for fragrance, try Jude the Obscure - there are some recent pics of him in the rose gallery - his smell is so wonderful he has my 16 year old son walking around the backyard singing to him

I'm hot but not dry (although it is now, wish it would rain). I grow many Austins. Once you get the bug, watch out. My favorites are Ambridge Rose and Mary Magdeline. Both bloom a lot, both have the myhr scent. I don't know about LD Braithwaite in the front yard. It is a great rose, constant blooms, but it grows those huge octopus canes, if not cut back I bet it would be easily 10'. He bites really bad too, so don't put him near a traffic area. I started Molineux from a cutting and it is just really starting to come into it's own. It does better in a slightly shaded position. I had it in full sun and had to move it. The blooms open apricot and are lovely in a vase with lavender roses like Angel Face or Heirloom. Sophy is another that blooms non stop but again with the octopus canes. It would easily be 8'. It has a lovely scent and is nice in a vase. When they say small it doesn't mean small in my garden (or yours probably). Lilian Austin has beautiful blooms, they look almost as if they glow. She is very fragrant in my garden. Other posters have disagreed on fragrance. Sharifa has an outstanding fragrance but the leaves are ugly (at least on mine). They curl under like it is diseased but it's fine and it produces regularly. So for scent I'd say yes, for beauty, you might want to put her where she isn't so visable. Another that you don't hear much about but is a tireless bloomer, even in the heat of the summer is Blythe Spirit.
Mary Magdeline
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Sophy with ruella
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Funky foliage on Sharifa
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Old picture of bush of Mary Magdeline
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Sorry for the length. It's hard to stop talking when it comes to Austins.

Nancy

Fair Bianca is a very very small rose.

If you're going to grow it, put it in the front of a bed, and DO NOT PRUNE IT.
If I were to try again to grow it, I think I would keep it in a large container.

The myrrh fragrance is PARTICULARLY strong in this rose. People either love it
or hate it. I really love it, and wish the rose had been stronger.

Jeri

If you want a beautiful pink Austin that blooms a lot, is fragrant, has great foliage and stays small and compact, please try Sister Elizabeth. I'm the only one who ever mentions this rose but I think it's one of the best small roses. Carding Mill is great, blooms a lot, very pretty and neither Sister Eliabeth or CM are fazed by the heat.

Have you ever tried tea roses? They grow into gorgeous large bushes without the octopus arms and bloom all the time. There are some really wonderful ones should you be interested, perhaps for that sunny spot in your back yard.

Ingrid

I agree with Ingrid.
Oh, and if you want lower-growing roses for the front, there are always the lovely,
floriferous, Polyanthas.

Jeri

I grow about a dozen different English roses. But, of the roses you listed, I only grow Charlotte and Molineux.
Molineux is probably better at spreading out more to cover over the "ugly view" you mentioned.
Charlotte is one of my hands-down best performing roses, and probably my favorite modern. In my hot humid 7B climate it grows to a beautifully formed, very upright, 5-6 feet tall bush. The only drawback that I can think of is that the pale yellow tends to fade in the hot summer sun.

I've got my share of Austins and don't have problems with any of them except they tend to be rambunctious growers. No disease exept what is expected in my no spray garden (a bit of mildew and rust). The only one on your list I've had is Molineux and I am sorry I left it behind when I moved. It's still putting on a show at my old house.
My newest is Pretty Jessica, a pretty little pink rose. Small.
I know Tamora is a bit over the top in the smell dep't. but a good little rose and pumps out blooms. 3 feet.
William Shakespeare 2000 and Jude the Obscure are nice spreading types and have the best fragrance to me. About 4 ft.
Lilian Austin (2 ft.) and Pat Austin (4 ft.)are very lovely as is Scepter'd Isle (3-4 ft.).
My favorite was Teasing Georgia but I gave it away as it was too large for my space but oh so lovely.
New also is Tea Clipper and it's shaping up to be an octopus with mostly one to a stem.
Finally Eglantine, a monster of a rose and a steady bloomer (6-7 ft).
Oh one more, Mary Rose - nice rounded bush that is a sight to behold in full bloom. 4 ft.
I wish I could grow each and every Austin but high on my wish list is Golden Celebration, Crown Princess Margareta, The Pilgrim.
Don't know if this will help but sounds like I have sort of the same type climate as you, plenty of sun and mild winters.
Mary

Golden Celebration is good for a very large spot. GC wants to be huge. Really magnificent, and a heavenly scent.

Peachy -- The Pilgrim is among the oddest roses we've grown.
The bloom is simply breathtaking.

The plant, like many other Austins, wanted to grow long octopus canes here.
We tried self-pegging it. That's when it did the strange thing.
Beyond the point where the canes were secured, they continued to grow longer,
but not as normal canes.
They became thin, lax, vines, with prickles, which draped down to the ground, and
snaked along through the grass.
When you walked by, the vines would catch your feet, and affix themselves
to your ankles in a most painful manner.
The third time that happened to DH, he went directly upstairs to the garage,
and came back with a pair of loppers and a shovel.

Jeri

Thanks Jeri. I guess I'll take it off my list. I have no space anyway. Mary

Wow, lots of great advice! I'm beginning to change my mind on the roses in the cottage garden itself, my current thoughts for that are Sharifa Asma, Jubilee Celebration (which I already have in a peat pot) and Tamora or Sister Elizabeth. I think the colors will go well together and blend with other plantings.

I really liked Blythe Spirit -- yellow always cheers things up. I still might get Fair Bianca and slip it in somewhere. If it's small, that should be easy. I need a small, white in the backyard, but it's got to be tough and have thorns so the dogs respect it.

I'm still trying to decide on the one near the patio for wow factor. I just love the english roses with the cupped shapes like Geoff Hamilton or Glamis Castle. Are there any that would grow well here without turning into an octopus? I don't have much of a sense of smell. I love roses more for their shape and color.

While searching the internet I found a large nursery that does mail order only 45 minutes from my house. It's Regan Nursery in Fremont, CA. Does anyone know anything about them? Have you had good experiences? I thought that if I could drive over and buy locally I'd get roses with an extra season of growth and be able to see the plants' shape.

What are your thoughts? This has been really helpful. You guys are great.

Debbie

Regan Nursery doesn't sell roses they GROW themselves, but they do seem to buy
good roses, bare-root, and sell them in containers.

I've not ordered from them, but I've visited, and you really SHOULD. It's too tempting.
:-)

If nothing else, you'll be able to see the roses in bud and bloom, which is helpful.

Jeri

I have Glamis Castle planted next to Sister Elizabeth and it is also staying compact and blooms a lot. It does have the thorns for dog deterrence and very much a cupped shape which is also lovely when it opens more but still stays round.

I'm sending some pictures of Sister Elizabeth in a vase; it's the one with the lilac tones. It really is fragrant. The bush is Glamis Castle which shows its compact form. The squirrels have eaten off the buds and blooms so it's not looking its best but you can see the thorns and the shape of the bush.

I hope this helps a bit with your decision-making.

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Ingrid

I've just compared the photos with the actual flowers of Sister Elizabeth, and the photos are not quite true to color; the rose itself is a pink with lilac tones rather than a true lilac.

Ingrid

Most of my favorite roses are teas, chinas, Pembertons, plus SdlM, RdV, & Basye's Blueberry, but for the front yard, the polyanthas & older floribundas have worked out best.
They are easier to keep in scale for my small front yard and nearly floor to ceiling windows ... Marie Pavie, Pink Gruss an Aachen, & Valentine.
They're not necessarily my overall favorites, but are the favorites for my front yard.

Randy

I'm with Randy that you may want to try some other roses in addition to Austins. Many that he mentions will assume a nice graceful shape with no pruning, so you won't have the struggles with octopus canes. Many of the Austins are somewhat lax and floppy when young, and the flowers nod so that you have to lift them to really see them-- not what you'd want in a front-yard display bed. Save room for a wonderful polyantha or two-- Marie Daly, Perle d'Or, Caldwell Pink-- good garden performers all.

Thanks for the advice on the polyanthas and older floribundas. I think I'll want both Caldwell Pink and Valentine. Where can I order them? Can you suggest some good places to order these types of roses?

I went to Regan's Nursery to see their Austin's in bloom. I called ahead to make sure they had some left. "Oh, yes, over a hundred!", so I jumped in the car and took the trip. They had just pruned ALL of the Austins. Not a bloom in site. So sad! I bought Molineaux, Carding Mill and Charlotte (I was sure about those) and found some other lovely plants for the rest of the garden. I'll have to drive back there in about three weeks to see. Next time, I'll ask if their Austins are in bloom!

Thanks so much.

Debbie

1. "Caldwell Pink" is actually 'PINK PET.'
Check HMF, and you'll find a big list of potential sources which includes ARE,
Chamblees, and Vintage Gardens, among others.
Some of these sources will list it as "Caldwell Pink," and others will more
accurately list it as 'PINK PET.'
Same rose.

2. 'Valentine' (assuming you mean the 1951 Swim Floribunda?) is
available from many of the same sources -- and several others.

To check both of these, start by going to HelpMeFind (see link, below).
Do a PLANT SEARCH, and when you have the rose you're interested in up on the screen,
click on BUY FROM.

Jeri

Here is a link that might be useful: HelpMeFind Roses

Hi, rosecorgis, I garden in Mill Valley and in Sonoma County. Golden Celebration is a blackspotted disaster in my garden. And we don't get blackspot. The only two Austins I grow successfully are English Garden and Tamora.

Livermore has hot summers. Teas and Chinas will excel there. I hope you will experiment with at least one of each. Order mail order for the best plants. "Bermuda Anna Olivier" is a soft yellow Tea and is disease free. For a China, Hermosa (a complex hybrid, to be sure) will be about 4 x 4 with time and blooms all through the summer. Polyanthas bloom all summer, once they start, and never suffer from disease. Perle d'Or will eventually be a larger plant, blooms all the time and has no disease at all. If you have shady parts in your garden, then Raymond Privat is a must have. It likes some sun, some dappled light, for the best bloom color. It's 2.5 x 4 ft mass of mauvey pink. Jeri Jennings is a soft gold hybrid musk plant, in the tones of Golden Celebration but lighter, and only suffers blackspot in the wettest spring. It comes right back. As it matures, it blooms in flushes all summer, more than the average Hybrid Musk. Hermosa Little White Pet is a short by spready thing, blooms all summer. It has myrrh scent and small white flowers in profusion. One of the more mannerly old roses, with a quartered, button eye shape bloom, is Rose du Roi. The bloom is spread across the summer, and the foliage, old fashioned and lovely, is plentiful. I've seen budded plants 4 feet tall in England almost columnar, but here, own root, it's a bushy 3.5 x 3.5 high shouldered plant. In the moderns, Belinda's Dream excels in the heat and is a disease-free plant, 4 x 4 to 4 x 5.

We have a fantastic local rose nursery in Sebastapol called Vintage Gardens. Order mails order from there whenever you can to limit shipping costs. Also in the west coast we have Rogue Valley Roses.

Here is a link that might be useful: search for rose names after selecting plant type

Well, I finally decided and have bought everything. I do mean "everything" so I now need to rearrange my back garden to accommodate the extras I couldn't resist. I was very lucky to get many of them 1/2 off in pots from Regan Nursery in Fremont! I have a little mini Austin garden on my patio right now blooming it's head off!

For the front, I decided on:

Near the fence--
Monineaux
Carding Mill
Charlotte

Elsewhere in the front--
Sister Elizabeth
Glammis Castle
Jubilee Celebration
Pretty Jessica
Valentine

To put in the backyard (somewhere)--
Jude the Obscure
Huntington Rose
Caldwell Pink
Grandmother's Hat

I've noticed that both Caldwell Pink and Grandmother's Hat can get BIG. Can either of them take part shade?

Thank you to everyone who helped me. I can't imagine the disaster I would have had without all of you!! I would have bought plants that would have outgrown the space in three years then cried to shovel prune beautiful plants whose only sin was being too big! I also want to thank you for educating me about bands, where to buy and own root roses. All of my previous roses were grafted.

Once I get the garden planted, I'll post a picture. Then I'll try to remember to do it a year or two from now when it's grown in.

Thanks again!!!

Debbie

I have two plants of Caldwell Pink and the one getting less sun is not blooming nearly as steadily, and isn't as big either. Have only grown it for two years, size already impessive and I have no clue how big it will be ultimately. I've left l o t s of room around it, jic...

I would suggest these Austins also for consideration since they have controlled growth habits. Symphony does well in California. It is a nice pale yellow. Happy Child might do well. Lady Emma Hamilton is staying small for me in its pot; I don't know what its final growth habit will be in the ground. It is very fragrant and very pretty and would go well with Carding Mill if they bloom together. Perdita is also a nice one with a smaller bush. The last one I would mention that has a controlled growth habit is The Prince, but his flowers tend to fry in our heat. He might benefit from some shade during the hot afternoons.

If you want a couple floribundas that are almost constant bloomers, I would suggest Lilli Marleen and Shockwave. Both have done well for me. Another couple of promising varieties are Simply Marvelous and Kordes' Orange Flower Circus. They have done well in our heat and have not gotten out of bounds.

Debbie,

I live just over the hill from you in Tracy. Our micro climate is a little different, but to give you a heads up. Austins will throw canes! I have only one Austin, Emmanuel and it has 10' -12' canes. Really read up on the growth habit of your roses. If your looking for well mannered growth and easy to maintain shape, you could be fighting a beast!
Give Vintage a try in the near future. They are the absolute best for the vast selection and expertise! My best roses have come from them and also go to the Sacramento Cemetery rose sale in the spring.
Daun