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pearlchow

Rate these DIY jobs on 1-5 scale

pearlchow
17 years ago

Hi all,

We are remodeling and acting as our own GCs. So far, we have subbed out all the work (foundation, framing, roofing, plumbing, electrical, HVAC), but last weekend, my husband and I ended up installing the bathroom fans ourselves because I didn't want to deal with a change order (forgot to add it to the HVAC guy's job). We got a big sense of satifaction (granted it's an itty bitty thing), but nevertheless, we're all gung-ho about tackling another job.

Before we get in over our heads, we would love to hear from the experts about what types of "jobs" are DIY manageable and which should be left to the pros.

Here's what we're thinking:

Jobs we are not interested in DIYing:

- drywall

- stucco/siding

- stone countertops

- priming all drywall; painting the ceiling

Jobs we are considering:

- Adding blocking

- Insulation

- Installing interior doors (incl pocket doors)

- Trimming doors and windows

- Cabinetry/built-ins installation

- Tiling floors (not sure about the walls)

- Adding beadboard/paneling

- Installing click and lock floating wood flooring

- Painting walls (after contractor has primed)

Which jobs do you think are easiest, a good DIY project? Hardest, no way, sub it out?

I don't think there's any way we can do all the jobs on our "maybe" list, so we need to be smart about picking and choosing two or three that would make the most difference to our bottom line. Also, if there are some jobs that can be done after final inspection, we could wait on those and do them later after moving in.

Thanks for any advice you can give!!!

Comments (15)

  • User
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    - Adding blocking--can do if you know where the blocking goes---quicker with an air nailer, difficult with a hammer.

    - Insulation---long sleeved shirts and dust masks.

    - Installing interior doors (incl pocket doors)--let the pro's do it---you can, with a book and time and tools---air nailers, long level.

    - Trimming doors and windows--need power miter saw and nailers---or hand miter box, hammer and lots of elbow grease and time.

    - Cabinetry/built-ins installation--No way---pro job.

    - Tiling floors (not sure about the walls)---get a book, install backer board first, rent/buy tile saw.

    - Adding beadboard/paneling--get book---table saw or circular saw/with guide system, nailer.

    - Installing click and lock floating wood flooring--power miter saw and have fun.

    - Painting walls (after contractor has primed)---technique is critical to get smooth finish with no roller/lapover marks.

  • pearlchow
    Original Author
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Thanks for the speedy response Handymac!
    Thanks for also including the key tools needed. I was going to post that question as a follow-up but you beat me to the punch! Hey if you have specific brand/model suggestions for an air nailer, power miter saw and tile saw, I'm all ears.
    I'm also really surprised to hear you put cabinet installation so firmly in the pro camp. Can you elaborate on what makes it is so difficult for a DIYer?

  • kec01
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    - Adding blocking - never done this.
    - Insulation -very easy except your necks will get sore doing ceilings. Use utility knife to cut when needed and change blade kind of often.
    - Installing interior doors (incl pocket doors) - let the pros do this. It can be a pain to shim the doors to get them plumb in all directions.
    - Trimming doors and windows - if you aren't familiar with cutting trim, mitre cuts can end up with alot of wasted wood. I'd leave this to the pros.
    - Cabinetry/built-ins installation - what's tough with this is lifting and holding the upper cabinets during install. If you do it, nail strip of wood on a line where bottom of upper cabinets will be, lift cabinets and rest them on the wood, then screw in. Do uppers before lowers since you won't have to bend over the lowers to install the uppers.
    - Tiling floors (not sure about the walls) - easy but MUST have tile cutter. It helps if you are particular/picky to get lines straight etc.
    - Adding beadboard/paneling - never done this.
    - Installing click and lock floating wood flooring - easy
    - Painting walls (after contractor has primed) - I love to paint so I think this is easy but there are tips. Do ceiling first, then trim, then walls. Don't think you're going to save money by buying cheap paint. Quality paint is very much worth the money. Colors can be matched between paint companies - ie you look the Sherwin Williams red but you want it by Benj. Moore - take the SW sample to the BM stoore and they'll match it.

    All the tools mentioned make these jobs possible to DIY. We use DeWalt mitre saw, we got a tile saw from HD - higher price. We don't have an air nailer but use our DeWalt drill as a screwdriver.

    Have fun. You'll find great satisfaction in the jobs that you do yourself.

  • User
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    There are a couple of deals for air nailers/compressors on the market---Porter Cable has one with two nailers---a 16 gauge and a 18 gauge---and the compressor for one price. I have all of those tools---bought 5 or more years ago and used extensilely with no problems at all. Stanley Bostich also has deals and is a good brand. Felker is the best know tile saw maker---but depending on the proposed jobs, even an $80 cheapie can work. My son/DIL and I just did 16" tile in four rooms with one of those saws. It was a pain to use versus the big Felker I usually use, but it did the job. Power miter saws are another large field. He has a 10" Delta model---cost him $99 that works fine for base molding and 3" crown. I have a 12" DeWalt single tilt model---bought 7 years ago---for $300. There are also sliding miter saws in 10" and 12" models---starting around $500 and up. The newest models are double tilt---$400 or so. That makes cutting opposite angles more simple---with the single tilt model crown has to be cut upsidedown and backwards for one angle and right side up and normal for the opposite angle. That gets confusing. Makita, Bosch, and Milwaukee also make good miter saws.

    Actually, the placement of cabinets in the pro camp is due to time and hassle concerns more than difficulty.

    The actual job takes two people, a 5' or longer level, cabinet mounting screws, a stud finder, shims, cabinet clamps, a countersinking drill bit, and several other tools to do properly. The procedure is specific---finding the highest point in the floor area and setting the cabinets to a level line set from that high point----in order to get a level top in order to be able to install the countertop.

    The good news is that home improvement stores usually have books that show how to do all of the things you listed---and most of those books include the important information and a tool list. That way you can read how the job is done and decide if you want to tackle it before attempting one.

  • robin5mi
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I'm surprised you put priming and painting in the pro camp - I think you can do this reasonably well yourself, especially if you consider buying an airless paint sprayer, which are pretty cheap (I think the rest depends on your previous experience or general handiness. Sure, you can do built-ins and doors, it just takes a long long time, and you have to be very careful. It's very difficult to remedy if you screw it up. But if you're adventurous, go for it. You'll save a lot of money (provided you don't destroy the materials).

    Whatever you do, make sure you have great tools. If you're only going to do this once, just buy great tools and sell them on Craigslist later, they retain their value pretty well. HarborFreight also has cheap/decent tools I can recommend, like tile saws etc.

  • jperiod
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Well, I can only say for things I've done. And having the proper tools makes a world of difference. I used to hold out for good name brand tools and make do with the ones I had until I discovered Habor Freight Tools. Heck, for $10, I don't care if the angle grinder only lasts me one job! Or the $14 hammer drill! Or the $20 reciprocating saw! LOL But really, they're running just fine along my delta and makita tools.

    Beadboard/paneling -- easy
    floating floor -- easy
    painting -- easy (see link to article below for great tips), but I hate painting all the trim since you have to do it by hand. Takes a long time so you have to weigh your time vs. money.
    tiling -- easy, but very tedious and time consuming. I just finished my first set of jobs -- tiling two bathrooms and a laundry room, about 200 sf. I have vowed to never tile again! It took way too long and I think it would've been worth it to pay for installation. Having a really good tile saw makes a big difference. I just got a cheap one, but it did the job (messy though). I was looking into a tile jigsaw as well. So I think it depends on what you're tiling (many cuts vs. few and/or straight cuts) and get BIG tiles!! Means less work!
    Interior doors -- working on this now, but just the sliding closet doors so far. Not horrible, but not fun either. Not as bad as tile though! I'm just using the old doors as templates, so I don't think it would be as bad as installing a complete new one.
    Door/Window trim -- measure twice, cut once! Doable, but you have to be a perfectionist and houses that are out of square can be maddening. I love love LOVE my nail gun though and always looking for an excuse to use it!

    Here is a link that might be useful: pro paint tips

  • pearlchow
    Original Author
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Thanks for your continuing responses. I really enjoy reading about the jobs you have all tackled.
    Juliebatt, did your tiling work include a lot of wainscot? I'm thinking maybe the floors would be a lot easier and I would leave the walls to a pro :-). Tiling is just one of those jobs that I would like to have at least tried once!
    So far, we've installed our bathroom fans, demo'd trim and baseboards, installed weatherproofing membrane and flashing on the lower part of our exterior plywood sheathing. I've loved doing all of it and am constantly thinking about what our next project could be.

  • where_am_i
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I would consider myself to be fairly handy and have done all of the tasks you have listed during the remodel of my main floor this past spring and summer. I am willing to tackle just about anything. Not just to save money, but also because I enjoy it. At least to a point that is.

    Things you may want to hire out-
    Having never installed doors before, I would say I thought that was tough. After the 4th door I was getting pretty good at it though. The same goes for trim. It took many extra feet of trim due to bad joints or wrong cuts. Molding and casing are what people see so it should look good. Although if you are painting it, you have a huge fudge factor because you can patch it with caulk. These are 2 things that a good finish carpenter could do in no time and have it look good in the end.

    Things you should reconsider-
    With all that you have listed, it sounds like you have a blank canvas to work with. What a perfect time to paint and not worry about it getting on everything. If you're putting down flooring and trim work there's no need to be careful painting. Get a couple quality brushes to do the cutting in and roll on the rest. The other thing you could do is hang your drywall. It's not too bad of a job. Definetly hire out the taping/mudding/sanding once again for the best possible finished look on your walls. I've seen good mudders patch up really bad DIY drywall jobs.

    Things to do yourselves-
    Insulation. Get the precut batts and go to town. Get a knife with a long blade. If you have a lot, consider an air stapler.
    Tile. If you are using a man made stone/ceramic that is all the same thickness, better yet. The hardest part to tiling is the subfloor. Secure it very well and tape all the seams per the manufacturer. If you live near a tile shop they may have DIY workshops you can attend.
    Flooring. Very straight forward for the most part. I would say the only thing is it depends on is how many things you have to fit the flooring around. Islands, many doorways, etc. The more of those makes for more detailed cuts. Same goes for the paneling.

    If the cabinetry is already made to fit the space and just needs to be installed, I would try it. Worst that could happen is you will have to take it down and have the carpenter put it in.

    You may also want to consider specialty tools that others have mentioned. For instance, renting an air nailing rig will run you over $100 for a weekend. For around another $200 ($300 total) you could buy it and not have to worry about getting it back in time. Almost all of your projects have a need of something special. If you're new to this and haven't started your tool collection, this may be something to consider. See if your area has a used tool store. Sometimes you can find high end tools for a good price and the usually have a warranty. Spend money where it counts, like on a miter saw you know you will be using a lot for flooring, molding, casing.

    Now, my problem is that I have discovered my time can be better spent than cursing at a door that won't hang right, or trying to figure out how to cut a compound miter for the crown molding.

  • jperiod
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Pchow, I didn't do any tiling on the walls, just the floors. But I had to cut around doors, tub, shower, toilet, toilet flange, and the closet in the laundry room. If I were doing a big square room, I might have felt differently. Laying out the tiles and prepping was the hardest and most time-consuming. The wainscotting I've done is beadboard. As long as you make your level line first, it's cake. I really don't think tiling a wall could be much different than the floor.

    Like "where i am" said, if you're doing white trim and paneling, caulking covers a multitude of sins (and out of square houses!).

    If you're enjoying yourself, then go for it!! That makes a big difference. I'm always willing to try anything once. But I don't really like doing this stuff (since I'm balancing family and housework, and up againt time constraints). If I could do it at my leisure, I might feel differently though.

  • rdtompki
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    - Adding blocking - easy to do. Power miter saw really helps keep the blocking square. For block where I can nail or screw from an adjacent stud space I drill for screws at a 45 deg. angle top and bottom.

    - Insulation - easy. buy one of the aluminum 4' low platforms since this makes doing anything on the ceiling much easier. I don't like the small step stools since if you turn around when you're on top you can step off where there is no step. I've had some bad wrecks.

    - Installing interior doors (incl pocket doors) - hard to do well. This seems like it should be easy, but as someone has already mentioned getting everything square in all dimensions can be tricky. A long level is an essential.

    - Trimming doors and windows - medium. Takes practice to get the miters exactly. A brad air nailer and power miter saw are necessities. Be prepared to generate some scrap.

    - Cabinetry/built-ins installation - Hard to do well. Floors and ceilings aren't flat. Long level, helper(s). For upper cabinets a few 2x4's of proper length can prop up the cabinets while you're sorting things out.

    - Tiling floors (not sure about the walls) - easy to medium? I haven't done much tiling, but if the floor is level and you measure twice/cut once I would think a DIY'er could do a good job. Go to www.johnbridge.com for advice.

    - Adding beadboard/paneling - ????

    - Installing click and lock floating wood flooring - easy if it's a single room, more challenging if you have to plan for a large area that had multiple parallel walls that you are clocking and locking around. Floor must be flat which can be a problem with a slab. Some systems are much easier than others.

    - Painting walls (after contractor has primed) Easy

    - Plumbing a bathroom - medium, but lots of savings to be had. If you're on a slab like I am plan an taking the ceiling down when remodeling even if your plan just had the walls coming down. You will save many, many hours by not having to work in the attic.

    - Electrical (kitchen/bath) - medium. Takes planning, but as with plumbing you can save a great deal of money. There are lots of good books. My experience with both plumbing and electrical is that you can do a near pro quality job, but you're working at 1/5 pro speed. Still, the pay ain't bad.

  • pearlchow
    Original Author
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Juliebatt and where_am_I,
    One of the reasons I'm game to try trimming the doors and windows is, YES!, we are painting the trim, plus we are doing the butt joint casing style, so no mitered corners.
    However, I'm leaving the actual door/window installation to a pro!
    A couple of the floor tiling jobs will be simple rectangular rooms with no to minimal cutouts (a wall-mounted toilet!). So I think we'll give that a go.
    Finally, we do have a lot of wood flooring, with a bit of fitting around an island, cabinets, doorways, but I think we're also going to tackle that.
    Thanks for all your advice and support!

  • homebound
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    In general I agree with everyone else. But I have seen all those DIY jobs botched significantly by DIY'ers.

    Actual hands on experience is needed to know what not to do - books are great but kind of meaningless til you've seen it, better yet helped do it, at least once firsthand.

    I just saw a DIY basement tile floor job where the homemowners had simply smoothed the thinset in the grout lines. I was there to quote some other work and they asked me what they where suppposed to do with teh several bags of grout they bought with the tile. Tile was plenty crooked, too, despite their claim that they layed out guide lines.

    Another owner wanted to be my helper for a full bath remodel (never again!). With just a couple pieces of bullnose trim tile to go (since he under-ordered the tile against my recommendation), he decided to set those last few tiles himself while I was out of town. Ugh! Result? Out of plane with the others, etc, etc. and he then wanted to leave them alone since he did it. He also reinstalled the door trim, and I was embarrassed to see the gap he left between the casing and the wall (it was a 100 yr old door, and he damaged the casing, so he decided to buy another only to find that large dimension was no longer stock - result: 1" gap around door. Of course there are solutions to all this, but he didn't know.

    Another family did their own click-and-lock floor, and didn't know how to actually deal with door jambs (even though they read what to do) - looked like heck to me (but they were happy enough with it since they did it. And their new baseboards had terrible joinery, especially the outside corners.

    It's unfortunate, but DIY finish work can make a good job look bad very quickly.

    Oh, on a painting not, what's with all these homeowners wanting to paint stripes on their walls these days? That masking tape can wreak havoc on new walls, no matter how properly they are prepared. Resist the urge! Don't do it, DIY people!!

  • jperiod
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Homebound, those are scary stories!! LOL I'm totally a DIYer, but I read, read, read and have watched a ton of home shows over the years before attempting something myself! And even when I get myself in a pickle, I have a good professional friend to call upon, thank goodness!

    Pchow, the butt joints sound easier then, so go for it! I did pergo throughout my kitchen and down the hallway (and later in the family room). As the others said, manuevering multiple rooms can be tricky, so prepping/laying out is essential. Make sure you think about what you're going to do at certain points before you get there -- door jambs, thresholds, stairs, appliances, etc. I had to undercut 7 doorways!! What a miserable job! LOL But I'd still do it over tile in a heartbeat! ;+)

  • lenl
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Wow. Sounds like a lot of anger here. Evey project has problems. Try what you like. Some things that seem easy are not. Remember when you learned to drive? It took concentration. Apply that experience to what you try, knowing your first left turn will not be your best. Talk to professionals, friends, go to the big boxes classes, (they hate me, I bring up issues) try what you THINK you can do, and do your research, FIRST! I just got sprayed with effluence, because I forgot to unplug. But, it was just a clog. I saved about $800 calling someone. Shower and bleach, all fixed. Good luck.
    Len

  • pearlchow
    Original Author
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Thought I would post an update on the things we've tackled.

    1. Did the blocking. Very easy, especially since we knew where it was needed and didn't have to spend the time communicating it to a sub. Didn't matter what it looked like since it's all hidden in the walls.

    2. Installed Johnson pocket doors (comes in a kit). This was a bit of a challenge, but if you follow the directions carefully, it is definitely doable. The hardest part for us was having to drill holes into the concrete subfloor in order to secure the pocket door framing.

    3. Trimmed all of the doors (the window installer had included trimming the windows in his contract). Since we were doing a Craftsman style butt-joint, it was fairly easy. The most annoying part was having to scrape down, sometimes remove some of the drywally in order to get the casing to lie flat/flush to the wall. We bought a compound miter saw which made cutting the trim a piece of cake, of should I say like a stick of butter! Also had a cordless nail gun; wow, what a great tool!

    4. Installed all the beadboard paneling and wainscot. A little trickier than #3, because you have to scribe the edges to account for out of plumb walls. Also, gotta transfer locations of switch boxes, outlets and cut out holes in the paneling for them.

    5. Installed upstairs baseboard. Again having the miter saw, plus the nail gun helps immensely. We had a simple 5 1/2" tall flat baseboard with one eased edge on top. We mitered the corners. We did need to fiddle around with shimming out some of the corners so everything would line up perfectly. And there was definitely a learning curve with cutting the baseboard using the correct 45 degree direction.

    We still plan on installing the click and float engineered hardwood floors and we'll do the baseboard downstairs too. I think we're going to also end up doing the cabinet pulls/knobs, pantry shelving, closet shelves/rods.

    We ended up passing on the insulation, interior doors (other than pocket doors), tiling, cabinetry installation and painting.

    Other things we learned: everything takes twice as long as you expect. Caulk hides a lot of sins. Sometimes power tools make the job too easy; it's so easy to fire off a half dozen nails before you've realized "oh, oh, that wasn't the right thing to do!" Oh and did I mention everything takes a lot longer than you initially planned?

    Still, on the whole, we enjoyed our projects. We got a lot of satisfaction and we learned a ton!