The curious case of ‘Crépuscule’

2 years ago

I purchased this rose last winter from Loubert, France, as a bare root grafted plant.

As it began to leaf out in spring I noticed there was a distinct lack of red flushing in the young foliage and stems. The weather was mild and sunny but I started it off in a poly tunnel just in case, because we can get late frosts here and I was keen to baby it. But when the buds formed, they were pure cream with a hint of green at the base and touch of blush pink streaking. The blooms then opened a pale lemon cream colour:

I emailed these photos to Loubert, who agreed it was not Crépuscle, but couldn’t identify what it actually was. A rose friend from the UK also confirmed it was nothing like hers, with it’s distinctive red stems, sunset buds and warm apricot blooms.

I wondered if it might be a sport, but now I think it might be the right rose after all, because this year, the first bud looks very Crépuscule in colour and there is some subtle red colouration in the foliage:

I find this very curious and wondered what the wider antique rose community thinks is going on? I know Tea and Tea/Noisette roses can vary a lot, but this seems extreme!

Featured Answer

jacqueline9CA

2 years ago

What erasmus said.

I ignore any weird colors of leaves or blooms if an old rose is less than 2-3 years old. I have had old roses (Crepuscule is 120 yrs old) do strange things with color, especially tea roses. Mostly when they are very young, but even when they are older.

My Anna Olivier (over 150 yrs old), is usually a buff color with a dark pink/brick color on the reverse of the petals. However, I have seen the entire bush covered in pale yellow blooms, or pale pink blooms, at times. (I think the pale yellow version is what got it mixed up in commerce with 'Etoile de Lyon' (aka Bermuda Anna Olivier), at least in Bermuda and North America (including Vintage Gardens).

If you grow old tea roses, this sort of thing is to be expected (and IMO celebrated).

Jackie

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Comments (8)

Melissa Northern Italy zone 8
2 years ago
My 'Crépuscule' is coming into full bloom now. It's a big plant that has been in my garden for about twenty years, and I have NEVER seen it look like those blooms in your first two photos. They're very pretty, by the way. I'm as mystified as you.
erasmus_gw
2 years ago
Interesting! I was going to say I don't think it's Crepuscule but it sure looks like it in the second picture. I have a small Blue Moon Stone plant that bloomed lavender last year but this year the first blooms started white. Then they developed some color.

Other plants in my garden are a little different in color this year...seems to be weather related.

I am a firm believer that blooms can improve or change in many ways as a plant matures. They can improve in color, petal count, bloom size, form, and fragrance. And of course quantity .
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fig_insanity Z7b E TN
2 years ago
last modified: 2 years ago
I had the same thing happen to my Marianne this year. It's not an old rose, but it is a modern gallica. The first few buds to open this year were ivory, without even a hint of the apricot they should have been. This is her third year to bloom (or would have been if Bambi hadn't had her for lunch last year), and even the first year (she came from Paul with two buds) she had the typical color. So imagine how surprised I was when the first three flowers last week were just creamy white. But thankfully, the next few were ivory with apricot centers, and now the latest to open are what I expect: gorgeous apricot to peach with lighter outer petals, a perfect blend of light to dark. But she had me scared there for a bit, lol.
jerijen
2 years ago
I am always surprised by some of the oddities that my roses surprise me with . . . so I guess I'm not surprised.
NollieSpainZ9
Original Author
2 years ago
Thanks everyone for your combined experience and perspectives, much appreciated. So, not so unusual after all!

What made me think it was the wrong rose was that the weather was mild, warm and sunny, no extremes that might have influenced the colour of the blooms either way. Also combined with the fact that the stems and foliage that looked very different in both form (rounder leaves) and colouring (all green).

Fortunately, I haven’t yet taken Loubert up on their offer to replace it for the ’right’ rose and now I know it’s just natural quirkiness, I will let them know they don’t have to!

Brilliant, thanks again all.
malcolm_manners
2 years ago
The first photos are so very different from typical 'Crépuscule' that I wonder -- could two different varieties have been budded to the same rootstock, so that you have branches of each?
NollieSpainZ9
Original Author
2 years ago
@malcolm_manners, thanks for your thoughts. I agree they look like two entirely different roses. So different, in fact, that the old rose specialist I bought it from didn’t recognise it as crépuscule either! But I‘m pretty sure its all the same rose, which only has two canes (then and now) and buds on both are currently showing the typical apricot/sunset tones.