Hi Austin: it must be very hard to part with such a beautiful rose!

My goodness...that's extraordinary!!! No wonder you want more Austins! :) :)

Apparently, it's because if a place sells older out of patent Austins then the Austin company won't sell the new ones to that company.

Austin You are top priority on my list to root Evelyn for. Top priority goes to those who lost roses. I understand that feeling of losing a friend or a rose that one loves.

I lost $3,000 worth of roses in 3 decades of zone 5a winter. Jude the Obscure died on me 4 times (twice from Heirloom roses and 2 more from a friend). Firefighter died on me 3 times, and I'm on my 4th own-root Firefighter. Wise Portia died twice, and I'm on my 3rd Wise Portia.

Some reasons why older Austins are not sold:

1) They are badly virused from grafting and decline with Rose Mosaic Virus. I had seen Evelyn with bad RMV on-line, but mine is 100% healthy from Chamblee's Nursery 12 years ago.

2) Older Austins like W.S. 2000 and Evelyn has such thin stems, that for me to get decent thick cuttings, I have to cut so close to the crown, practically wiping out the mother-bush.

3) David Austin first gave nurseries contracts to sell his roses to promote Austin roses. As Austins become popular, David Austin forbids nurseries with existing contracts to sell any Austins, so David Austin can SOLELY sell the new releases and easier to root old ones.

Kitty in NY asked me about disease-resistance of older Austin roses like Evelyn, so I re-post my answer here:

1) Own roots that can take high humidity with healthy leaves in my rooting bin, even with constant condensation (water) on leaves & stems. These can take extreme humidity yet have 100% healthy leaves, even with poor drainage if the soil is NOT acidic. Evelyn, W.S. 2000, Mary Magdalene, Christopher Marlowe, Pat Austin, Queen of Sweden, James Galway, Dee-lish, the Dark Lady, Spirit of Freedom, Tchaikovsky, Betty White, Frederic Mistral, Purple Lodge.

Never see blackspots on Chris, Evelyn, Tchaikovsky nor James Galway.

2) Own roots with healthy leaves with humidity, if the drainage is fast, plus liming on top to neutralize acidic rain: Abraham Darby, Crown princess Mag, Tess of d'Ubervilles, A Shopshire Lad, Radio times, Well Being, Augusta Luis, Firefighter, Sonia Rykiel, Yves Piaget child.

3) Own roots that blackspots with high humidity despite fast draining or liming, and need constant potassium fertilizer to stay healthy: Golden Celebration, Carding Mill, the Squire, Gertrude Jekyll, St. Cecilia, Comte de Chambord.

4) Own roots with THICK LEAVES which rabbits don't eat: Evelyn leaves are thicker than Abe. Darby. Tchaikosky, Augusta Luis, The Dark Lady, Christopher Malowe, James Galway, Purple Lodge, Crown Princess Mag, Aloha, Betty White. Strike it Rich and About Face have thicker leaves than Carding Mill.

5) Own roots with THIN LEAVES which rabbits devour: Munstead Wood, W.S. 2000, Sonia Rykiel, Well Being, Golden Cel., Firefighter, Boscobel, and Comte de Chambord.

That's from own-roots in my garden plus rooting in humid & covered bins of Evelyn, Dee-lish, W.S. 2000, Spirit of Freedom, Christopher Marlowe, The Dark Lady, The Squire, Augusta Luis, James Galway, Mary Magdalene, Abraham Darby, Sonia Rykiel, Dee-lish, Golden Celebration, Gertrude Jekyll, Radio Times, Pat Austin, Well Being, Tchaikovsky, Crown Princess Mag., Purple Lodge, thornless Yves Piaget child.

*** Princess Anne was healthy in the 1st few years, but as its roots mature in its 5th-year, it's prone to blackspots in my poor drainage clay. Some Austins have chunky & woody root that rot fast in standing acidic rain water like Princess Anne.

Some own-root starts out as healthy cluster roots, then matures to chunky & woody (like Dr.Huey-rootstock) and become more Blackspot-prone in later years like Princess Anne.

Other Austins like W.S. 2000 have cluster-root (similar to multiflora) that does not rot in acidic rain, thus zero blackspots even as 12th-year-own-root.

Leaves of W.S. 2000 and Evelyn have NO blackspots in high humidity rooting bin.

Evelyn can take high rain and poor drainage clay better than Abraham Darby (best bloomer for hot & dry and alkaline climate).

Abe. Darby & Sonia Rykiel & Well-Being & Firefighter need a higher pH and all three bloom well with my alkaline tap water at pH 9, thus best for hot & dry climate.
Below are pics. of W.S. 2000 being healthy, it's right next to the rainspout dumping tons of acidic rain at pH 4.5, note the pale leaves:

Below pic. of Evely was taken July 24, after week-long rain, I never see blackspots on it in its 12 years as own-root, if biochar at pH 8.6 is given before a rainy month. Note Evelyn's paler leaves than Abe. Darby:

Dear Straw thank you. Evelyn was my favorite after Dark Lady. I have saved all my shipping boxes from roses sent to me and all the packaging. The boxes held 3 gal to 2qt. Roses.
I will send all to you and you can use for others and hopefully one for me. I have several smaller plant shipping boxes that Proven Winners used to send me perennials. I can put those inside larger boxes for smaller cutting you send out. I hope this helps. Donating funds to your charity will be a pleasure also. I will do these things to the limit I feel I can afford. Your efforts and talents are appreciated greatly. BR

Austin Your thoughtfulness and generosity is enough to make me happy. I already saved hundreds of containers from Roses Unlimited and other nurseries. My local grocery store gives out free boxes of any size.

The Evelyn I'm rooting for you is more than band-size as of 11/8/22. I will put it in a gallon-container and force it to bloom to confirm its identity. Last frost date in Austin is March 15, that's when I want to send it to you.

Roots can grow 2 inch. per week in warm weather & full sun and wet potting soil like Pro-Mix Moisture (red bag from Walmart), plus spring rain.

I send my rootings to warm zones first before the temp. gets too hot in early summer. In some years, temp. can reach 80 F in April in my zone 5a. That's too hot for tiny rootings if in full-sun.

Straw that is so appreciated. I have years of rose growing experience but absolutely none with a band. I will look forward to this rose and the nicest part is that when it grows it will represent a kindness. In today's angry world that alone makes it invaluable. BR

" Apparently, it's because if a place sells older out of patent Austins then the Austin company won't sell the new ones to that company. "

*** That has long been Austin's practice.

Here's why Evelyn and some older Austins are NOT offered: they are a real pain to root, incurring time & expenses with zero profits. From the roses I root this year for charities, not much profit but extremely time-consuming.

Out of the $800 I donated to charities, 80% of it is my own money.

This summer I rooted: "Evelyn, Dee-lish, W.S. 2000, Spirit of Freedom, Christopher Marlowe, The Dark Lady, The Squire, Augusta Luis, James Galway, Mary Magdalene, Abraham Darby, Sonia Rykiel, Dee-lish, Golden Celebration, Gertrude Jekyll, Radio Times, Pat Austin, Well Being, Tchaikovsky, Crown Princess Mag., Purple Lodge, thornless Yves Piaget child."

Here's the chance of success if rooted OUTSIDE: W.S. 2000 & Evelyn and Abe. at 50%, Spirit of Freedom & the Dark Lady and Christopher at 70%, The Squire at 60%, Augusta Luis at 90%, James Galway and Gertrude Jekyll at 10%, Mary Magdalene at 1%, Sonia Rykiel at 10%, Dee-lish & Golden Cel & Carding Mill at 100%, Radio Times and Well Being at 80%, Pat Austin and Tchaikosky at 50%, Crown Princess Mag and Purple Lodge at 20%, Yves seedling at 50%.

Tradesant was zero success, all 10+ cuttings failed to root.

The chance of success in rooting INDOOR is much less, due to my gloomy & cold months in my zone 5a.

The reason why older Austins and wimpy own roots are NOT offered by nurseries: IT'S A PAIN to root them, NOT WORTH countless failures in different soil mediums and time spent in packing & shipping such tiny roots.

I heard the same about the Prince, Pretty Jessica and Chatreuse de Parme: a real pain even for Pakistan rosarians to root in their humid & warm months. Small roses are hard to root since one has to cut really close to the crown to get a thick cutting, and the mother bush can't grow new canes until years later.

These rare roses are tiny even as grafted, I saw Blue for You at 6 inch. tall at local store as grafted on Dr.Huey.

I hear folks complain about tiny rootings from certain nurseries, but they don't realize RARE roses are extremely hard to root, or else the mother-bush is so tiny like mini-rose, that to get a decent cutting I have to cut so close to the crown, practically wiping out the mother bush.

I ask for Felicite Parmentier from 2 nurseries for the past 5 years, they list it but it rarely roots for them. So far 2 Mary Mag. rootings rot today, I have to take new cuttings and try a different rooting medium.

I'm a problem-solver and like a challenge, thus I keep rooting despite zero profits.

David Austin offers own-root Golden Cel. and Carding Mill since they super easy to root at 100% success for me. Nurseries offer only vigorous or easy to root, even if the hard-to-root have superior scent or health.

Dee-lish is 100% success both indoor and outdoor for me, compared to 50% success outdoor for Evelyn.

Straw is the difficulty due to your climate. Evelyn had very thick stems in Texas many of which took root because some stems were composted over and then took root . Problem was that those new rooted stems also grew too huge to move over the 13 she was in my garden.
I brought 2 large Mary Mags bushes with me because my original became OR over the years and then grew so wide I could divide her and still leave a big bush. I always cut top growth (I kept her to 2 feet) to make her spread. I needed a sm front row bush for balance. The Mary M bushes I divided out took up a 16” pot and a 14” pot Big ladies. I shared with my son.

Austin You are right that heat-loving roses like Mary Magdalene and Evelyn root best in dry & hot weather which I don't have. I was able to grow three Evelyns to bigger than band-size in hot July, but it refused to grow in cold weather.

If I want to succeed in rooting Mary indoor, it has to be a glass bin to allow more sun, plus much drier medium. Anything with peatmoss rots Mary.

Tradescant & the Squire & Abe. Darby root best in open dry & warm air and all 3 drop leaves in soaking wet & covered humid plastic bin. These 3 are best for dry & hot climate.

Brendan in Malibu, zone 10B CA in dry & warm climate informed me that Abe. Darby is his best bloomer, compared to stingy Jude and Golden Celebration.

Both Jude and Golden Celebration root well in my humid & wet medium.

Golden strong fast grower here but ugly blooms in all but spring and fall. Lot of summer blooms but shattered after 1 o’clock even in shade. I shovel pruned in its 4th summer. Both Golden and Jude have dirty cream blooms unless cool. For me anyway.

It eventually grew over part of roof and beyond all in 4 yrs

Lot of what you grow/ root easily do not perform well here or not for me, maybe better for others. We must each play to our weather extremes if we have them😎

Ha maybe you should move to Texas along with everyone else🥰

Wow !! I'm impressed at the vigor of your roses. All your roses look great with lots of blooms. Would like your help in solving the problem of thin stems in Austins.

I suspect that thin stems is more from own-root roses. I saw HUGE stems on Abraham Darby as grafted-on-Dr.Huey at nearby rose park. The bottom stem was more than an inch. in diameter. Compare to my 2nd-year own-root Abe, which I have to cut close to the crown to get a pencil-thick stem.

John_CA who has the largest inventory of older Austins informed that Multiflora-rootstock has thinner stems, but with more roots than Dr.Huey-rootstock. Own-roots are like multiflora-roostock: thinner upper stems, but more roots below

I have seen own-roots with tons of cluster roots below, versus Dr.Huey-rootstock is just a long & thick stick, with very few cluster roots below.

More cluster roots = easy and constant blooming but thinner stems

Annual flowers like marigolds and petunias are constant-bloomer with cluster root, versus tall trees do bloom, but only in spring time.

Less cluster roots and thick stick like Dr.Huey-rootstock = thick stems but longer pause in blooming. Grafted-Abe at rose park is mainly a spring bloomer, with only 1 bloom on a 7 foot tall bush (full sun in the fall), versus 6 blooms on my 2 feet tall own-root Abe. in only 3 hours of sun.

Austin What type of soil do you have? Heavy dense clay, loamy soil, silty soil, or sandy soil? I googled and saw that Austin, TX gets good rainfall at 35 inch. per year.

In my zone 5a, I get 38 inch. of rain per short summer, and 23 inch. of snow in long winter.

Still wonder why Evelyn gave lots of blooms when I tested MG soluble for roses at NPK 18-24-16 but all canes are so thin and blooms don't last long in the vase. So I never use such fertilizer again.

Also I will NEVER use Osmocote Plus NPK 15-7-12 on my roses again !! I used chemical fertilizers for the first time on my roses in the ground, since this past winter was brutal zapping most of my roses to below ankle.

I never have mildew on my 150+ own-root roses for 3 decades, until I test Osmocote PLUS on them this year, and they break out in mildew thanks to salty chemical fertilizer, despite tons of rain and 7 rain-barrels.

Even the few rootings that I sprinkled Osmocote PLUS on top to force blooming broke out in mildew in pots.

Later reply in car

Here, Osmocote Plus works great in pots, with no disease or disasters. I use it every 6 months on my pots.

Here in late fall in my zone 5a, we have cold nights and warmer days, plus not enough sun which are optimal conditions for mildew. There's one patch of grass in 100% shade (below a tree) that gets mildew, but the grass in full sun don't get mildew.

See below link: "Mold and Mildew Love Chilly Weather: It's easy for it to become an issue during the winter and early spring. This is often because when warm air rises on cold surfaces, condensation can build up, providing the perfect habitat for mold or mildew to proliferate."

Mold and Mildew Love Chilly Weather — What You Need to Know to Prevent It (carefreecomfort.com)

Salt is another factor in mildew. Mary Magdalene has mildew only twice in its 12-year lifespan as own-root. Back in hot June 2012, full sun, when I tested acid granular chemical fertilizer, Mary Magdalene broke out in mildew and lost its fabulous myrrh scent. I had to water it profusely with my alkaline tap water at pH 9, before mildew went away.

The second time is with Osmocote Plus chemical fertilizer on Mary Magdalene rooting in a pot, and 12-year-old Mary in the ground this year. Both broke out in mildew. The mildew in a pot could be salty potting soil (gas price is high so soil companies use cheap local horse manure, rather than expensive black peat shipped from Michigan).

The mildew in 12-year-old Mary in my heavy clay is from the salt of Osmocote PLUS (with chemical urea at salt index of 74). Plenty of fall rain here doesn't help.

I'm not physically able to mess around with soil amendments although in the past I was quite happy with the results of alfalfa meal. Now the roses have to get along with bagged soil added to the planting hole and that's it. I imagine that will weed out the slackers among the roses, but I'm hopeful that the primarily antique rose varieties I've chosen will do reasonably well. One modern rose I do want is Evelyn which I consider to be the finest Austin of the approximately one dozen varieties I've grown. I confess I've also ordered Yves Piaget which I don't expect to do terribly well here but sometimes one must give in to one's impulses.

The rose as a plant may have run out of patent but if DAR made the name of the rose a registered trade mark, they cant be sold as its original name. Same thing is going on in the apple industry. Once honey crisp plant patent expires any orchards cam grow it without licensing but they cant sell tge apples as honey crips.

cactusjoe1 Took me time to translate the AUS name listed on LongAgoRoses website to regular names, see below post:

Ratings of scents & vigor for own root roses and LongAgoRoses (houzz.com)

Ingrid: Alfalfa meal is perfect as fertilizer with zero salt at NPK 2-1-2. Do you want to reserve an Evelyn? I charge the same as LongAgoRoses at $25, and all the money goes to charities.

Below is Crimson Glory as tiny band from Burlington roses, with alfalfa meal mixed in potting soil, and alfalfa meal as fertilizer along with MG-SOLUBLE for roses NPK 18-24-16, plus topped with horse manure for calcium & trace elements. It's a constant bloomer. I had to use chemical soluble fertilizer due to cold temp. in May in zone 5a:

Crimson Glory bloomed better as tiny hybrid tea than the big CLIMBING Crimson Glory bought as gallon-size from Roses Unlimited. The climbing version has big & woody and chunky wood (like Dr.Huey-rootstock) which demands week-long rain to bloom.

The problem with woody & thick root like Ardoise de Lyon (refuses to bloom even the bush is huge), or roses grafted on Dr.Huey: As the root becomes old and too woody, it becomes more stingy with less cluster roots.

Nearby rose park replaces their roses, esp. Austins after 2 or 3 years since Dr.Huey-rootstock has less cluster roots as it ages. Roses grafted on Dr.Huey-rootstock have tons of blooms in 1st and 2nd year, and down to 5 blooms per year like my 8th-year Double Delight (grafted on Dr.Huey).

There's a post on the life-span of grafted roses, and folks reported 5 years max for roses grafted on multiflora or Dr.Huey. Pakistan rosarian make own roots since their Austins (grafted on multiflora) decline after the first few years.

Annual flowers like petunias and marigolds are constant bloomers with cluster roots. Thus own-roots which STAY as cluster roots are constant bloomers, such as Evelyn blooms as a tiny 3 months rooting, see below:

Or my rooting of W.S. 2000 with 2 buds after 4 months of sticking tiny cuttings in the rooting bin:

All of DA catalogs have the AUS name under the description— most of you probably have his catalogues going back to the dark ages as do I.

. I will send later about my dirt but it is probably more than you need/want to know.

I think the truth is that most DA roses don’t like extreme weather temps. Straw your zone 5 and my 100++ heat means only some will perform correctly or as intended, so varieties must be chosen carefully. Abe, Evelyn, Dark Lady get huge, have huge blooms constantly, and carry their full flowers with proper color all summer no matter the heat extreme. Most all stems on all grafted Austins are at least 1/2” or larger after just a couple of years and all of mine reverted to own root because I burried graft. OR was great but not as easy to get years ago. No Austin is less than 3’ at end of year 1 if grafted. Most OR 1 gal size took 2 years for full bush 3’; 3 gal were 3’ end of year 1.

Guys, it is like we are all growing totally different plants due to our climates and their performance in it. Everything else seems like an ”also ran” and much less relevant.

roses · More Info

2 Abe plants one on each side of large arch, 4 years in ground, Dallas. always in bloom except Jan and after Feb cut back, but certainly very best in spring, early summer and fall, early winter.

Austin, I'm so happy to meet you here as I can see that you have the most astonishing roses. I loved Abe Darby when I grew it as a bush but without a doubt it really comes into its own as a climber. Yours is simply splendid. Yes, climate makes a huge difference, even though those selling roses tend to ignore that little factoid. It's a rare rose that loves it everywhere, and to me that's not a bad thing.

straw, yes I would be interested in a small plant of Evelyn, just let me know how to go about that.

I had The Dark Lady once and it was fire engine red! I got rid of it instead doing the smart thing and giving it another year or two. However, in all honesty it's not a rose that wows me.

Dirt: I had contractors dig down 18” and haul off all soil. Neighbors thought I was building a swimming pool. I mix amendments and compost at bottom of beds down another few inches, then added a speciality rose mixture produced locally and bought in by truck. A&M guys have developed soil, mulches and compost unique to each city where they have a plant. Then u just buy the products best for what you want to grow. I built my beds up 6” above grade and lined beds with ledgestone to keep all in place. i mulched heavily each year with compost not regular mulch. In Dallas I found I needed to add their azalea mix when I planted a new bush in years to come. In Houston I used rose mix when planting new. Both products were available by bag and truck. . it took money, energy and experimentling to get all the way I wanted. Water and dirt were both alkaline in Dallas and acid in Houston. Both had heavy clay which is why I dug out. BUT… I still think it is the climate and watering that makes DA roses grow happily. I had an English garden and in Texas it can be a challenge thus all my efforts.

Hate to hear bad things about Dark Lady. 4+ ” blooms in all weather and high heat, last forever in vase, keeps not only size but color in 100 degree heat. sorry had to defend her. 😘

Grafted Dark Lady growing into Forest Pansy

Austin You have good dirt since your grass in above pic is super-green & perfect. Love your English roses. I really enjoy your pics. of amazing roses. Thank you for sharing about how you built good soil for roses.

I will NOT use high phosphorus fertilizer since it made The Dark Lady gaudy red, esp. with high-phosphorus chicken manure or chemical fertilizers (this year) which turned it gaudy red.

In the fall I use biochar at pH 8.6 (high in potassium & calcium) and it shifts the Dark Lady color to deep purplish red, below was taken late Sept., upper yellow is Dee-lish, and upper dark pink is Parfume de Paris (from LongAgoRoses), both prefer alkaline pH:

Below red is The Dark Lady, and upper red is W.S. 2000. The Dark Lady gets bright red only with high phosphorus fertilizer, and its norm is pinkish red, or dark red with biochar. Easier to root than Evelyn since Dark Lady leaves are most healthy in super humid rooting bin.

Below Dark Lady is with biochar, it lasts 5 days in the vase like Firefighter. Dark Lady has a good old rose scent once aged in the vase. Pink is Comte de Chambord.

This is the normal color of The Dark Lady with high potassium fertilizer.

ingrid_vc so. CA zone 9 Yes, I reserve a small rooting of Evelyn for you. Evelyn stems are much thicker in late fall. Warm-zoners get my Evelyn rooted indoor first since I send them out in Feb. or March. Cold-zoners get my summer rootings of Evelyn, which I send in July (plenty of rain in cold zones). I message you when it succeeds in rooting.

Ingrid: was your gaudy Dark Lady grafted on Dr.Huey, or was it own-root? Dr.Huey produces acid to extract the most phosphorus from soil. My own root Pink Peace had warm pink color & fantastic scent, plus constant blooming, see below:

The above died through my zone 5a winter, so I bought Pink Peace as grafted on Dr.Huey. The plant was 4 times taller than the own-root, but it's a blackspot fest, plus it gave THE MOST GAUDY BRIGHT PINK color that hurt my eyes. Plus not much scent.

The color bothered my eyes so much that I dug the plant up to mix pelletized lime to tame down its color. That helped with blackspots but DID NOT help to tame down the color.

Phosphorus shifts bloom to the bright red zone, and potassium shifts bloom to more blue and darker hues.

Straw, without going too deep into the woods, I'll say that I agree about thin-stemmed roses generally being hard to root. Perfect example being Sunday Lemonade, which I've been working on for over a year with no success. HOWEVER, I have some big stem roses that are extremely hard to root. I made at least 25 cuttings of Westminster Pink over a year or so, and got only one to take, which I sent to Beth last November. Because this rose is so rare, and so important to me, I sent budwood to Steve at Wisconsin Roses last year, and he sent me 4 budded roses from it. Another rare one with thick canes I've had a devil of a time rooting is Pink Intuition. I've made dozens of cuttings of it over the past year with no success. I don't want to jinx it, but I may now have two that look possibly promising. I keep trying with the tough ones, and I'm good at making cuttings, but some are so frustrating!

Susan: Agree that different rose need different soil mix. I'm separating my cuttings today into 4 different rooting bins: 1) Austin waterhogs with peatmoss soil 2) thick stem with more acidic gypsum mixed in 3) drought tolerant and prickly rose with DRY & NO peat mix. 4) dark-leaves lime hogs with more lime mixed in.

It takes the SAME AMOUNT of labor & expenses to produce a tiny rooting versus gallon-size. I spend most of my time & labor & expenses in mixing different mediums to enable rooting. This step is most costly in labor and expenses, with buying glass tanks and grow lights to force roots indoor in my gloomy & cold zone 5a.

After they root, all it takes is time & good potting soil like Pro-Mix & warm weather for roots to get bigger.

Nurseries in cold zone like Freedom Gardens (zone 6), or Hummingbird Roses (zone 5a) don't have warm weather to grow roots bigger. So it's NOT their fault if the roots are tiny.

Back in 2012 I received super-tiny rootings from Burlington Roses in CA, zone 10a, like 3 inch. tall with 1.5 inch roots. However, the roots are thick and they survived my zone 5a winter. Same with friends who rooted tiny rootings with few strands of hair, these grew easily into 1 gallon root in 2 months.

The best that nurseries can do for $25 is to grow solid short roots, it's the buyer's job to grow the plants bigger. I have seen roots gain 2 inch per week if the soil is moist at warm temp. I also saw roots completely gone in dry soil, or wrong potting soil with too much bark chips & forest products. Due to high gas cost, potting soils no longer have the expensive black peat shipped from Michigan, or peatmoss from Canada.

So potting soil companies use cheap salty co-coir (without rinsing off the salt), or salty local horse manure. I saw wads of horse manure in bagged soils this year that killed a few of my rootings. Same with container bagged soil for veggies, I never have to water veggies that much (like twice a day) ... they constantly wilted in salty & cheap bagged soil despite my high rain and cooler climate.

Both Joey in WY, zone 4, and Krystal in CA report salt in Kellogg's soil that killed their plants. Berrypie in ID report bad MG-Organic potting soil (with salty co-coir, salty compost added). Compost can mean mushroom compost (salty local free horse manure).

One time I ordered a load of top soil for $162. The soil company kept offering to mix in horse manure (mushroom compost) for only $4 extra. I said NO, I want pure soil, since some horse stables even have big signs "FREE MUSHROOM COMPOST."

The stable 5 min. away told me I can come and get as much horse manure as I want.

Austin Here's Evelyn in a 2-gallon pot that I'm growing INDOOR so I can send to you in March. Leaves are funky due to a glass dome to keep the leaves from drying out. We get zero sun indoor in my zone 5a. I can't use nitrogen fertilizer since it would be too tall for a glass dome to keep it humid. So I focus on growing the roots. Rooting indoor is twice harder, I'm doing this to donate to charities, and there's zero profits to make.

Wow Straw thank you so very much. Whenever you think it can make a move to Texas is ok with me. Even if we have a freeze it goes to the70’s usually 80’s the following day…We run varying degrees of warm, cold all winter constantly changing….our cloudy days never last long.
Send me a personal text on how to send you funds for this and how much.
FYI: I would not care IF you made a profit, it is a lot of work on your part. Please let me me generous to offset those who cannot be or choose not to be.
Best, BR

@strawchicago z5 That's a beautiful Evelyn rooting! Would you be able to share what you do to grow the rooting indoor? Do you do bottom heat? What's the lighting requirement? I am currently "babying" the precious rootings outdoor in pots in a shaded area next to the house foundation, and plan to bring them into the garage overnight if there was a freeze warning (I am in San Jose CA). I am interested to know whether it be better to grow the "baby rootings" indoor vs outdoor in my area over the winter. Thanks for your hard work for the charities!

Michael 9a NorCal I hang out with Pakistan Rosarians in zone 9b in their Facebook Group of fragrant gardens. Khalid used to post in Organic rose forum, and he stated that rooting is best in the winter, OUTDOOR, in the ground.

The reason why my Evelyn's leaves are pale: it's in a very fast draining potting soil so it doesn't have enough nutrients for dark-green & glossy leaves. Can't use dense & fertile soil in a pot, it retains too much water and rot roots.

FOR OUTDOOR, one can use dense & fertile soil such as clay or leaves as topping if done in the ground where water can spread out, rather than rotting roots like in a pot.

Freezing is NOT a problem outdoor since cuttings can take many days of 28 F to 24 F.

In days below 32 F, I put a plastic container (cap on) to protect rooting from freezing.

In sunny days above 32 F, I take the plastic cap off (for air), but I keep the dome on to protect animals (squirrels, chipmunks, rabbits) from eating rootings outside.

Khalid told me full sun is best for FASTEST root growth in the winter in his zone 9b. A plastic dome (cap off) keeps the soil below wetter, so once a day watering is enough.

A plastic dome (cap on) protects cuttings in days below 32 F.

I have to root indoor since my winter is -20 F below zero.

straw, my bright red The Dark Lady was on rootstock, most probably Dr. Huey, which is what we have in California. That's interesting that rootstock would affect color; there's always something new to learn.

straw, thank you for rooting Evelyn for me. I'm still not sure that rose growing will be a success for me. We now have wire cages and pepper tree leaves around the roses. I have three plants of a dianthus cultivar, also in cages, but I saw today that the ground squirrels had pushed aside the wire ring and eaten one dianthus down to the ground. Trying to grow roses again is going to be a challenge for sure, but well worth whatever it will take.

Austin & Michael 9a NorCal & ingrid_vc so. CA zone 9

Below 10-gallon black pot (bottom cut-off, then invert over tiny rooting to protect it from animals eating roses).

Squirrells can't climb over the sharp cut-off edge. Any stinky spices (garlic, curry powder) can be mix with petroleum jelly (Vaseline) to smear on the outer bucket. So far I don't need stinky spices.

When the temp. dips below 28 F, I throw a thermal blanket on top. 28 F is the temp. which Antique Rose Emporium in TX recommends winter-protecting roses.

I had a bunch of tiny rootings outside at 28 F and they kept all leaves when I put a glass mason jar on top, or a plastic jug (cap on).

Queen Nefertiti is extremely thorny, see below, but I had to keep a bucket around it until it's 1.5 feet tall. ANY TINY ROOTINGS' THORNS are too small to keep animals off. As the rooting matures (2nd year) the thorns become larger & denser to keep animals away.

Very thorny roses Queen Nefertiti, Radio Times, and Mary Magdalene are the most drought-tolerant in my garden among 150+ own root varieties. Two people in hot & dry climate also shared that Mary Magdalene is drought tolerant.

Below Queen Nefertiti does well for Joey in WY with low rainfall, zone 4. I had to move mine to a fast draining & loamy soil raised bed to avoid the heavy rain here. Now the thorns are even larger than pic. below, which keep all animals away.

My neighbor did the same with his pepper & veggies plants. He put buckets around it for at least 2 months to prevent rabbits from eating. When the pepper plants are over 1 foot tall, he took the buckets off. See below neighbor's pepper plants inside buckets:

Gezzz I had forgotten all about Queen Nef ! I grew her years ago in Houston. Has anyone tried writing to DA about his older roses that do so well in USA. Try to get him to rethink. His Dad was super nice met him years ago. Seems like our nurseries could pay them a premium to carry the older varieties, then charge more to customers to make up difference. I mention this because Straw, you are only one person and can only do so much. I think rose people go on a mission for that desired rose. We may not spend $ on clothes or cars but ok to overspend on a rose.

I don’t know if they still carry it but High Country Roses used to have QueenNefertiti

Straw - I'm so proud of you!!

I also wanted to mention that I sent you an email a few days ago...just wondering if you got it. If you did...not hurry on answering. :) :) :)

rosecanadian Thank you, Carol. I found it in my Spam folder (gmail does that). Queen Nefertiti bush looks like barbed wire sticks, but the bloom lasts long in the vase once the bush matures. I moved it 3 times since it needs fast drainage (best in hot & dry climate).

Below pic. was taken this Nov. 11, 2022. Queen Nefertiti blooms last twice longer in the vase in cool weather, up to 5 days. It's yellow in cold weather.

And more pinkish in hot weather (phosphorus is more available at warm temp):

Austin I sent you a message since I want to send Evelyn rooting (pic. below) to you this Sat. Nov. 19 before black Friday that can cause delay in mailing.

Roots grow faster OUTDOOR in warm zone through the winter with enough rain and sunshine, if a bucket is put around it to protect animals from eating rootings, plus a thermal blanket or plastic cover can be put on top when temp. dips below 28 F.

Below rooting will be bigger than gallon size by March if planted OUTDOOR in your warm zone through winter.

Radio Times rooted itself through my zone 5a winter at -20 F below zero when I dumped soil and branches on top to winter-protect. In March, I found a baby Radio Times (1/2 gallon root) next to the mother bush.

Straw I will be out of town next week so please wait. I hate to be a problem but family plans with my children I will be leaving Tues back on Saturday afternoon. Thanksgiving is a big family event this year and I am going early. Really sorry I can make it grow once it is here. Please send me personal message how I can pay you for your charity; then you can send anytime after Thanksgiving that suites your schedule. Hope this is not a big inconvenience.

Straw I just saw this last message with paying directions... My only suggestion is that I will pay more for sending it UPS 2 day Blue label. Also, pretty sure that UPS packages do not travel on weekends so might want to check. If true and you sent Friday or Sat with 2 day Blue- MON and TUES would count as the 2 days and I would be gone.

It was like this when I was designing; I was sending and receiving lots via UPS. May have changed, just sharing my experiences before 2020. .

I was having trouble with Houzz messaging, so I am answering here. I do not mind paying additional shipping if that helps. Just need to know how much extra to send. Sorry to be a bother.

Austin Please message me your address so I can check with UPS website as to how fast it takes to ship. I hope to send Evelyn rooting tomorrow Thursday Nov. 16, so it will reach you this Sat. Nov. 19.

The planting hole enables success more than the size of the plant. In acidic rain climate, I use chunky pelletized lime to break up dense clay at bottom for fast drainage. For less rain climate, folks use acidic gypsum to speed up drainage AT BOTTOM of planting hole.

The best potting soil for water-hog English roses is Pro-Mix Moisture (red bag sold at Walmart). MG-moisture control potting soil changes to mostly saw dust, and it breaks down faster than Pro-Mix (mostly peatmoss that can hold water 10 times its weight).

For the root level, I use 1 cup of dolomitic lime (Espoma Garden Lime) per 3 gallons of potting soil plus 1 cup of Espoma Tomato Tone NPK 3-4-6. Mix them well while using a face mask to prevent breathing.

I once had pneumonia & coughing up blood from breathing in peatmoss. It's recommended to use SOLUBLE fertilizer for the 1st year, but that has zero calcium. That's the logic of mixing in dolomitic lime (Garden lime) into potting soil in high rain months.

For less rain months, I mix in 1 cup of acidic gypsum (calcium sulfate) into 3 gallon of potting soil. This is best for no-rain climate with alkaline tap water.

NOT good to put a wad of granular fertilizer right smack on the crown, but safe to mix 1 cup of Espoma Tomato Tone with 3 gallons of potting soil (it's diluted by mixing well into soil). Flowering is much better when the soil has POWDER organic fertilizer mixed in advance.

The chunky granular fertilizer is NOT safe, but Espoma products (Rose Tone NPK 4:3:2, Tomato Tone NPK 3:4:6) is fine like powder and it's well diluted by mixing in and won't burn roots. I prefer Tomato Tone since it's higher in phosphorus and potassium.

NO to mixing in alfalfa meal (too acidic and killed my roses before). Yes to alfalfa tea (2 TBS. soaked overnight with 1 gallon of tap-water, plus 1/2 TBS of sulfate of potash) done 3 times per week. Nitrogen is NOT recommended for winter months, but potassium is still needed for root growth. Root doesn't stop growing unless the temp. is below 50 F.

Calcium and potassium help with fast root growth. Phosphorus and trace elements are from mixing in Tomato Tone (that really helps with flowering later on).

A box cutter is handy to buy from Walmart. A box cutter can cut off the bottom of big plastic pot to invert that over a rooting to protect it from being eaten by animals. Chipmunks climb up to my pot this April and ate thornless Red Yves seedling to the crown. It took me 10 years before I could root that rose, and the chipmunks destroyed that in a few minutes. Stinky spices (garlic, basil or curry powder) can be mixed with petroleum jelly & smeared on below plastic pot to keep animals from eating small rootings:

strawchicago z5 I am having big issues with communication- it either Houzz or my equipment. My last message was deleted before. Very concerned over plant on doorstep if you are sending today; please allow me to pay more so I get it Monday. I am waiting to send you $ via paypal until I hear back.

Austin: I re-post my message for you here in case it helps others with rootings in cold winter:

Evelyn rooting that I reserved for you did well with 2 weeks of temp. at 32 F to 28 F (with just a plastic bottle with cap on top to winter-protect).

I find that a plastic pot (bottom cut-off), invert over a rooting in the ground, then pile up wood chips up to 1 foot is the best way to winter protect down to -20 F, with wind chill factor of minus 30 below zero in my zone 5a.

That way rain can still get inside to nourish the roots. A plastic bottle on top makes it too humid and the leaves get blackspots, but dry wood-chips piled up inside an inverted plastic bucket keep leaves healthy, plus keep roots moist thus no need to water in winter.

Watering in winter as in heavy rain in poor-drainage clay killed 20+ year old trees in my garden. Plants like barely moist soil, but NOT soaking wet in cold temp.

Evelyn rooting had healthy leaves outside through freezing temp, until I brought it inside the house for the past week and it declined since I overwater it, plus lack of sunshine.