Bonus this was a pinus radiata I planted in jan 2021 it loved the dry season but as soon as summer came around it started to decline until it finally died this january, it barley made it a year. Aside from the coast redwood it seems like west coast conifers are a complete no go. I once tried a pinus coulteri and it didnt even survive a month.

Good luck, keep us updated! However I would say most of them are standard items of horticultural commerce and unless they are seen in your area, it's safe to assume they've been tried and found not to last long term. IIRC years ago someone said the southern limit of Deodars in FL was Disney World. I don't even know if Melbourne is north or south of that but my hunch is south of it LOL.

Have you been to "Leu Gardens"? Years ago the director there posted here about trying some of these like the Coast Redwood.

Good luck, but don't be surprised if things don't work out. I've experimented some, with luck both good and bad.

Hi thanks yeah melbourne is about an hour south of orlando. Yeah I don’t expect these to be long term speciments but I am curious how long they will survive for in a less than ideal climate. My guess is the pines from the Mediterranean climate will languish for a few years before succumbing to the elements. Even the commonly planted cupressus sempervirens doesn’t typical last more than 10 years but older specimens are occasional found.

yeah I have been to leu gardens they have a real nice collection of conifers and palms and lots of other plants. I especially enjoyed the araucaria they have planted there.

Assuming such conifers as Cephalotaxjus and Podocarpus are frequently cultivated in Central Florida. Is that true? Also, was wondering how Metasequoia or Cryptomeria japonica or even Gingko would do that far south. I would also be less optimistic about the long term survivability of the Mediterranean conifers. Time will tell. Good luck with your experiment.

Pinus pinea in the southeast are an interesting topic. (to me at least!) There was supposedly one at NCSU but removed for the new visitor's center. I saw it the first time I went there in 1997, but, given my general lack of plant expertise at the time, I'm not going to say 100% I am convinced that is what I saw. (it's hard to believe JC Raulston would have misidentified it, but whatever)

Ages ago on this forum someone posted pics of some in the San Antonia/Austin part of TX, and they looked good and very correct for the species. (flat tops) The Barlett Arboretum in North Carolina lists a couple in their database. Yet I feel like if I saw one in New Orleans, I would have definitely remembered it, but I didn't. I feel like if there were old ones in Charleston, Savannah or Orlando, people would have posted pics of them by now. So maybe they can grow in the upper South and the semi-arid "Southwest border area", but not in most parts of the Gulf and coastal Atlantic south.

Jurassic, regarding frequently cultivated exotic conifers Podocarpus macrophyllus is one of the most commonly used, mostly being used as a hedge plant. I believe I saw Cephalotaxus at Leu Gardens but I dont think it is widely used here. By far the most common exotic conifer here would Araucaria Columnaris. I have seen Crytomeria japonica well established at Bok tower gardens and as well as at Leu so they will grow here but they dont look quite as good as up north. I think I have heard of Metasequia being planted in north florida, but as far as gingko goes I have no idea.

David your assesment on where they can grow seems likely for the species. there is also a pinus picea growing in north georgia but from the picture they have it doesnt look that great. https://www.warnell.uga.edu/pinetum

LOL, P&P. Those are some dubious looking pines! I wonder which species the ones generically described as Mexican are.

lol good point who knows what those pines really are.

I was looking back at a old fourm over on palmtalk and somebody posted this screenshot of a purported pinus picea in niceville

florida (far north of the state close to the border of alabama).

Once again the google earth image is to low resolution to really tell what it is. The general consensus over on palmtalk was it was not a native pine.

I looked up ”twin cities pavilon” on google earth and the tree was gone, guess we will never know what it really was.

Any conifer species in the cupressaceae family do not have any chill requirements. Those are the conifers you may want to focus on, try to find the ones that do well with your soil, rainfall and heat tolerance. Eastern red cedar and most junipers about thrive for you. Western red cedar does extremely well in Hawaii which is more tropical than Central Florida but cooler so Summer heat and dry Winters may be tough on them in your area.

Southern Hemisphere conifers are worth trying, agathis, araucaria and podocarpus are great generae to choose from.

There are lots of tropical pines to choose from, and most Southeastern Chinese pines do not have chilling requirements.

Forget spruces and firs, all of them will fall into the “too hot” and/or “not enough Winter chill”categories. Abies firma handles the hot and humid Summers but need Winter chill to grow.

I think part of the problem is availablity of a lot of the species. I would definitely like to try more tropical conifers but most of them are out right not for sale anywhere or outrageously expensive.

Good call on cupressaceae, a good deal of the cultivated conifers around here are in the cypress family, mostly junipers. I do recall having a dawn redwood a good while back that was doing well but it never returned from dormacy for some reason. I also had at one point a Monterey cypress that did great in the winter but slowly declined and died during summer.

I might as well give an update on these, a crytomeria (which i forgot to post on the original post) and the coast redwood both died but not due to climate conditions but rather i wasnt hime for a while and invasive air potato vine grew all over them killing them, its a nasty invasive and grows all over everything. I also had 2 china-firs planted out and they both died going into summer which i found strange considering they grow at leu gardens. The eastern white outright died no real suprise there. The stone pines still alive but looks a little worse because a heavy picnic table fell on it and a branch fell off as a result. The aleppo pine is growing slowly but seems ok. The aussie cypress and chinese red pine are doing great no real suprise there. The one that has suprised me the most is the deodar cedar it so far seems to be doing real well.

Heres some updates after hurricane Ian. Where I was was not hit too bad thankfully 85 mile hour winds at its worst and very minor flooding of the yard, none of the 70 slash pines on my property blew over just alot of branches, however some of the experimental planting werent so lucky.

A branch feel on pinus massionia but I expect it to make a full recovery.

Pinus pinea was not lucky at all flooded where it was and winds blew some branches off, the main leader does not look too good no needles left. There is a small part on the other branch that looks alive but I dont expect it to survive. I guess another factor besides just this species not really liking the climate is the fact that it has no adaptions to this kind of weather event in its native range.

Good luck, I’ve seen Coast Redwoods do well in the heat of the southeastern US. I would definitely try the Florida native pines and bald cypresses

Coast redwoods would in Central Florida? Like planting a living lightening rod while they remain alive. Find it hard to believe they would be content there long term. Bald Cypress are easy, where don't they survive? Henry, do you grow any Sequoia, Metasequoia or Taxodium?

I’d get a dwarf version, I would recommend that they be planted in regular garden soil there, they won’t like that sand

My most exotic outdoor conifer is Araucaria araucana. My other conifers include a Taxodioum (Bald Cypress), two Dawn Reds (Metasequoia), and Gingko biloba tree. I have a potted Coast Red but NO SPACE.

" I’d get a dwarf version, I would recommend that they be planted in regular garden soil there, they won’t like that sand "

Where in the world do you get these 'ideas'? All 3 of the genera mentioned by 41 North grow fine in sandy soil, assuming it is otherwise suitable. They all grow well at Norfolk Botanical Garden, Virginia, which definitely has sandy soil!

We used to have someone named Eric from Leu Gardens post, I vaguely remember him mentioning that coast redwoods didn't last for them. They seem to do ok in the Middle South, and most zone 7 parts of the Upper South.

Any tree getting too tall becomes a lightning and/or hurricane wind magnet, that's why SoCal has zillions of 100' tall sky duster Washingtonias and Florida doesn't.

Florida’s soil is basically pure, dry sand, very alkaline too which they won’t like

' Florida’s soil is basically pure, dry sand, very alkaline too which they won’t like '

You're generalizing again Henry.

Florida has varying soil types and ph levels for that matter:

'soils of North and Central Florida are typically very sandy, while in the panhandle, the soil can contain substantial amounts of clay. Clay soils compact more easily and drain slower than sandy soils.

Meanwhile, down south in the Everglades, soils tend to be peat-based and extremely fertile'.

Source:

https://gardeningsolutions.ifas.ufl.edu

' The median soil pH for Florida soils is 6.1, which is characterized as slightly acidic. But Florida soils can vary widely in pH. Soils in pine woods can be quite acidic. Soils that were formed from calcium-rich materials, such as limestone or sea shells, tend to be alkaline. '

https://ifas.ufl.edu/care/planting/soil-ph.html

I did observe what’s on the ground, and have recently learned that in that soil, you could put mulch, leaves and other plant matter and let it decompose, then you have sandy loam

' I did observe what’s on the ground, and have recently learned that in that soil, you could put mulch, leaves and other plant matter and let it decompose, then you have sandy loam '

Already been posted many times in the Soil & Compost forum (where it belongs):

https://www.gardenweb.com/discussions/any-florida-composters-here-beach-sand-soil:

https://www.gardenweb.com/discussions/amending-straight-florida-sand-into-a-usable-gardening-soil:

Sand is pH neutral -- nonreactive silicon-dioxide. So its pH depends on other things, like any soil/minerals mixing into the sand from below, what the humus layer on top (if any) is, etc. Decaying humus layers are almost always acidic to various extents.

I 'm not sure Palms and Pines is still reading this post, but since the endangered Torreya taxifolia grows in a small, nearby Florida area, that would be a good conifer to try.

An interesting is that there is a specimen of Momi Fir inside of a serene garden in Tokyo, Tokyo barely gets much frost or winter chill.