fairly expensive when they were installed. It would be very expensive to replace them.


    Bath · More Info


    I painted the vanity lights with Rustoleum in satin nickel to coordinate with all the other brushed nickel faucets and hardware. Here is the result:


    Bath · More Info


    Over the garden tub were two oversized outdoor entry lights and some strange wall hooks. The I got rid of both and you can see that the green really didn't work in this room.


    Bath · More Info


    I painted the entire room with SW Creamy, both walls and trim. They are different sheens. I got a smoking hot deal at Ebay on some sconces. A man had four sets of two very expensive sconces for sale. They were excess inventory from a hotel. I got each sconce for $25.00. I couldn't have touched them online for less than $350 each. The only problem was the finish. They were in a bright polished brass finish. I buffed the clear protective coating and spray painted them the same satin nickel as the other sconces. All the lighting fixtures have the same finish and coordinate with the faucets, towel bars, hooks and hardware.


    Bath · More Info



    Bath · More Info


    New paint:


    Bath · More Info


    Here is the finished room. I am strongly considering painting the cabinets at a later date. If I do, they will be painted to match the trim and walls.



    Bath · More Info


  • nebbobear
    4 years ago

    Thank you for referring me here Home Chef!!! Lots of tips to glean from this ... I love the shower after you changed it!!!

    homechef59 thanked nebbobear
  • daisiesandbutterflies
    8 months ago

    I know it's 3 years old, but this post has been really helpful to me. Thank you for sharing!

    homechef59 thanked daisiesandbutterflies
  • homechef59
    Original Author
    8 months ago

    I'm still thinking about replacing the countertop and painting the cabinets. But, I've got a kitchen refresh underway and it's taking all my resources. The good new is I have a cabinet refinisher on my speed dial.

    I am sorry that I didn't take live_wire_oak's advice and put in corian in the shower. The white grout has proven to be needy for cleaning. I can keep up, but it's more of a pain than the Corian would have been.

    I will use her advice and use the Corian for the countertops.