Wow, Katy. That's an ambitious idea. But after reading about your wondrous weekend affair on the Island, it doesn't surprise me that you're the one to bring it up.

Here's some input from my "neck of the woods":

I'm very familiar with the Crane Estate, since I have lived near there all my life (so far!) on the North Shore of Mass. Over the years, I attended summer concerts on the sweeping lawn of the "Grand Allee" and spent idyllic days on neighboring Crane Beach. The mansion and grounds are a classic representation of early 20th-century grandeur, though -- being typically New England -- not ostentatious.

The Crane Estate is tucked into the northeast coastal corner of Massachusetts, so for folks driving from Conn. or Western Mass., it would be a haul -- though it is is not difficult to get to from the major highways. If we were to have the gathering there, I'd advise attendees from afar to make it a weekend outing with visits to local attractions (Gloucester/Rockport, Salem, etc. all have fantastic historic sites, museums, beaches and GARDENS open to the public).

If you are thinking of the North Shore, think Essex County and a place to stay with access to the Crane Estate, tho their gardens were not restored the last time I went. The major feature is the amazing rolling allee to the sea. Cady, pls correct me if they have done something recently.

Two excellent gardens in Essex County are the Stevens-Coolidge Place in North Andover, also a TTOR property, and Glen Magna in Danvers, owned by the Danvers Historical Society. These two are about a half-hour apart and are must-see Massachusetts gardens.

Ginny, you're right. They don't have much in the way of flower gardens. LOTS of lawn bordered by majestic trees, a sunken loge garden that has shrubs but not many perennials, and the grand entry drive has a nice center garden. But not anything formal to tour through.

On the other hand, that rolling lawn that leads to the sea is breathtaking, and the grounds are meticulously maintained. I think that the non-profit owner, The Trustees of Reservations, doesn't have the budget to retain a full-time gardener to handle perennial and annual beds and gardens. That's a shame (I'd love the job).

I doubt any of you will take me seriously if I admitted to you how few gardens through out New England that I have visited. I am really not the person to be making suggestions for possible locations (random luck with Castle Hill). Here is where I need your help regardless commitment to this gathering I would value your input. Below is a link listing many gardens through out New England I am hoping you would be willing to peruse the list and if one location strikes a cord let us know.

Suggested locations
Castle Hill, Ipswich, MA
Litchfield, CT
Stockbridge, MA

Googling, found link to a forum re: wedding venues posted by a woman who wanted a garden setting in MA. One poster's take: "Castle Hill up on Crane's Beach, but it cost(s) the earth". Similar objection raised for other places, which got me thinking (uh-oh!):

Do we need a place with space for lecture? We'd likely want to do this when gardens are at their best, but, unless we can do mid-week, most places with space-for-rent probably opt to book lucrative wedding/gem-worth anniversary parties.

Can we come to consensus on a lecture topic of mutual interest that also spans our mixed levels of experience? I realize KT said, in essence, "dream big", but I'd rather dream within the realms of budget to begin with, additional options will likely up the costs.

Humbug done, it's a great idea! Suggest from recent experience: last August I was privileged to be invited to "Master Gardeners' Day" at Pleasant View Gardens in Loudon, NH, a wholesale grower. Not generally open to the public (though doubt they'd object to someone touring the ~1 acre display/trial garden out front unless you have a weed-whacker in hand.)

$15 bought breakfast, lunch. 2 hours of presentation re: growing, selection, design followed by small group tours of display gardens led by a knowledgeable PV person. Optional tour of production facilities for those interested. At the end, they turned us loose to choose a flat of 4" potted plants + a hanging basket. Of course, this was August, when they had slim hope of selling their excess to retailers, but generosity was still overwhelming.

So ... consider arranging an insider's look/tour of a commercial facility similar to what Martie organizes for Logees (can't commit due to weather.) Litchfield, CT, is promising with White Flower Farm (been there, great display gardens). That from BF's home in Great Barrington, MA, a few miles south of Stockbridge. Another worthwhile day trip from there was Fred & Marianne McGourty's gardens. Not sure what's happened there since Fred died (bless his soul.)

Along the way, found the link below to gardens open for tour. No details as to dates, hours, but may be a starting point.

"Below is a link listing many gardens through out New England I am hoping you would be willing to peruse the list and if one location strikes a cord"

My dogs name is Cord, and he was grievously offended that someone would strike him, while perusing a list. He has asked iVillage for his own forum to discuss list reading dog strikers.

In the meantime, I will, once again, recommend Saint Gaudens National Historic Site. As mentioned in another post, lots of cool things to do and see related to gardens, history and art. Several B&Bs in the area, not to mention Casa de Cord, open only to non-Cord strikers, of course.

narcnh

Solana (who by the way now has two black check marks next to her name) raised some interesting points. I think in order to meet the needs of such a diverse interesting group (eyes rolling) of gardeners we may need to offer as many different options as possible. In terms of housing have enough different offerings to meet wide range of interest/affordability. In terms of interest and expertise level of lecture/workshop that could be a separate part/cost of the weekend if your interested you go if not your on your own during that block of time. This could hold true for garden tours ect...But I think we are getting ahead of ourselves and might be best to continue to discuss location. Thanks for the link I am sure it will be helpful.
narcnh
"My dogs name is Cord, and he was grievously offended that someone would strike him, while perusing a list. He has asked iVillage for his own forum to discuss list reading dog strikers."
Don't know how you of all people missed it but that forum already exists. GW stated when the forum was launched that the correlation between a group of list reading dog strikers and gardeners was they both grew lucky bamboo. Granted one group used it as a weapon and the other to dazzle their gardening friends but hey the thinnest threads can tie people together.

Suggested locations
Castle Hill, Ipswich, MA
Litchfield, CT
Stockbridge, MA
Saint Gaudens National Historic Site - NH

Maybe we should combine this, somehow, with the aforementioned "Roadtrip to Narcnh's," meeting at St. Gaudens and then converging on Claremont and environs to peruse any and all publicly available gardens.

We will reach an accord, but Cord will not be struck.

St Gaudens is wonderful but there is nothing else public in the immediate area. However, Woodstock VT is not far away and the Marsh-Billings-Rockefeller estate is not to be missed!! It's now owned by the National Park Service. House full of Hudson River Valley school paintings, Ellen Shipman perennial garden, other garden areas, model farm, wilderness, views, etc etc. It is supposed to be the birthplace of the American conservation movement. Find it by Googling Marsh Billings Rockefeller.

When are you envisioning this would take place?

What about Little Rhodie as a location? Is anyone familiar with what they may have to offer us for a gardening weekend? York Rose we havent gotten as far as choosing a date we are still working on a possible location.

Castle Hill, Ipswich, MA
Litchfield, CT
Stockbridge, MA
Saint Gaudens National Historic Site NH & Marsh-Billings-Rockefeller estate Woodstock VT

Yay, L'il Rhody! Home of my alma mater (URI). There are lots of nice garden places in Rhode Island, including, of course, Newport, where some of the historic mansions and their grounds are open to tour groups.

There is also Green Animals, a way cool topiary garden near Newport.

A second black mark? What'd I do now? (she whines). Does Cord have tips re: making a dog house homey? Sounds like I'll be spending lots of time in mine this winter. Meanwhile, the gold stars I'd awarded KT for posting lively threads are beginning to tarnish.

Central to none of us, but we're dreaming? Isles of Shoals. Celia Thaxter, etc. Shoals Marine Laboratory on Appledore offers both day trips and Adult Ed over nights.

Vague thought: volunteer day at a garden one might not otherwise be able to visit? Almost as much fun as cleaning tools.

Maybe we should combine this, somehow, with the aforementioned "Roadtrip to Narcnh's"
Didn't that start as a lesson in design software? Possible lecturer.

St Gaudens is wonderful but there is nothing else public in the immediate area.
Not exactly immediate, but I'll mention again the Fells in Newbury, NH. 'Maps on Us' says 33.7 miles, 50 minutes from Newbury to St Gaudens. A rare instance of "you can get there from here" travelling east-west in NH.

we havent gotten as far as choosing a date we are still working on a possible location
OK, but don't the two go hand-in-hand? e.g., I'd love to take an Alaskan cruise, but not in January.

saving you the trouble,
Ana

Particularly for a first encounter, I'd really prefer to see something more centrally located so very few people have to plan an overnight visit. It just gets a lot more expensive and complicated, and may unnecessarily exclude people. Does UMass have anything?

Besides WFF, I'm having a hard time digging up much in Litchfield. There is an old estate that is in the process of being restored, but I don't know how far they have gotten on the gardens.

The reality is that, having come so far, it's hard not to go the extra mile or two and cross the border into NY. Innisfree in Millbrook is one of the great American gardens, and there is an almost limitless supply of great estates up and down the Hudson. However, that is almost a serious vacation for some people.

Now that you bring it up, MadGal, I thought there must be some historic garden estates in the Housatonic region where NY, Mass. and Conn. meet. Is Innisfree in that area?

Okey Dokey, You all have had such good suggestions that it has forced me to pause for thought. Creating a gathering that will meet many of the needs and interests of a diverse group is challenging but not impossible. Our largest limitation (pointed out to me by my lurking sister) seems to be that our scope has been too narrow why limit our selves to creating one gathering and struggle with trying to find a location that would meet the needs of the masses. Rather I would propose we continue until after the weekend to suggest possible locations then work on planning a gatherings best suited to that location ie they have a wonderful summer garden tour, spring bulb display, fall foliage, ect. This would address the cost factor/travel factor as there is bound to be a gathering in your neck of the woods. The design of each gathering should be as unique and diverse as we are. Some suggestions have been volunteering, academic, garden design focused, lets try and design different opportunities to gather and put our creations out to the masses on the NE forum and see if we get any sparks of interest. So please let me know your thoughts but I would ask that you dont just tell me why something wont work please offer a suggestion of what you think would work as well. kt

Castle Hill, Ipswich, MA
Litchfield, CT - NY. Innisfree in Millbrook
Stockbridge, MA
Saint Gaudens National Historic Site NH & Marsh-Billings-Rockefeller estate Woodstock VT - Fells in Newbury
Newport & Green Animals
Isles of Shoals. Celia Thaxter, etc.
**Note I am not kidding about not being well travelled in New England so if my cutting and pasting has missed your suggestion or I have misinterpreted your intent speak up...I am slow but eventually I am bound to get this right.

Solana Thank you for saving me the trouble

Cady, I can't think of anything on the Housatonic, at least not in Litchfield Co. Historically it was a mill river, and now a lot of it is used for canoeing. Between the Taconics, the Berkshires, and the Litchfield hills, it's a very hilly area, and even now one of our biggest problems around there is 'you can't get there from here'. Some of the routes I've taken to the Connecticut plant swap are very much a function of really good maps and 4-wheel drive. Millbrook is west of the Taconics

Some larger nurseries regularly sponsor garden-related talks by visiting luminaries. Their fees are usually reasonable and sometimes include lunch. I don't know how far in advance they book their guest speakers, but this may be a way to tie a nursery visit together with a lecture and tours of nearby attractions.

Mad Gall should Innisfree be part of a Litchfield gathering or are they too distant from one another?

Saypoint,
Great suggestion I know arbo_retum often raves about Tranquil Lakes in Rehobeth. Is there anything else of interest in that area?

In the Sooner is Better category, what about coordinating a trip to one of these events:

NE Grows (Gordon Hayward is doing 2 talks on Tues, Feb 6)

or one of the NEWFS lectures at (http://www.newfs.org/courses/)

or Hort Mag/ Ma Hort symposium, Harmonious Planting Design: for people who love to live in their gardens, February 11 at Elm Bank.

We could add a trip to the Lyman Estate greenhouses to see their winter camellia display - not sure when that is at its peak.

I've deliberately NOT read the foregoing.

Here's what I'd look for:
1.) Must be an 8 hr. day for me; or set up so I may attend one day (start to finish). I take care of my elderly mother and can't be away overnight. I can arrange for 7-8 hrs. of care, but can't afford overnight duty.
2.) I love gardens and I love ARCHITECTURE. But more than gardens IN BLOOM, I'm interested in the "bones". How have they laid out the beds, what hardscaping have they used to create "interest" in the "off" seasons? An "off season" get-together would be equally interesting as one in "season", if I had the priviledge of discussing it with you guys!

OK, now you know what my "wish list" includes... I'll go back and see what incredibly fun things you've all listed...

:)

Location details?

dtd- Sooner is Better is appealing. Where are the venues you suggest? Access if winter storms? Ties in with Chelone's request for something do-able in a day.

btw, difficulties doing anything requiring Log In to GW the past few days, can't view your member page, Chelone, to get an idea of where in NE you are.

As KT suggests, we don't have to plan just one get-together. I, too, am very interested in an exploration of bones.

Additional thoughts:
Areas with only 1 or 2 attractions nearby: plan an overnight within an hour, continue on the following day. Those who can't spare more than a day or the overnight $ could choose whichever day is more interesting/convenient.

Might we make use of our personal knowledge of private gardens? dtd's mention of Gordon Hayward brought this to mind: he's a local boy. I don't know him personally, but did attend a presentation he gave at our Town Hall several years ago. Got me thinking about some lovely gardens I've visited socially.

Had side emails re: my 12 Nov post about Pleasant View Gardens in Loudon, NH. Wrote PVG about possibility of our group joining MG day I'd described or snagging one of their friendly horticulturalists for a small group tour. Received the following reply:

... Please remember, even if we do not schedule these events \- your group is always welcome to tour the garden on their own \- It is open during the summer \- Please call ahead to confirm the date you would like to see the garden...

This, too, do-able same day as the Fells in Newbury, NH.

My local input. Yours?

New England Grows is a good venue, and even though it is designed for the professionals in the green industry, there is plenty to interest home gardeners.

One caveat about the lectures and "seminars" though. I've been going for years and have found the talks to be somewhat "lite" and often not really well prepared. Often, they are slideshows that seemed to have been thrown together and the presenter hadn't seemed to have prepared a real talk of any substance. This, from some "big names" in the garden field, and many of them popular writers!

Maybe when it comes to tradeshows, they don't feel it's as necessary to provide substance as for a libary talk or whatever. Some presentations I've gone to have been pretty good, too. So, it is kind of a gamble.

Guess I'm saying that if you want to include NEG, I wouldn't do it with the idea that we're going to focus on a specific speaker.

Chelone,
Maybe Asticou (the azaleas) would be a good Maine trek for us, that would be a daytrip for you. Or Appledore Island (I think someone mentioned it) on the New Hampshire seacoast. The photos I've seen of the gardens on the isles have been amazing.

KT, I am a big proponent for efficiency/maximizing our time and I personally think that the best way to go about this idea would be to look at KNOWN EXISTING activities (known if you research them, that is) and build a weekend around them.
With that in mind, the core activities that I have found particularly rewarding in recent years have been:

The Tranquil Lake Nursery Open House in July. just outside of Prov., on the Mass/r.i. border,the free day always has excellent lectures, vendor booths, and one of the best gardens anywhere in new eng. Within an hour of there are special nurseries- Avant Gardens in So.Dartmouth,Alan Haskell in new Bedford,Katsura Gardens in Plymouth, amongst others.

The Garden Conservancy has Open Days gardens open for tour in many regions of new eng., with a number of very special gardens in the central ct. region. I visited some very special gardens with various GW people last June. We could very easily do a WEEK of Ct. nurseries and Open Days gardens, so a wkend is just a matter of careful choosing. There is a very active/connected group of Ct.GW people.(ah hah- is that why it's called Connect icut?!!! ooh, pun ishment)
(BTW, fred mcgourty's Hillside Gardens is not a possibility; this property is being sold.)

Joe Eck and Wayne Winterowd's nationally famous garden in Reedsville,VT. is open once or twice in the summer. They also manage a yearly one day garden symposium with nationally famous speakers around mid june. In addition in vt. there are at least 2 nurseries with superb display gardens- RockyDale in Bristol and Cady's Falls in Morrisville.

for the winter (but YOU will be in new zealand, poor you!)
i think nan's suggestion of the mass hort symposium is a good one. usually very worthwhile.and dan hinkley's talk at the BPL is Feb 11 I think.

So, for my interests, I would vote for the Ct.locus as the biggest bang for your buck.I really think that for superb nurseries and private gardens, Ct. has no match in new eng.
If a lecture is an important component, I'm sure we could arrange a specially interesting presentation by one or 2 of the great nurserymen down there.Uconn and Olivers nursery also both have symposia that might be incorporated.

Mindy posts some great ideas (and a Connecticut pun). lol

Some of us went to Allan Haskell's and Avent Gardens a few years ago, in fact, the spring before Allan Haskell passed away. We oohed and aahed over the grounds and lovely plants, and saw "the man" himself scooting around the place in his golf cart. We visited a popular historic house and garden and ate our lunches there, in between nursery stops. It was a well spent day.

A roadtrip to Vermont sounds great, too. I've seen ads for some of the nurseries there, and they seem worth a visit. And of course, I'd be all for a stop at Cady's Falls. :)

Cady

Mapquest is giving an hour from Litchfield to Millbrook, by a perfectly reasonable route.

Does anybody know where Garden in the Woods means by 'west mass'? I like the idea of piggybacking on something existing, but have serious doubts about driving the whole way to Boston. I know from the Conn. plant swap that several of us have relatively young children, and anything involving an overnight gets difficult.

MadGallica,

Garden in the Woods is in Natick or Framingham (the towns are right next to each other, and I forget which the garden is in. It might lie on both sides.) is just off Rte. 20, which you can pick up in Central Mass. from I-90.

My guess is that you'd be driving 3 hours each way, so it might not be a practical destination if you don't want to do an overnight.

Cady, if you follow the link to Garden in the Woods courses that Digginginthedirt gave, they list several different locations. However the page that gives the exact location of the locations is still under construction. I'm assuming that what they are calling 'east mass' is their location in Framingham. I was wondering is anybody here knew enough about their inner workings to provide a good guess as to where 'west mass' might be.

Nasami Farm--their (New England Wildflower Society, which owns Garden in the Woods) new nursery for native plants. It's in Whately MA. It is open for tours and SALES at various times. Weekends in season and by appointment, I think.

Castle Hill, Ipswich, MA

Litchfield, CT - NY. Innisfree in Millbrook

Stockbridge, MA - Nasami Farm

Saint Gaudens National Historic Site NH & Marsh-Billings-Rockefeller estate

Woodstock VT - Fells in Newbury - Pleasant View Gardens in Loudon, NH.

Newport & Green Animals The Tranquil Lake Nursery Open House in July. just outside of Prov., on the Mass/r.i. border,the free day always has excellent lectures, vendor booths, and one of the best gardens anywhere in new eng. Within an hour of there are special nurseries- Avant Gardens in So.Dartmouth,Alan Haskell in new Bedford,Katsura Gardens in Plymouth, amongst others

The Garden Conservancy has Open Days gardens open for tour in many regions of new eng., with a number of very special gardens in the central ct. region. I visited some very special gardens with various GW people last June. We could very easily do a WEEK of Ct. nurseries and Open Days gardens, so a wkend is just a matter of careful choosing. There is a very active/connected group of Ct.GW people.(ah hah- is that why it's called Connect icut?!!! ooh, pun ishment)

Joe Eck and Wayne Winterowd's nationally famous garden in Reedsville,VT. is open once or twice in the summer. They also manage a yearly one day garden symposium with nationally famous speakers around mid june. In addition in vt. there are at least 2 nurseries with superb display gardens- RockyDale in Bristol and Cady's Falls in Morrisville.

Isles of Shoals. Celia Thaxter, etc. Appledore Island

NE Grows (Gordon Hayward is doing 2 talks on Tues, Feb 6)

NEWFS lectures at (http://www.newfs.org/courses/)

Hort Mag/ Ma Hort symposium, Harmonious Planting Design: for people who love to live in their gardens, February 11 at Elm Bank
I think nan's suggestion of the mass hort symposium is a good one. usually very worthwhile.and dan hinkley's talk at the BPL is Feb 11 I think.

Lyman Estate greenhouses to see their winter camellia display.

Asticou (the azaleas)

If I have totally missed or misrepresented your intent please just fix by copy/paste existing list but highlight the changes with asterisk and accept my apologies.

Alllllrighty,
I think we are moving into more clearly defined territory. Sincerely I am proud and amazed at how far we have come in a short time without abandonment of our goal. Creating a gathering that will meet many of the needs and interests of our geographically diverse group is challenging but not impossible. Chelone presented a good example she is only free for a period of 7-8 hours, has specific interests and lives somewhere in Maine. A trip designed to meet her needs certainly increase the needs of others coming from much further away but if we designed a trip within two hours of wherever Chelone lives that included diverse late/next day activities for those staying over then Chelones needs are met as well as the needs of those traveling greater distances. I would assume that there will be as many day/overnight trips as there are interested NE GWers. Arbo_retum suggested a Tranquil lakes day that could easily be part of a New Bedford (Alan Haskells) to Newport weekend that would be very fulfilling for those traveling from afar and could meet the day trip needs of a few that might be interested. So my suggestion would be keep the vision big, plan for those coming from the furthest distances with as many activities in that area at that time. Nans Hort lecture date could piggy back with arbos dan hinkley lecture with the awareness that some would go to one or the other and some would stay for both those staying for both would want added next day suggested activities as well as common places to stay overnight, dine ect. In brief what is one New Englanders day trip is anothers weekend get away. I will be taking a hiatus from GW for the next week but please keep brainstorming about locations/interestsI am amazed at how far we have come. kt

Solana you now have four no five gold stars.

Stumbled on this elsewhere and thought this would be a valuable tool in our planning.

"About eight months ago, Mapmuse.com began a project -- the interactive mapping of garden centers and nurseries across the country. They initially researched and populated these maps ourselves, with the idea in mind that the public would subsequently add to, and enhance, the information provided. They mapped each garden center or nursery, and provided space for a written description, photo, and link to a web site.

Since this project was launched, gardening enthusiasts have made 100s of additions and enhancements to our maps. If you know of any garden centers or nurseries in your local community that are new or have closed in the last six months, please make those changes to the maps. Also, please feel free to add any places that are still missing.

They also have a searchable map and listing of local public gardens and arborerta to visit that gives a good basic listing for our region."

The site even has the ability to bring up a map showing the actual location.

Have been reading along and of course would love to "do" something accessible to everyone. Budget is a huge issue for many of us (do we spend it on travel or plants?) but getting together for a day sounds great!

It doesn't matter to me at this point what we do -- it all sounds good, but I'll throw in this idea: The Boston Flower Show. Even if Mad Gal had to make the drive across Mass, it could be done in a day. I think everyone else is close enough that it could be doable. Of course, there are enough different lectures, symposiums, displays and businesses to have something for everyone. The "T" makes getting into the city relatively easy no matter which direction you come from.

Yes, it may seem too commonplace, but it sure meets everyone's needs. (Not to mention that the food in Boston is great, and what is a good gardening get-together without food???)

Martie

Mapmuse has pop-ups, which are very annoying. I would have forgiven them for that and added my favorite nursery to their list anyway, but it does not have a web site. Too bad.

Dan Hinklwy's free talk at the Boston Public Library (titled The Asian Connection) has been rescheduled for April, 11. See
http://www.mountauburn.org/visit_participate/anniversary.cfm

This looks good, but may be too expensive for some members:
East Meets Northeast: Choice Plants for Landscape Design
With Dan Hinkley and Bill Cullina, Garden in the Woods (Framingham)
Wednesday, January 14, 9:30 a.m.4 p.m.
Fee: $150M/$175NM includes lunch

Nan - 150 Million - gosh, that IS expensive

Hey,
I didn't want all of our work to fall too far off the radar. A few days ago after working on breaking up our suggested locations into possible dates I lost my file. I promise to rewrite it all very soon but in the mean time I thought I would suggest to you what my over all thoughts are. What my dream would be is now that we have some destinations and have agreed that "One New Englanders Day Trip Is Another New Englanders Long Weekend", that we use our trip planning as a template for up coming months and years. So by example people will know WHERE to post an up coming event (the calendar forum (link on right side of NE Forum page) is either corrupted or not managed by GW...so sad). Well I need to get back to work let me know what you think. kt

kt- agree we shouldn't let our input above fade. Propose a separate calendar for events (you have email), perhaps a new, 'get-together coming together' thread. I find long threads difficult.

Ana, who loves summaries.

Since it looks like we will be getting winter after all, I think we should plan a trip to New Zealand, or maybe southern Italy. My bags are packed, I'm just wondering who else wants to go.

How about this: Sicily, March 7-17, 2007 with Nan Sinton. These trips are wildly expensive, but ... what fun!

Nan,
Joe had to cut short our trip to NZ so we will be returning 3/4 which would leave me enough time to do a load of laundry before heading off to Sicily is there on line info about the trip? You are of course welcome to join us in NZ we will be getting around in a travel van alternating camping in remote areas with hotels. Our goal is to immerse ourselves in the people/way of life rather than more tourist focused events. kt

Sorry about that, Katy, the link is below. On the actual Sicily tour page, the dates are wrong; apparently this is a repeat of a tour they did in November.

I'd really love to go somewhere warm in February ...

would like to know if this ever happened, and if anyone does get togethers in NE now, or plant swaps...