In a small kitchen a 24” range is fine- but get Induction. I assume you are doing an 18” dw as well. I don’t understand removing the peninsula but with no plan it’s hard to tell.

A 24" induction cooktop overa 24" oven wouldn't show as low end. Miele has those products as well as an 18" dw. A Miele combi-steam oven is a high-quality choice in 24". Post a scale floorplan of the whole space.

Thanks for your help. It's not terribly small with the peninsula but I noticed every unit in the complex with a similar floor plan suffers from cramped dining space: dining tables attached to the peninsula.

If I remove the peninsula I can have a proper dining space and livingroom kinda seperates nicely.

I'm not sacrificing the convinience here though. Also in terms of investment I have a limitted budget. I measured every 24" range I could find and found out that many are do not have 24" cooking surface.

These are the appliences I'm buying:

Haier 24" electric range convection oven (the only range with 23.5 cooking area)

Haier 24" rangetop MW

GE 18 cf SS top freezer fridge

Bosch DW 24" series 100 50dbT

I can't fit any fridge wider and deeper than 30" and french door is out of question due to the side wall and side cabinet... so only top freezer and all units like mine have top freezers otherwise the corner base cabinet door will be too small).

I have some woodworking skills and I'm thinking of turning the base corner cabinet door to a sliding one.

My wife and I cook frequently and the dishwasher runs every night or twice when we have guests.

I have never used the 30" oven since we purchased the property. It takes forevr to heat and is just crappy and to be honest 90% of the ovens in the low/mid category of this size are useless for serious baking.

The 24" seems good for us but I'm not familiar with North American expectations. Although I've lived in Canada for so many years, this is the first time I'm doing a remodel.

This is a townhouse complex surrounded by many highrises and no single bedroom unit has a 24" range that I could find (execpt new highrises).

Is this going to be a disadvantage? or reduces the property value? I wont be here more than 2 year. So after that I'll either sell it or rent it.

@kempek01 The kitchen is expanding from the side, but in terms of linear cabinet space it shrinks. If you see the stepped wall, I'm extending that end 2ft into "the livingroom space". Adding the extra 6" kind of makes the livingroom wall smaller.

I'm not 100% sure what to do. Please take a look at the TV and where the kitchen ends. I'll post a photo of the other side

@dan1888 Here is the range installed installed in a couple of kitchens. Does it look low end?

The knobs are stainless steel and dishwasher safe.

This has all the features of a 30" oven, also is a convection oven.

What size ovens and cooktops do all of your competition have? Americans kind of expect a 30" oven in a house. Not sure what they expect in a condo.

I’m stuck on ”Sink will be installed next to electric range followed by the dishwasher.” I’m taking that literally & not liking the visual. Is there a useable countertop between sink & range? Dishwasher right next to sink makes sense but range next to sink doesn’t. About the range, is induction cooktop not an option? I’d want that more than the convection oven although my bet is any induction top would include convection oven.

Thanks again!

All units have the same size electric ranges (30"). But that doesn't necessarily mean smart utilization of space. I have seen everyone renovating their kitchens implmenting the exact same layout.

Yes there will be 15"+2" to 3" (17"-18")space between the sink on the left side of the oven. The plan is to add a 15" drawer cabinet and the sink is 18-19" wide (current size).

Regarding the cooktop, almost all units I've seenin the complex have ranges.

Only few European cooktops offer full cooking surface utilization. Inductiontouch cooktops are above the budget given that 24" wall ovens are also expensive.

If the cooktop has its nobs on the panel that's not an option (it will have 20" surface). Electric rangetops can be an option (if exist) but Rangetops do not exist in Canada and if they do, they are within 2000+ CAD range.

We had a 24" range at our lake cabin. We didn't do a lot of baking there - but we learned that a large pizza did not fit! We also never cooked Thanksgiving dinner at the lake, so a small oven was not a problem.

If I was doing this, I would get the smaller range in a heartbeat - 6" can go a long way in a small kitchen.

A 24" range wouldn't be a deal breaker, but it wouldn't be an attraction either......I'd have to really like something else about the place (location, price) to be willing to accept it. Is it to be a rental or are you looking to sell? As a rental, I could manage if other things were good (a friend has had one for 20 years, and manages fine), but as a sale I wouldn't accept it because I wouldn't be able to replace it with induction :)

I agree with toronto veterinarian. If I was renting, then fine. But if I was buying, a 24" range would be a deal breaker. To replace it with a 30" would be expensive, as I would have to change cabinets and countertops. So, I'd pass.

I'd get a smaller dishwasher and hand wash your big items before I'd get the smaller range. I can go 4 or 5 days between runs of the dishwasher but I don't put pots & pans in there.

Where is the fridge because a fridge can't go right up against a wall

The refrigerator will be where it is right now, but it'll be replaced with an appropriate size refrigerator.

cant really even see .....what is the transition between "dining" and then " living" ?? If you post on graph paper the widths and lengths of all the spaces you are commenting about it might be better than limited views so far. The peninsula is okay as far as I'm concerned...I might hesitaate to remove it. I would dislike the empty floorspace once you remove it..... right now the TV would get mounted on the wall and a wall hanger or something for the guitar and so on.....to make the floorspace over there more suitable for a table if thats what you want.

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what are your delineated spaces? wall mounts shown below.... re orienting might be better than tearing up a decent kitchen footprint.

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That's not about disklike or like. It's about the effective utilization of space.

Since this is a smaller condo unit (from my perspective and) based on the photos and rennovations in the townhouse complex, it is an ineffcient design.

Here are some photos of the exact same layout (mirror or identical):

And here is what is in the end of the peninsula:

Well, you may like the the current design and it may surves your lifestyle well, but removing the peninsula is going to open up the wasted "dining space" by the drawer, dishwasher and the sink.

And the cabinets are absolute crap (the end drawer width is 9" but the drawer size is 6").

These are obviously "staged" units. Everyone has their dining table attached to the peninsula which looks dumb to me. Also the pennsula is only good for 1 person to dine on as the the second chair is next to the faucet.

Also, if you open the dishwasher door, your trapped in the kitchen. No two persons can work in the kitchen especially when we have guests and good luck hanging out with your guests in this area without a dining table even if you're a single person.

Can't see any better design.

The unist are wide enough to accomodata a TV stand. So no reason to mount the TV on the wall.

The fact that no one has done it, is because most of the units in this complex are rented to young professionals and kitchen rennovation is pretty expensive here.

These units are around 850sqf and we have a rooftop and all units are allowed to have BBQs.

if the market is renters why the capital outlay... ?when you sell have you considered recouping what you will spend on this major redo of everything? condo's can be challenging anyway but sinking the dollar outlay in something like this would give me pause. if you have the deep pockets and want to its your money.....wall brackets are pretty standard especially in a small footprint and you could do a lot more and keep the peninsula format which suits the space. Kind of sadly typical how people ask and then recoil when people reflect and give feedback........you want to put a non standard stove in there..redo all of it.....leave empty floorspace spend a lot of money......okay..

Great idea @herbflavor, I'd be glad to hear your reasons other than "a common practice these days" and how you see this fitting our living room?

FIY: Do you know the dimensions of a comfrotable couch? How about dimensions of a dining chair and a 4 person table?

I'll give you the dining setup: 16-18" for each chair. If there will no gap between the chair and the table, then the smllest table must be 32".

How much do you think it will cos me to install the Ikea kitchen there given that the kitchen is 17 years old, the counter tops have chips and cracks? Consider that 90%+ of the units around have renovated their kitchens!

Here are some samples of my previous work:

Before:

After my work:

By removing the barn door, I added the extra wall space for the bookcase, added a closet and an office desk. We now have two closets instead of one before.

The closet door is salveged from the bedroom to save money. Finished in two weekends.

Nothin there is luxury btw and doesn't require deep pockets.

And here is the implementation of your idea in my unit in 2010:

To wrap it up, the unit is not wide enough to have all 4 person dning table and a couch and a tv (even if it is mounted on the wall) and possibly a coffee table.

See how stools are set up? All units like mine are arranged this way.

My idea requires minimal plumbing and electrical work as well! and not much demolition.

The livingroom space is square 14'x14'

Abdol, this condo actually has a number of compelling features, and while small, some of the finishes in your unit do not appear to be low budget at all. However, if it were mine, I would actually consider improving this by not choosing a range at all, but instead going with an induction cooktop of 30 inches wide, while having a wall oven, that is 24 inches wide. Underneath the cooktop, you could have pull out drawers, and so you really are not losing any real cabinet storage by going with a separate wall oven. I think potential buyers would appreciate the wider cooking space of a 30 inch induction cooktop, while not missing a 30 inch wide oven as much as you might think. I do a lot of baking and so I actually utilize 30 inch wide wall ovens but there are lots of folks in the buyer demographics of urban condos who don’t bake nearly as much as I might.

For your refrigerator choices, have you considered a 30 inch wide bottom freezer unit with a single door instead of a French door door type?

Another way to upgrade your unit would be to go to a more common standard dishwasher instead of an 18 inch model. If you ever entertain, even with light food/drinks for guests beyond you and your spouse, a full-size dishwasher is a very useful thing, If you were to keep the peninsula, you could always install the wall oven on the side of the peninsula near your dining space, because wall ovens are not typically used as often as cooktops refrigerators and microwaves.

I have both a 24” (combi steam) and 30” oven, and am quite surprised to find that I use the 24” one 95% of the time.

@HU-16168550092

Thanks for the comments. I cannot find a reasonably priced bottom freezer. The depth cannot be more than 30", otherwise it blocks the corner cabinet door.

Refrigerators between 16-18 cft that are within the measurements are high-end luxury, which is out of my budget.

I also weight quality more than look. So Samsung and LG (and few other chinese brands) are out of the euquation.

" I also weight quality more than look. So Samsung and LG (and few other chinese brands) are out of the euquation. "

They're Korean, not Chinese, brands, and LG make some very good quality. I'd put my LG refrigerator up against some US brands for quality. I do agree, though, that a bottom freezer, single door (i.e not French door) fridge arrangement is hard to find these days.

"I wont be here more than 2 year. So after that I'll either sell it or rent it."

I'd de-clutter the countertops and leave it alone.

I would expect a 24” stove in a small duplex rental. I would never purchase any home without a 30” stove.

In the Adirondak tiny home we are planning I will have a 30” induction stove and an 18” dishwaher and that is in 600sf

Here is a follow up of what we did to our kitchen, in case you're interested:

After remodel

https://www.gardenweb.com/discussions/6432712/is-24-electric-range-a-deal-breaker#n=28