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flopsycat1

Southern California lawn care

flopsycat1
3 years ago
last modified: 3 years ago

We recently bought a house in Glendale and are new to the area. With water conservation in mind, are there guidelines for frequency and duration for running the sprinkler system? Also, care of the flowering plants? We don’t know the species of grass, but hope that it is somewhat drought tolerant. Any help is greatly appreciated.

Comments (29)

  • gardengal48 (PNW Z8/9)
    3 years ago
    last modified: 3 years ago

    Very few species of lawn grasses are considered drought tolerant. Most will require an inch of water per week to stay green, lush and healthy.

    Most inground automated sprinkler systems are not programmed to water lawns in the manner recommended for good lawn care. Most are set to come on daily for a few minutes at a time. Instead, it is recommended that that the full amount (that inch) be applied all at once so that rather than just tickling the soil surface with that daily 5 or 10 minute burst, it has a chance to penetrate down fully into the soil profile to some depth, encouraging the grass roots to grow deeper and simultaneously, become more drought tolerant

    If the ground is compacted or hard and water penetration is slow, you can do an on-off situation using a shorter duration, allowing the water to sink in, then watering again until the full inch has been achieved. But do it all at the same time, not spread out on a daily basis. At most, the sprinklers should run only a couple of times a week, if that. You can check for the necessary duration by measuring your sprinkler output with a cat food or tuna can.

    And water as early in the day as possible, even just before dawn. You will minimize the amount of evaporation at that time of day (more water getting to roots, less wasted in the air) and it will allow the maximum time for the grass blades to dry to avoid issues with fungal diseases that occur with late day or evening watering.

    I am also not a fan of pop up irrigation in planting beds and for much the same reason.....too little water applied too frequently. And more water hits the foliage than the soil around the root zone, where it really needs to be directed. I much prefer hand watering as necessary or a slow emission system directed at the roots, like drip or soaker hoses.

    With any kind of irrigation, the best plan is low and slow, watering infrequently but slowly and deeply when you do.

    flopsycat1 thanked gardengal48 (PNW Z8/9)
  • decorpatti
    3 years ago

    gardengal48 has given you excellent advice, and is certainly more knowledgable than I am. i live 32 miles directly west of Glendale, so I will share what we do, which may or not be optimal, but has worked for us for many years. We have a programmable sprinkler system with 6 zones. Starting at 6:00 a.m., 3 days/week, each zone gets 10 minutes for most of the year. Of course, we turn it off during rainy times (not very frequent). During the driest summer months we run it 4 times/week, and I hand water flowers on very hot days if they are looking droopy. Our flower beds have drip/soaker hoses so that the soil is watered. I love my garden, but know very little about gardening; we have had the same gardener for the almost 30 years that we have lived here and he helps me plan and choose plants.Two years ago we added this side-yard garden:



    flopsycat1 thanked decorpatti
  • flopsycat1
    Original Author
    3 years ago

    @gardengal48 (PNW Z8/9) and @decorpatti Thank you both for your responses! You’ve been very helpful.

  • chloebud
    3 years ago
    last modified: 3 years ago

    flopsycat, we live just east of Pasadena. My response is very similar to decorpatti's, including the gardener who's also been doing the yard for close to 30 years (for us and the previous owners). Each city's water regulations can differ a bit so you might check yours. I see the water dept. trucks cruising around checking for violations. Along with other restrictions, we're not supposed to water between 10 AM and 5 PM but that will likely change again with summer around the corner. It still amazes me to see neighbors with sprinklers going at 2 PM. Not a good time to water even with no restrictions. You can easily check Glendale's Water Dept. site online. You should see a section for their residential water restrictions/regulations.

    flopsycat1 thanked chloebud
  • flopsycat1
    Original Author
    3 years ago

    Thanks, @chloebud! Very helpful information.

  • chloebud
    3 years ago

    It's worth checking online since fines can be steep. Ours says they'll first give you a warning with fines issued for repeat violations.

    Just saw the "water police" driving up our street again. Even though it's not 10 AM yet I think they check for runoff.

    flopsycat1 thanked chloebud
  • PRO
    Patricia Colwell Consulting
    3 years ago

    IMO grass should be outlawed it wastes water, needs chemicals to make it “perfect” and in Cal. where so many other things grow get those instead . I have had a no grass yard in BC for the last 30 yrs and will never have grass. 10 mins a day for watering is a joke so when you do that what happens is the grass roots never get deep so it will always require chemicals to keep it green not a healthy lawn IMO why not just go fake grass if you insist on that look.

  • apple_pie_order
    3 years ago

    Your best bet is to take a shovel and see what you have. Some of Glendale (CA) is on alluvial soil with some organic matter. Some is built on granite outcrops with decomposed or not very decomposed granite "soil" with no organic matter other than a top quarter inch layer of old pine needles and dry winter grass. Some is built on clay and granite mixes because of the fault activity over thousands of years. Homeowners in Glendale often amended their soil so they could grow things like grass and flowering plants. If you have mostly granite, you will have to water more frequently (every other day or every third day) than if you have alluvial fill. If you have clay, it will look yellowish or reddish, and it can be watered somewhat less often. The alluvial fill in Glendale and Pasadena has much more organic matter. Finally, some yards have had their top layers completely replaced by good loamy garden soil trucked in from other locations.


    A good strategy is to ask the previous owners for advice on watering. It's a common piece of advice that buyers ask sellers for.

    flopsycat1 thanked apple_pie_order
  • chloebud
    3 years ago
    last modified: 3 years ago

    Some grass in our backyard. It stays green without chemicals and what I consider conservative watering. As decorpatti posted, no more than 10 minutes per zone (ours is 2X weekly right now).


  • decorpatti
    3 years ago
    last modified: 3 years ago

    Patricia Colwell Consulting: We don't use chemicals, and our lawn is not "perfect" by any means. Much of our grass gets a lot of shade (from the house, from tall trees at the west end). The sunny part of our yard is a pool and a large concrete patio. I realize that you are entitled to your opinion that grass should be outlawed, and that you will never have it. That is fine with me. Your posts often contain good advice, but also, they are often demeaning and condescending to other posters or the OP.

  • mojavemaria
    3 years ago

    I’m glad you are concerned about water conservation. I also have had no lawn in the last two houses we’ve lived in and don’t miss it. There are so many beautiful landscapes you can have that use much less water than a lawn. I think a lot of people in the southwest are in denial about the true situation of the water they use. A lot if not most of the water SoCal uses comes from the Colorado river. Here’s a pic of lake mead that shows it’s ever expanding bathtub ring. We need to do more conserving before it becomes dire.

  • loobab
    3 years ago

    Patricia Colwell is giving excellent advice.

    That you don't like it doesn't make it demeaning or condescending.

    In a part of the country that has droughts and terrible fires, one would do well to re-think landscaping.

    There are marvelous artificial turfs now that unless you are laying on them look so real, and need no watering, and have no sun requirements the way lawns do.

    You can still have borders and plots for flowers, vegetables and whatever else you want.

  • loobab
    3 years ago

    For flowers and vegetables you can have discrete pots or raised beds, that you can water with a watering can.

    As opposed to a large lawn watering system for which you will be fined by your municipality.

    There are miniature versions of so many plants now.

    There is someone a few blocks away with two junior sized pomegranate trees that are the most beautiful things. Unfortunately they are not edible, which seems absurd. I would want a mini-pomegranate that is edible, wouldn't you?

    I just love the mini tomatoes and blueberry plants for pots, and small roses.

    About the other, tone of voice is so hard to discern on the internet.

    We all have things we feel passionately about, and know a lot about, and stating something emphatically isn't being demeaning or dismissive.

    We are all supposed to be adults here, and if we are brave enough to venture out into the wild world of social media, we should be able to read whatever someone has written without feeling "attacked," especially when no attack is intended.

    We also have no way of knowing what anyone is expert in, and what they really know or do in their personal life.

    We are all just avatars, and creatures of the ether here.

    To take umbrage at what some stranger thousands of miles away is typing at you is just a bit much, don't you think?



  • mojavemaria
    3 years ago

    What isn’t opinion but fact is that the southwest is in a state of using more water than is being recharged. I’ve seen lake mead, a massive water storage area shrink more and more over the last thirty years. As far as laws Las Vegas where I live has banned front yard lawns in new developments since 2003. They are now in the process of trying to put a further ban on lawns in “ornamental” areas and I hope they are successful. In addition the water district pays people to three dollars per square ft to convert lawns to drought tolerant landscapes.

    while I agree with gardengal that there are plants that use as much water as turf there are an awful lot of beautiful interesting plants that use a lot less and I would like to think it wouldn’t take a law to make someone make a good environmental and social choice.

  • gardengal48 (PNW Z8/9)
    3 years ago
    last modified: 3 years ago

    The OP is new to the area, purchased a home with an already established landscape and lawn. All that was asked was how to water that lawn.....not that others find lawns an irritant or that they are wasteful and ecologically unsound and should be removed and replaced with something else. Only a couple of posters addressed that question. All the rest offered unsolicited opinions about an entirely different topic....and not always in the most polite or diplomatic of manners.

    And please tell me how not having a lawn is a good social choice?

    flopsycat1 thanked gardengal48 (PNW Z8/9)
  • decorpatti
    3 years ago

    The OP asked a question, and as a nearby homeowner, I shared what we do and our experience. That another poster who lives over 1,000 miles away called our procedures a "joke," and stated that the lawn would always need chemicals (we don't use chemicals) sounded a little condescending and not accurate to me.

    flopsycat1 thanked decorpatti
  • chloebud
    3 years ago

    "All that was asked was how to water that lawn....."

    Exactly!

    I certainly wasn't as helpful as gardengal, apple pie and decorpatti regarding how-to. Just wanted to give a heads-up on checking with the city.

    flopsycat1 thanked chloebud
  • mojavemaria
    3 years ago

    Wow gardengal talk about coming on strong. I never attacked anyone and as a rule avoid drama and contention. Since you seem to be taking issue with what I said I will explain this and then let you have the last word. I used the term social in what is good for society as in living in an area that uses more water than it gathers using that resource to grow food like the farmers in central Ca vs lawns in SoCal.


    So far as the answering the OPs question it was answered by others but as the Op seemed concerned about the water issue I offered another option. Having been on garden web for a lot of years posts take turns and opinions other than those strictly adhering to just the narrow confines of the question asked routinely occur. I wasn’t aware that the only opinions allowed were only those exactly answering asked questions.

  • Embothrium
    3 years ago
    last modified: 3 years ago

    The basis for the problem of trying to keep lawns spring green all summer is that it is natural for the grass to dry up and go to seed during that time of the year. In other words turf grasses are often genetically programmed to aestivate and so water has to be poured on to keep them green.

    Here in my part of the PNW with its quite dry but comparatively cool and brief summers established lawns not being watered, going therefore more or less completely dead looking - yet greening back up when frequent rains return in fall - is commonplace.

    flopsycat1 thanked Embothrium
  • JP L
    3 years ago
    last modified: 3 years ago

    I have to laugh at the suggestion to outlaw grass in SoCal - as if we need MORE regulation and restrictions! Try to order a showerhead on Amazon and have it delivered to California sometime (or purchase plants online or install windows ... the list goes on and on!) - we have PLENTY of regulation already, thanks!

    We're on a hillside in Hollywood (so not too far from you, OP!) - we have a "low mow" drought tolerant grass blend now, and it doesn't take much water at all. We have a grey water system that uses water from our washing machine and basins to irrigate the lawn - the previous owners installed it, but from what I understand, it's pretty inexpensive (and I'd hate to pay LADWP to water our lawn - those bills are high enough already!).

    Also, @chloebud - your lawn is BEAUTIFUL!

    flopsycat1 thanked JP L
  • chloebud
    3 years ago

    Thanks, JP L! We owe it all to the previous owners. OMG, "PLENTY of regulation" is right!

    flopsycat1 thanked chloebud
  • flopsycat1
    Original Author
    3 years ago
    last modified: 3 years ago

    OP here. Wow! Ask a simple question and get a rather contentious debate.

    First, let me clarify a few things. I lied and want to come clean. The house is mine, but my son and his wife actually live there and are charged with caring for the property. I did not think that information was germane to the discussion, and, therefore, did not include it in the original post.

    The lawn and beautiful garden were not planted by us, but were there when we purchased the house. We do not intend to plow them under.

    My husband and I live on two acres of Sonoran desert in Arizona. We irrigate nothing and have only planted a few cacti, all of which are native and do not require watering.. We have spent years creating and maintaining a defensible space on our property since we are in an extremely fire prone region. We have done the same with our mountain top property in the tall pines in northern Arizona. We are very aware of issues pertaining to drought, water conservation, and fire prevention.

    Of course this has little to do with my original question.

    Many thanks to those who have offered helpful comments and suggestions.

  • chloebud
    3 years ago

    LOL, flopsycat...you never know what might transpire from a simple question! Hope your son and his wife find the applicable suggestions helpful.

    flopsycat1 thanked chloebud
  • loobab
    3 years ago

    I don't find this a contentious debate.

    Lively is more like it.

    As long as no one is being abusive, and isn't using insulting words aimed at each other (as opposed to the ideas expressed,) that is A-Okay.


    This why we are here, isn't it?

    To virtually meet and exchange thoughts and ideas with people who are interested in the same things.

    Not people who all agree with one another.

    Who wants to talk to people that agree with you?

    Not I, What a colossal bore!


    And nowadays, our usual social avenues for interactions are on hiatus, the library, the book clubs, the coffee shops, and get-togethers with friends , so here we all are.


    Let's all try to give each other the benefit of the doubt.

    I know I fall short of the mark too, we all need to just try harder.


    It's a shame when well-educated Houzz contributors leave Houzz or feel that they have to take down their comments or others delete their comments.


    It would be a shame if comments are narrowly tailored to the initial subject of the OP.


    One of the things I do so enjoy about Houzz is the natural segue from one topic to another, I learn so much. I wouldn't want that to stop.


    For example, I am thrilled to learn about watering the lawn with water from your washing machine.


    Excuse my ignorance, but wouldn't the soap kill the vegetation, or is it filtered out in some way?


    I do know that in the areas susceptible to fire in SoCal it is suggested to plant succulents with big fat leaves that store a lot of water, to prevent fire from getting close to your house, and to actually not have plantings at all near the building itself.


    Another thing I remember is to try not to have plants that have combustible oils.


    Here, look what I found, a few websites with guidance on fire-resistant landscaping as the fire-season has started-


    https://www.readyforwildfire.org/prepare-for-wildfire/get-ready/fire-resistant-landscaping/


    http://firesafesdcounty.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/Comprehensive-Fire-Resistant-Plant-List.pdf


    https://dpw.lacounty.gov/epd/sg/tech_sheets/fwg_info.pdf


    https://dpw.lacounty.gov/epd/sg/fwg.cfm


    http://fire.lacounty.gov/wp-content/uploads/2020/01/lacofd-Fire-Safe-Landscaping_March-2019.pdf







  • JP L
    3 years ago
    last modified: 3 years ago

    @loobab - I'm definitely not an expert, but when we "inherited" this set-up from the previous owners, I did just enough research to be dangerous. We mostly use detergents that are "greywater friendly" (just do a quick Google search - mostly the "free and clear" or environmentally friendly products). When we need to run a load with bleach, etc., we can divert the load to the sewer line instead. When we renovate, I'm hoping to upgrade our system to include run-off from the showers, too - and add some sort of option for rainwater harvesting.

  • loobab
    3 years ago

    Very clever!

    I like to watch the shows about people buying homes in Australia and New Zealand and they have significant water conservation measures there. People with single family residences usually collect rain water.

    I wonder if they have a system such as yours, and one that collects water from the dishwasher as well.

    There is a Houzzer from Australia whose name escapes me at the moment, she has marvelous design style.

  • JP L
    3 years ago
    last modified: 3 years ago

    Funny @loobab - I used to live in Sydney and learned a bit - one of my friend's mums doesn't rinse her dishes after washing them to save water (she washes them off and then puts them over to dry, which apparently was quite common). It's also where I picked up the habit of setting a timer while I'm in the shower.

  • dchall_san_antonio
    3 years ago

    I'd like to go a different direction to help with the issue. The OP doesn't know what type of grass it is. That is kind of important. Over the past several decades there has been a huge push to install cool season grass, specifically Marathon I, II, and III, in SoCal lawns. I grew up and worked in SoCal for 30 years and have a pretty good feeling for what is naturally adapted to the area. The Marathon fescue grasses will work only if you live west of Interstate 5, or in LA, the 405. That is the area the news weather guys/gals are referring to when they predict, "Late night and early morning low fog and clouds near the coast - burning off around 11." If you live elsewhere, you should be sure to use grasses adapted to warm climates. Those would be bermuda (preferably hybrid like TIF 419), St Augustine, UC Verde buffalo, and some varieties of zoysia. Bermuda and buffalo would be most preferred IF you have full sun throughout the day. Those two varieties have the characteristic if being able to come back to life following months of absolutely no water at all. If you want grass in shady areas, then St Augustine and a more limited variety of zoysia would work. All these grasses look their best with a full inch of water per week in the hottest heat of summer, but they all survive on an inch every 2 weeks in most of the SoCal non-desert areas.

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