Yep. But most people are fine with the 120 and it sounds like you will be too. The 170's cost a lot more, which is why I don't have them on the doors that open against a wall--I don't care if they don't match the other side. 'Cause they're also a lot bigger. And I don't like big honkin' hinges inside my cabinets. In fact, I prefer framed cabinets. But for this kitchen design I decided that frameless, slab looked best. So then I had to have the big, honkin' expensive hinges so they wouldn't make me nuts. But that's me. YRMV.

You might want the wider hinges if you have pullout shelves. That gets the doors more out of your way. Also, if there's somewhere you'll be regularly putting in something really wide, or if there are big doors in a narrow passage. Oh, and if you have a corner door. Otherwise, you don't need 'em unless you're crazy, like me. And it sounds like you won't really miss them.

It's mainly a safety issue. Somebody leaves the door open. Somebody is not looking where they are going. The 170 will swing out of the way. The 120 will probably be OK for most doors, but if you have a really wide door, somebody might bang their head or shins.

170's for any overhead cabs in the vicinity of the dishwasher. I have old school hinges on framed cabs right now & even with that, occasionally, if I don't open the doors wide enough, I conk my head on a door when I unload the DW.

I've always had framed cabinets and hinges that allow you to open the door so it's not left sticking straight out. Long before my new kitchen I bought some home office furniture - first experience with the european type hinges - they are 90 degree opening. That just drove me nuts - maybe because my house isn't enormous and having doors that can't be opened far enough to get out of the way just doesn't work. Experiencing that significantly influenced cabinet choice for my kitchen when I remodeled - since I wanted cabinets that would open farther and also didn't care for the bulky hinges. That may also have something to do with the fact we're comfortable with narrower aisles in our kitchen - because open cabinet doors don't protrude into the limited space.

If I were you I'd try to mock up the situation and see how tolerant you are of doors that won't open past 120 degrees.

Thanks. That all makes sense. I didn't think about the safety aspect. The layout is essentially the same as what I have (other than more drawer bases) but the doors will be full overlay so they will stick out more. And I forgot about the corner cabinet door. It's probably a good idea to use 170 for the sink base since you sometimes have to climb in there at weird angles for plumbing work plus I might put a pullout there. And the wall cabinet by the dishwasher is a good idea since you're going back and forth loading dishes (although I'm contemplating putting them in a drawer).

Pllog: how much larger are the 170s?

I'm one of the weird people who doesn't want the DW right at the dishes because I don't want to fight with the DW door and cabinet doors no matter how well designed the openings are. :) Re the sink, Euro cabinet hinges have an easy release, so for something rare, like plumbing, it's easy to take the doors all the way off, thus also preventing damage.

My hinges are 3.25" long and 2" high. The normal ones are .75" sticking out, and the 170 degree ones stick out a whole 2" at the widest. I hate that. But I hate the doors that don't open all the way more. I took some pictures but can't upload them from this computer. If you want to see them let me know and I'll put them up.

Okay. I have pics now. :) These are Blum. The soft closer isn't in, and they're not adjusted yet. They're redoing some of the doors, so here's a picture of the 170 degree hinge closed, with the part that attaches to the door on it. Then one partly extended and fully extended. The last picture is one of the normal hinges.

plllog: thanks for the pics. That's good to know about the doors coming off easily if needed- although it makes my decision harder again!

I noticed 2 items in that first picture that I've had questions about.

First. I was wondering about pullouts and door hinges. It looks like that pullout has a tapered side. I assume it goes higher in the back so stuff doesn't fall off there, which is probably a good idea. However it looks like the pullout height at the front would fit below the door hinge. If the pullout sides didn't go up in the back, could you make the pullout wider and have it fit under the door hinge?

Second, is that piece that sticks out past the cabinet side on the left an end panel? I've been trying to figure out how I want those and the filler pieces. If they are even with the front edge of the cabinet (unlike the picture), it seems like it would look funny with full overlay doors since it would be receesed from everything else. OTOH, I was afraid it might look odd (or be more prone to getting banged up)if the end panel/filler was brought flush with the face of the door front because the end panel has a square edge profile and all the doors/drawers have a curved edge profile.

Are there any guidelines as to how to handle this or is it just a matter of personal choice?

Um... I don't really understand your questions. The pullouts pull all the way out so there's nothing about the shape of them that is to do with the hinges. That is, the height at the back fits under the hinge, too. I think the curve is to make it easier to see in at the front, like if you have canned good in there. Not so much for the bottom, but there will be pullouts all the way up in the bottom sections. What does "make the pullout wider" mean? the width is limited by the rails not the hinges.

Okay, I think I figured out part of the second question now. Yes, there's trim on the left side of the cabinet, and it is attached to a facing bamboo panel for the side of the pantry, but what filler pieces? The trim is flush with the doors, so it projects in front of the cabinet with the doors off. But I don't know anything about edge profiles and guidelines. My guideline is hire a skilled artisan you trust and let him do his thing. We discussed whether the stops should be half inch (minimum necessary) or these, which I think are 1.5". I was reluctant to give up inches, but had to agree that thicker looked better with all this chunky stuff going on.

Maybe this picture will help?

plllog: Let me try again on the pullouts and see if this explains it any better. The pullout is basically a shallow drawer. Since the sides go higher in the back, that pullout drawer width has to be narrower than the distance between the hinges or the higher pullout sides would hit the hinges as you pulled the drawer out. I was asking if the front of the drawer was shallow enough that it would fit under the hinge? That way you could make the drawer wider by the width of the drawer sides. It's not a significant difference and now that I think about it, it's probably not a good idea to push the width anyway because you have to get the doors open wide to get the pullout out as it is. Making the drawer wider just makes it worse.

As to the second item, I was referring to how far forward that end piece comes out. I looks like you have slab doors so it makes sense for that piece to be flush with the door front because your door edges are square. I have raised panels doors and the outside edge of the doors and drawers have an ogee (?) curve to them. The thickest part of the door sticks out 3/4" but the outside edge that is next to end panel has the curve routed in it so it's not as thick. That's why I was wondering where to end the panel.

The filler is a piece that they use when the cabinet is next to a wall. The cabinet has to be plumb and level and the walls often aren't so you leave a little space to accommodate any irregularities and fill the gap with this piece that has been scribed to match the wall.

I still don't get the width thing. The whole drawer box, front back and sides, fits under the hinge. The hinge is above it. The 120 degree hinges aren't any wider than the rails, I think, so you could make the boxes deeper, and have the hinge along side, I think, but it would mean you couldn't get at the releases very well so I don't think it would be a good idea. I suppose it's theoretically possible to do underneath glides, instead of side, but I haven't seen them that way. You'd have to have shelves or something to mount them on, so you'd lose vertical space instead of horizontal. I think these are adjustable height, though I'm not 100% sure. The reason for having pullouts in the pantry, rather than just drawers, is so one can open the doors and view the whole thing.

I'm not a cabinetmaker. I write checks. :) So I can't speak to any of the rest of your questions. Yes, my doors are slab. If I understand what you're asking about the edges of your doors, then, yes, I agree that the outside trim should be flush with the door edge rather than the raised panel. You want it to be smooth on either side of the pivot crack.

The cabinets were scribed to the walls, but that's some magic that The Professor and his aide do while I'm not looking :)