Not too likely. The only way would be if the flywheel is split. It has a hard key not likely to shear nor crankshaft to wallow out.

Might be bad crankshaft seals, bad reed valves, something stuck in the reed valves. (Grass cuttings, twig, etc.)

Try a different plug also.

Walt Conner

First, liquid gasoline does not burn. If you could get past the vapors, liquid gasoline would extinguish a flame. The function of the carb is not just to deliver gasoline to the engine but deliver it in vaporized form. It does this when the piston draws air across the venturi in the carb. If you are correct in your assement, then there are two probable causes. Most likely the main fuel jet is clogged with debris or varnish OR your float has a pin hole in it and is shutting off the fuel supply coming into the carb. I am assuming that when you disconnect the fuel line from the carb, fuel runs all over the place. If not solve that problem first.

Yes two strokes can go out of time. The key rarely ever shears completely although I have had a few (I have 13 Toro 22040s) but if you hit enough obstructions over time it will partially shear. If it tries to dislocate your shoulder when you pull the starter, it is out of time. Also if you have been tinkering with the armature and it is too far away from the flywheel magnets, you can have good spark but be out of time. Take any standard size business card, slip it between the armature and the flywheel magnets, loosen the armature allowing it to be pulled against magnets, tighten armature and remove business card. Armature gap is set.

Lastly, I've been running Toro 22040s for 15 years and I've never seen a valve in any of the blocks I've taken apart and I've never had a bad crankshaft seal. These engines last me about three to five years mowing the equivalent of 50 yards a week, 33 weeks a year.

BTW do install a new plug.

what's the compression......if it is not compressing,it's not moving the fuel ....otherwise it's not sucking !
Jim

Mike, timing isn't off unless the flywheel key is sheared. That lawn boy has a capacitive discharge ignition. One thing lawn boy had years before the bs engine and tecumseh.
Check your fuel system.
Peace

Don't know what running Toros of years has to do with anything. The man said he added gasoline thru the plug hole and didn't get a fire, the gasoline would have vaporized of course IF there was fair compression, there's compression, Jim (grin). LBs do not shear keys, split flywheels sometimes. While business cards are usually "close enough", there is no standard thickness as we found here a couple of years ago. Most of the newer "budget" cards are close to the correct thickness.

Walt Conner

There is a chance that the "Starting Leg" of the coil is bad. Lawn Boy coils have two spark circuts to supply starting spark and running spark, that is how they get their spark advance. You may be seeing only the advance spark, which would make starting difficult. The advance timing cuts in about 800 RPMs.

I really don't think the "run" section will fire at cranking rpm.

Walt Conner

Mic,
Listen to the technical experts. My advice comes from actually operating these machines, breaking them and fixing them myself for over 15 years. LawnBoy owns Toro or vice versa. My machines are just heavier in all repsects. I would recommend never putting gas into the cylinder. It is insanely dangerous.

"I would recommend never putting gas into the cylinder"

I agree. I use wd-40 in 2-strokes.

Toro owns lawnboy.

Toro 2-cycle's were made by suzuki. They were heavier than the lawnboy.

I have never heard of a start section not working and a run section working. Most cap. discharge coils just plain old quit all together.

Back to the original post. We seem to be having fun but where did mike go?

Peace

There is no problem putting straight gasoline into the spark plug hole of a 2 cycle engine as long as you don't do it several times in a row. I expect the person posting meant that he put LB fuel into the spark plug hole anyway, again nothing wrong with this. Toro continued the LB design for a few years after buying LB and as far as the Toro 2 cycle being so much better, why do we not hear anything about 30 - 40 year old ones or hear of hardly any for that matter. Wasn't Suzuki the one who made the model "M" LB fizzle?

Walt Conner

Walt the Toro/Suzuki 2 cycle engine is well known in commercial lawn service circles as on of the best. Even used ones demand high prices. They are tough well designed engines. The Lawn-Boy M series is very similar in design being a piston-ported 2 cycle. One of Lawn-Boy's best in my opinion. As far as the sales fizzle the M series mower was too expensive. It did have a few glitches with safety interlock switches causing annoying start-up failures but the engine itself is tough, dependable, powerful, and runs like a top. The oil injection failure rumors were pure falacy. The M series engine has a steel one piece connecting rod and is almost bullet proof. OK. So much for my defense of the M series....I like all of the Lawn-Boy mowers as well as the Toro/Suzuki. What I don't like about the Suzuki or any mower for that matter is parts that are ridiculously high priced. Suzuki parts prices are in the stratosphere. The Lawn-Boy parts are for the most part reasonable and there are some aftermarket parts as well. Used parts are plentiful too keeping the remaining guys like us in business for many years to come.

"...and as far as the Toro 2 cycle being so much better, why do we not hear anything about 30 - 40 year old ones or hear of hardly any for that matter."

Each individual mower on one of my trucks cut an average of 50 lawns a week. A homeowner will cut his lawn an average of 28x a year. Obviously a few more in the deep south. Based on those stats, each one of my machines see an equivalent of 1.8 years of residentail service A WEEK. In one year each machine amasses almost 59 years of equivalent residential service each year with no engine related problems. You don't hear about them because they are commercial machines. When they were still being imported prices ranged from 700-800 dollars. After EPA limited sales to existing stock on hand and capped new imports prices were $1,300.00 or more. A smart man will never even attempt to justify to his wife to spend 800 dollars less alone 1300 on a 21" wb. Everyone opts for the $299.00 units. You also don't hear about them because typically the guys that run this equipment know more about repair than the dealers' mechanic. In my case, my parts inventory for these machines is more extensive than what my dealer keeps on hand. And lastly you don't hear about them often because their down time is minimal. A machine like this will last a homeowner two lifetimes if he gives the grease fittings on the trans a regular pump of grease.

I jumped over here from one of the other forums I was visiting. It is not something I will be doing many times in the future. I'm beyond thinking it is "okay" to pour gas into any part of the mower other than the gas tank and I surely will not debate such a stupidly dangerous act with people that do.

The primary problem identified in this post was fuel delivery with some other minor concerns. If fuel is reaching the carb but not the cylinder then either the main jet is clogged or the float is bad. A two stroke with a worn crankshaft seal will have a lean fuel/air mixture. This will make it difficult starting but once started it will run the rpms close to 6000+, eventually overheat, wear the rings and score the cylinder in very short order. None of which was identified as a problem in the post. Three conditions must be met for combustion: fuel, air and a source of ignition. Two of these three are already present.

"I'm beyond thinking it is "okay" to pour gas into any part of the mower other than the gas tank and I surely will not debate such a stupidly dangerous act with people that do."

I've been doing this for the last few decades. I guess I'm just really stupid. Granted, it's not the first thing on my list of diagnostic procedures. I'd bet that just about anyone that knows anything about small engines has done this "stupidly dangerous act". There is no difference between this and using the primer button (unvaporized raw fuel) or chokeing. In fact, I recently did this on a stubborn 1947 Briggs model ZZ (130 pounds of raw cast iron) which had not been running in at least 30+ years. A thimble full was all it took. No debate here.

". I'm beyond thinking it is "okay" to pour gas into any part of the mower other than the gas tank and I surely will not debate such a stupidly dangerous act with people that do."

Sounds like someone who is still wet behind the ears. Won't even bother with the rest of the drivel.

Walt Conner

Fairview, You're correct in assuming that this forum isn't for you. There are a couple of reasons for this. Your attitude doesn't fit in with the average member here and the gap between your actual knowledge of 2-strokes and what you "think" you know is almost as large as your ego. Perhaps priming an engine through the spark plug hole seems stupidly dangerous to you but in reality it is quite safe. Nothing dangerous happens and it serves as an incredible diagnostic tool.
Your last paragraph....
"The primary problem identified in this post was fuel delivery with some other minor concerns. If fuel is reaching the carb but not the cylinder then either the main jet is clogged or the float is bad. A two stroke with a worn crankshaft seal will have a lean fuel/air mixture. This will make it difficult starting but once started it will run the rpms close to 6000+, eventually overheat, wear the rings and score the cylinder in very short order. None of which was identified as a problem in the post. Three conditions must be met for combustion: fuel, air and a source of ignition. Two of these three are already present."
.....If fuel isn't getting to the combustion chamber there are many reasons other than the 2 you pointed out. A clogged fuel line, a stuck needle seat, a bad reed valve, a blown (not worn) crank seal) a vaccuum leak and the list goes on. You are somewhat confused on what three things must be present for a gasoline internal combustion engine to run. They are in fact: Fuel/air mixture, compression, and spark. You left compression out.
Toro made Suzuki 2 stroke equipped consumer models as well as commercial models. The EPA did not stop anyone from selling these machines. The EPA mandates compliance with emmission standards by certain dates. Toro probably had several reasons for dropping the Suzuki. They were expensive and were not likely to conform to emmision standards. They decided to move forward with other designs.

Thanks for all the helpful advice I finally got the mower running for about 5 Minuts but then the connecting rod broke I think its time to give up and part it out.Thanks Mike.

I have not had problems with connecting rods breaking on LBs. Perhaps the rod cap was left loose? Anyway, the CDI at least is worth salvaging. Someone would probably buy the cylinder if it is good. Is there a lot of play in the bottom crankshaft bushing? This would be typical of an old D600 series and may have been contributing to seal leakeage. If not, that is worth something also.

Walt Conner

If you ever happen to be in Plano, TX stop in at Plano Power. It is at 15th Street and US 75. Ask to see Glenn. He is the owner of the business. Ask to see the inside of his arms. Ask him why he needed skin grafts and then ask him if he would ever pour gas in a mower anywhere else other than in the gas tank. When you look at his arms and after he tells you his story, you may have a different perspective on the safety of priming a mower with gas. It sure changed my perspective on this practice. You might get away with it for a 100 or a 1000 times but the one time you don't, the price paid is pretty stiff. I decided to stop waiting for the one time I didn't get away with it.

Fairview, your comments are needlessly argumentative and to be honest they are not easy to understand.

"Listen to the technical experts. My advice comes from actually operating these machines, breaking them and fixing them myself for over 15 years."

RB> That only a guaranty that you have been doing something. Your comments lead be to believe you have not ben doing it correctly.

" LawnBoy owns Toro or vice versa."

RB> It's vice versa, but I'm not sure what point you were attempting to make with this bit of misinformation.

"My machines are just heavier in all repsects."

RB> Gee, I'm sure that having a fleet of extra heavy lawn mowers must be nice. I can only guess why that is good. If you want to increase their weight even more just ask at the local track for any extra handicapping weights.

"I would recommend never putting gas into the cylinder. It is insanely dangerous."

RB> Liquid gasoline by itself is not explosive or easily flamable. The vapors in the right concentration, or more importantly the atomized gasoline will as we all know burn quite explosively. Dumping liquid gas into a combustion chamber will likely just flood the cylinder and make starting even more difficult. A better idea would be to find out the real reason for the engine not starting.

"Ask him why he needed skin grafts and then ask him if he would ever pour gas in a mower anywhere else other than in the gas tank"

I expect the person you are talking about was pouring gasoline in or ON a HOT engine. Since this person can't even get the engine to fire, it is ridiculous to think it might be hot. Where do you think gasoline explodes when an engine runs? Maybe in the cylinder where he put the gas? Pouring gasoline in the tank of a hot engine is a lot more dangerous.

As for flooding the engine making it harder to start, the trick is in having some idea how much gas to put in. I would recommend that fairview not pour gasoline from a can into the tank, not pump gas from a gas pump into an open necked gas tank fill or even look at gasoline as it might blow up.

By the way, I would really like to have an explanation of this quote,

"A two stroke with a worn crankshaft seal will have a lean fuel/air mixture. This will make it difficult starting but once started it will run the rpms close to 6000+,

Do your engines not have governors? What a load of - - - -

Starting and lose of power will be the problems with leaking seal, oh yes, some mess from fuel mix.

Walt Conner