It's biggest problem, is a lack of good sun. They do not need big pots and many are grown as a subtropical bonsai.

I'm not really interested in growing it as a bonsai plant.

The pot it is in is definitely too big. When I repot, I will go smaller for sure.

It does look like it hasn't gotten any sun or enough bright light. It's previous home was in a condo which faced north.

Not suggesting that you do grow it as a bonsai, just that yours will not need a bigger pot. As long as the soil is well-draining, I don't think it is too big either. If you can put it outside in the growing season, you will see lots of new growth.

I wonder whether the two stems (they are actually tied together) will separate when I repot it. If they do, then I will put them up separately. I agree that the plant would probably do a lot better if taken outside for the summer. Could look like a completely different plant! Thanks for weighing in 41 North.

They are very robust plants, and do get HUGE under good conditions. One of my favorite succulents. They do propagate easily, it only takes one leaf! Hard to get the quality of outdoor sun indoors, but even in Ontario, they will love the difference outdoors for a season.

I agree that outdoor time can make a big difference in plants. I just worry about bringing in insects when returning the plants to the home when the weather gets too cold.

I did repot the plant, but I didn't do it properly. I removed some of the potting media, straightened it out and put it in a smaller pot. The top of the media was dry, but the rest of it had some moisture in it. I am wondering whether I should remove all of the media in the spring. Also not sure of the purpose of both stems if they are indeed two separate plants. Also don't know why the one stem that was cut off hasn't produced any shoots.

Well, this plant will be an experiment for me. In the late spring my trees leaf out and I get very little sun in my home. I will certainly have to consider taking the plant outdoors unless I get some supplemental lighting.

I also think the plant would be best in a clay pot. So if I repot in the spring, I will look for one.

I would repot in the spring, clay pot is good. Knock off all the old potting mix and use fresh commercial cactus/succulent mix. For now I would put it in your brightest window. Be very careful not to overwater. Succulents store water in their leaves and stems, so you neednn't water much at this point. After you repot, you can trim off those long straggly stems (cuttings can be re-rooted). I don't know what that stump section is, but if for nothing else than appearance, I would trash that. When your weather warms up, put it outside, transitioning slowly into full sun. As others said, it's struggling for lack of light.

I take my entire plant hoard (don't ask, don't tell), outside in the milder months, anywhere from March to December 1 here (Zone 7b/NJ), depending on the species. I don't have bugs coming in. Maybe a few crickets in September, but they are cool

Socks, I did readjust the plant by removing some of the soil and reducing the size of the pot. I did not remove all of the media. Doing that kind of scares me! But I will try it. That will give me a better opportunity to see whether the two stems are attached somehow. But like you say, it just might be something to throw away. But if it has roots, then it would be worthwhile to keep it, wouldn't it---maybe just cut it down further?

41 North, I have taken a few succulents out and find they are pretty hardy and had no bug issues. But I did get thrips on my calathea. Those bugs are a nightmare! I've also had a few of my best amaryllis get a virus. I also have to worry about squirrels damaging the plants or knocking them over. (I like your climate better!)

yeah, well, we have ISSUES TOO with climate, and critters. Most Calathea are NOT so easy in the North but do love a few.

You definitely need to get rid of the plastic binding the 2 trunks together asap. It is or will soon be constricting flow of photosynthate and hormones to the roots, which can result in loss of a significant fraction of the root mass.

The pruning should be easy because the plant already has a pretty good shape, but I'd wait until June to prune. Ideally, you would remove all lanky winter growth around Father's Day, along with any other branches that don't compliment the composition. All growth that occurs during the summer months should be considered as a permanent part of the composition because summer growth has the shortest internodes and makes a fuller plant. Pinch branches all summer after they have 2 pairs of leaves, and try to make sure your plant has only bifurcations (2 branches originating from the same point) instead of trifurcations (3 branches originating from the same point). Your plant will look much better.

The plant wants full sun and would REALLY show its appreciation if it's summered outdoors; and would do very well with regular applications of Foliage-Pro 9-3-6. Allow it to become almost but not quite completely dry to the bottom of the pot before watering.

If you need to use strings to brace the plant, use 3 or 4 and tie them off to the pot.

Bifurcations vs trifurcations:

Al

Tapla, thanks for weighing in! I have missed "seeing" you in the forums!

I have removed soil from the original pot, downsized the pot and straightened out the plant. I will do a complete repot (all media to be removed) and pot into a clay pot in around April. (I see your picture regarding anchoring the plant with string and will do so if requires it.)

I am marking my calendar to prune this jade in June. Must remember to pinch!

So even though the plant has a reasonably good shape, the pruning is quite drastic then? Would it be something like this:

I have untied the two stems. The one with no growth looks like this (not very healthy!):

I will move the plant outdoors when weather permits and fertilize with Foliage Pro. I am optimistic that this jade is going to be a whole lot happier soon!

Tapla, I have another gardening issue that is really bothering me and making me sad. Could I message you?

Others here know more than I, but I believe your planned pruning is too drastic, removing too many leaves.

I don't know if my planned pruning is too drastic. I drew the possible cut lines from how I understood tapla's drawing and what he was saying. How would you trim this plant, socks?

I now have a plant light on the plant as I am afraid of moving it to a brighter spot near a window as I have a lot of plants by my windows and I don't want to have the mildew to spread to other plants. I am looking to see what I can treat the mildew with.

Some guidelines:

It's best to always repot Crassula just before the summer solstice (around Father's day in the US) unless you have good reason to believe the plant can no longer survive because the soil retains too much water.

Plants that are suffering from disorderly systems due to poor cultural conditions should not be pruned; this, because the plant's true food (sugar/glucose) is produced in leaves through the process of photosynthesis and sickly plants cannot afford loss of their food source (leaves).

Just before the summer solstice is the best time to do any hard work on almost any houseplant or tropical/subtropical trees. "Hard work" includes heavy pruning and repotting.

Plants (unless in a state of predictive dormancy) want and need a full compliment of all nutrients absorbed via the root pathway, in the soil and available for uptake in an appropriate concentration and ratio at all times, including the winter months.

For the most part, a healthy plant can be pruned very hard and quickly resume growth if it is pruned at the appropriate time.

An extremely high % of grower's plants (that require pruning or would have more eye appeal if pruned) are comprised of a mixture of summer and winter growth. If you time your pruning such that all leggy winter growth is removed in June (just before the summer solstice in the Southern Hemisphere) annually, your plants will be fuller, more compact, and have greater eye appeal.

Root congestion is an insidious thief, limiting plants from acquiring the resources (air/ water/ nutrients) they need to grow normally. All plants should be repotted at regular intervals, or divided if their root systems do not readily lend themselves to repotting procedures. Potting up to a larger size pot is a half measure that will somewhat relieve the limitations associated with root congestion, but is quite ineffective when compared to the complete elimination of the stress caused by root congestion when the grower elects to do a full repots in a timely manner.

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Currently, your plant is not a candidate for hard pruning due to low vitality. Focus on providing cultural conditions that allow the plant to create more food/energy than it needs to grow and keep its systems orderly. Reserve energy is food in the bank, and just as money in the bank for you and me, it's there to rely on if ever it's needed. Energy in reserve is what allows us to do heavy work on plants (full repots and hard pruning) with the expectation they'll quickly recover.

Your plant already has a pretty good rough form; so, when it's a good candidate for a summer pruning, most of the pruning will consist of removing a couple of downward growing branches and shortening existing secondary branching. Secondary branches are those growing off branches which in turn are growing from the trunk. In reiteration, a primary branch is attached to the trunk, a secondary branch is attached to a primary branch and a tertiary branch to a secondary branch, et cetera.

Concentrate on giving the plant more light and warm temps. Watering correctly and monitoring watering intervals will make fertilizing very easy and effective. When you are watering so the entire soil column is as wet as it can be, and at least 20% of the water applied exits the drain hole, all you need to do is fertilize at every 4th watering in summer and every 5th watering in winter. Keep track of when it's time to fertilize by dropping a marble, button, other object in the pot each time you water, then retrieve the objects when you fertilize.

You can message me if you like, but you'll get a quicker response if you ask here. I have at least 100 messages re plant stuff backed up on message boards and in my email. If it's something you want to keep personal, mark it as such and I'll get to it asap.

Al

Thank you Al for educating me on the correct timing of pruning, especially hard pruning. I understand that plants that are underperforming and may be stressed, are not to be pruned until they show enough improvement to be able to handle the pruning.

Sounds like June is the best month for pruning. That gives the plant time to regrow during the best season when temperatures are warm and daylight is at its maximum.

Interesting that plants still need nutrients during the winter (unless dormant). I believe the nutrients are given less often as the plant is also usually watered less often.

Pruning plants at the right time will produce plants that "will be fuller, more compact, and have greater eye appeal." I like that! Makes sense.

I see . . . root congestion limits plant growth. A total repot (removing all soil and untangling roots) can help the plant enormously.

Thank you for the tips about pruning this plant. Helpful! Love the idea of dropping a pebble each time you water.

Your advice is most welcome and helpful!

I wrote you back in July (on gardenweb message board) but didn't hear back. I will try again.

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I did do a repot of this plant into a smaller pot and watered it. I moved it into more light and added a plant light too. I had hoped to have the plant slowly improve and gain strength. SADLY, today the plant completely collapsed---it just bent over on the main stem. This seems really bad. Maybe it can't be saved after all?

Plant is now leaning against the chair.

Actually, I have now discovered that the other stem with no leaves is soft at the bottom.

If I cut to near soil level, will it sprout new growth? Toss it? Try to salvage a few stems or leaves for propagation?

If a jade or mini jade (portulacaria) simply falls over, it's almost a certainty it's been over-watered and the roots have rotted to the degree the plant is no longer sufficiently anchored to the soil, unless it was recently repotted. It's not clear from what you said, if the plant was repotted just before your most recent post here, or back in July. If in July, the plant should have recovered from a full repot quickly and would be fully anchored by now.

IDK if the plant fell over (at the arrow) recently or months ago. The leafless trunk might be a complete goner. Couldn't see the indented area on the trunk in the first image you provided.

If I cut to near soil level, will it sprout new growth? Toss it? Try to salvage a few stems or leaves for propagation? ..... can't say whether or not the plant will survive if yet chop it back hard. My inclination is, if the trunk is rotted in the vicinity of the arrow, it's very unlikely that the plant would back-bud, or that you could propagate the plant, but there's nothing to stop you from trying. The reason I suggest propagation will not be successful is because a rotten trunk is a pretty good indicator that a systemic root infection by one of the several damping-off fungi has entered the plant's vasculature, which affects the plant's ability to move water/ nutrients, growth regulators, and photosynthate (the plant's true food [glucose/sugar] produced during photosynthesis). In cases where rot migrates from roots to stem tissues, the flow of photosynthate to roots is compromised before water and nutrient movement to the top of the plants, which is why roots die first, followed by the rest of the plant.

Also keep in mind that the probability that propagation by cuttings becomes exponentially more difficult as the plant's vitality level declines; but again, there is no reason you can't try.

Al

@newhostalady Buying a brood light and using an incandescent bulb is a poor strategy, and there are several reasons. 1) An incandescent bulb would be wasteful (in terms of $ and energy loss) because it's better at producing heat than light. 2) In order for a 60-100w incandescent bulb to be effective insofar as the amount of light produced, it would have to be placed very near the foliage, which would definitely result in very low humidity and desiccation of the plant's foliage. 3) A 150w LED light that provides the same amount of light as a 150w incandescent bulb uses only 18w of electricity. The bulbs are also available in 200 and 300w size at a commensurate lumens:wattage output, all sizes costing about $10/ea. Staying more toward the blue end of the spectrum (4500-6500K color temperature would be best).

Click me to see what he's talking about.

I suppose it's possible that the plant has symptoms related to oedema as there are some sunken areas I noticed on the leaves, but the most conspicuous symptoms presented are related to PM. Typically, oedema symptoms are more conspicuous on the inferior surface (underside) of the leaves.

Fungal diseases that first affect roots typically migrate systemically through xylem tissues to affect the top of the plant. When lower parts of the stem are showing symptoms of suffering from one of the damping-off fungi, the upper parts are almost always infected, even is the infected area is asymptomatic. This significantly decreases the probability that propagules will root.

Al

I'm not at all concerned about whether or not someone takes my advice, but I do admit that when someone offers advice with the potential to be harmful or counterproductive, I'll speak up, which illustrates I have the OP's interest at heart. You SAY what I said wasn't helpful, but it really was, with more helpful information further upthread, which makes your POV subjective as opposed to objective. In my post just above, I simply suggested that there are some potentially serious issues associated with some of your advice ..... and there are better options. Instead of attacking me, why not focus your energy on supporting your own position by explaining how you arrived at your conclusions, and what makes you think your advice is superlative. I qualify what I say and explain the reasoning behind my advice with great regularity. That has served me well, and based on the number of followers I have earned, others appreciate it as well.

The destroyer of weeds, thistles and thorns is a benefactor, whether he soweth grain or not. ~ Robert Ingersoll

Telling Hostalady not to expect much in the way of successfully propagating a start from this plant is firmly grounded in reality. As noted, there is nothing to stop her from trying, but my considerable experience with propagating hundreds of different species and the knowledge I've absorbed from dozens of reference sources points to the veracity of what I said. The forewarning might help to lessen any disappointment should she try and fail, or provide impetus for the decision to not waste her time. The information simply provides her with information she can rely on to make an informed decision.

BTW - profanity is seldom profound, and those who use it as a crutch make their position appear even more tenuous than it already is.

Al

Just to recap first:

I received this jade two weeks ago. The owner didn't want it anymore. They said they did not have enough light/sun for it. They also said they thought they had overwatered it.

I bagged it to bring it home. I left the bag on for over 24 hours. I believe the mildew was not there when I picked up the plant. I thought the pot was too big (10-12" pot). I potted it into an 8" pot. I merely removed soil, but did not disturb the roots.

The main plant stem just bent over days ago, near the soil line. The second stem (that had no top growth) seemed OK, but on further inspection, I found the bottom of that stem to be soft.

It seemed to me that this plant was hopeless, so I took a couple of top stems and leaves to try to propagate and just see what happened. If this was indeed caused by a root infection, I would be throwing the plant out (other than what I cut off). But I would experiment with the cuttings.

Joy W, I love to see your comments, but I did not appreciate your rude comments to Tapla. I did not see that you offended him, but you did attack him. Not appreciated on my thread. If everything were so simple, we wouldn't have to have any of these forums. But I think we should value each other's experiences and learn from each other.

I cut off the main stem and the other stem.

So when I got this plant two week's ago, it looked like this:

As of yesterday, I cut off both stems that were tied together:

More pictures below.

Continuing with pictures:

This is where the stem bent over.

Second after cutting the main stem off

Any other comments?

..... can't think of anything to add to what's been said so far.

Do you have questions/ concerns?

Thank you Al for asking! I think a lot has been covered here. Glad to "see" you still posting. But, now that you ask, I do have a question!

In relation to the jade plant, I would have to ask this: when growing a very young jade, when would you first pinch the jade in order to have it branch out? Would one let the first stem grow to a certain height before pinching and then do what you mentioned above?

You're welcome, glad to help.

....... when growing a very young jade, when would you first pinch the jade in order to have it branch out? It depends on what vision you have for the plant, and to some degree whether or not you're familiar enough with the plant's obligated response to pruning, to pinch and prune to achieve the vision you have for the plant. An example of your vision governing how you pinch and prune can be seen in the fact that if you want to induce/ create a trunk that tapers, your pruning and pinching process would be much different than if you simply want to create something that has a somewhat natural shape or topiary, and trunk taper isn't a factor.

Let's assume we're talking about a novice grower who wants to have a healthy jade or portulacaria that looks like a tree shape or a topiary shape sort of like a lollipop. If you want a straight trunk, you would allow your cutting or new start to grow in ht to about 2/3 of the ht you want the plant to be. So, if you want to have a 3' tall plant (from soil line) you would pinch the trunk approximately 2' above the soil. That will give you 1 ft of ht to develop the canopy by annual pruning in June and summer pinching.

If you want a sinuous trunk, one with plenty of movement instead of being stick straight. You would start pinching very early on in the plant's development. When you pinch a branch or stem, it changes the direction of the branch/stem grows. You can use this to control what direction the trunk takes after the pinch.

The growth habit of jades and and portulacaria will be leaves growing in opposite pairs and 90* alternate on the branch. If you pinch a jade or portulacaria in June and your plant is reasonably healthy, you can almost always expect a pair of new branches at the 2 nodes below the pinch. This means the plant will produce a branch growing left, right, forward and backward - like N, S, E, W. Any one of those 4 branches can be chosen as the new leader. The branches not chosen to be the leader can be removed, or left to grow as 'sacrifice branches' which will help thicken the trunk, only to be removed at a later date.

At this point in development of the plant below, it has been grown only to establish a trunk line with taper. Almost none of the branches will be used in the final composition.

Below, the trunkline has been revealed by hard pruning, The stub on the right will become the first/ lowest branch. The meager growth in 2 places at the end of the stub will be a bifurcation of the branch into a 'Y' shape. The near horizontal stub (with wire) on the left will be the second branch and the near vertical part (with wire) is the new leader. I might allow this plant to grow for a full year or more before I prune it again, which will allow the plant to recover from the extremely hard pruning.

Would one let the first stem grow to a certain height before pinching and then do what you mentioned above? I'm not sure I understand this question. Pinching removes the apical meristem at the end of the branch, which forever eliminates the branch's ability to extend/lengthen; and, it also forces new branches to form behind the pinch. Pinching is used as a tool to keep your plants full and compact, to change direction of a branch or stem when you don't want to mechanically change the branch's position through use of wire, twine, braces, etc., and to provide multiple pruning opportunities to choose from based on how well they compliment the composition, or don't.

Pinching also conserves the plant's energy If a branch is extending and you pinch it at the tip, you are removing only a tiny bit of growth; whereas, if you allow a branch to get very long then prune it back hard, the energy to produce that branch has been wasted, except in cases where the branch was being used as a sacrifice branch to help thicken/strengthen the trunk or build taper in the trunk.

Al

Thank you Al for your detailed answer. I love a lot of detail! It is amazing what can be created with pruning. Seems like an art form to me. Is that not what bonsai is? I had not really thought about what pinching a plant would do to the overall shape of a plant. I just knew that pinching often encouraged a stem to produce growth below the pinching with new growth from the nodes below. You have taught me also that pinching the plant when it is in active growth produces stronger growth. I will be saving this thread to reread again in order to grow a beautiful jade plant!

"Everything I have learned about plants is a byproduct of my ongoing quest for a higher level of proficiency at bonsai." That is wonderful! So, I understand, it takes a lot of knowledge to be able to do bonsai and in that journey a lot of knowledge is gained about plants. And, in turn, I know that you have helped many people along your journey---and that includes me!

You've really got me thinking about pruning and the effects on a plant. I have a coleus I overwintered because I was able to get a cutting to root. It is finally growing well and I pinched the top growth. Now I see that the overall shape of the plant isn't really what I like. I am going to see what I can find online about pinching plants to learn more about it.

These are coleus I pruned and pinched:

The plants above, including the duck-foot variety in the image immediately above, have a sprawling/ weeping/ pendulous growth habit as seen below in the image of coleus/asparagus fern.

So a bit of pruning and some judicious pinching can turn a plant with open/ airy/ pendulous growth tendencies into a very full and compact specimen.

Below - Colorado blue spruce, carefully pinched. The top is so dense you can set a glass of water/ cup of coffee on the top and it will sit flat.

Below: the trunk is a Juniperus communis (common juniper) that just showed up in my garden as a volunteer. The top is a Juniperus horizontalis (blue rug juniper) I grafted to the common juniper trunk. After several years, I started to prune, then pinched until I came up with the "comma" plant below.

Below, Aeonium. The growth habit of which is to produce 1 long stem with a rosette of foliage at the apex, with the occasional branch here and there with a rosette of foliage at every branch apex. By pinching the stem close to the ground, I forced back-budding of several dozen branches. I kept the branches growing in a position that added to the composition and rubbed off those that detracted from it. The odds of a plant ever growing in this manner w/o human intervention are near absolute zero. A single simple cut with a scalpel and treating the wound appropriately with waterproof wood glue to prevent desiccation of the stem at the wound site produced a plant with 9 branches all originating from the same ht on the stem, each with it's own rosette of foliage at its apex.

Pilea variegata, pinched:

Al

I am impressed Al! Very impressed! Each one of these plants is an art form!

These photographs tell me that there is a lot of things that can be done to plants to change their growth pattern with pinching (and knowledge) being the key.

I am also aware that many of these "creations" have taken a long time to produce. But step by step one comes closer to the goal they may have in mind. I believe the journey to your goal has been exciting as each of these plants transformed towards a new beauty.

The Colorado Blue Spruce and the Juniper are truly amazing and just had to put a smile on my face.

Lovely to still have you helping others here to learn and show us possibilities that we didn't even think were possible!

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Let me dream a little---we live near each other and you put me under your wing! Ha---I would be in heaven! Dreaming is allowed, right?

Question: Do you look at messages from the gardenweb message board?