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felin_gw

How can I know if my soil is in need of amendments?

felin
12 years ago

Hi all,

My husband and I are really wanting know how to test our soil for deficiencies in order to plant an abundant, highly nutritious organic garden as well as a garden that can be managed with natural things to fight disease and bugs when they arise. Learning what things might help to prevent would be even BETTER!

AND need to know...what else can/should be added to soil, other than what most fertilizer companies offer in the typical bag...Phosphorus, Phosphate and Nitrate.

We are novices so need all of the help we can get. Had a GREAT harvest last summer and then we were taken over by both bugs and disease (BIG time!) and because of my poor health and other life circumstances were unable to keep up and had to let it all go. So sad. Nonetheless, we are determined to plant another garden this year and are trying to get started on it.

Grand Total, we have approx 2500 Sq. Ft. of backyard to garden this year, some of which has never been gardened.

Thanks you guys!

Comments (23)

  • toxcrusadr
    12 years ago

    Find your County Agricultural Extension office and inquire about soil tests. In most places they are a resource for getting soil tests at a reasonable cost.

    As to what to add besides N, P and K...compost, of course!

  • bi11me
    12 years ago

    Exactly right. A professional soil test is the only way to know where you are starting from. They are very affordable, and will go a long way in avoiding unneeded inputs. Compost is the second step, and should be started now, and continuously be created and added to the soil to increase its' quality for growing healthy food. Choose a method that seems to suit your thinking and abilities - square-foot, raised beds, lasagne, row-crops - and find a good book to guide you. It's as complicated as you want it to be, but designing a good system at the beginning will keep it from getting away from you.

  • jolj
    12 years ago

    I agree.

  • Kimmsr
    12 years ago

    As the others have stated a good, reliable soil test for soil pH, Phosphorus, Potash, Calcium, and Magnesium would be a start. You also should want to know what the residual level of organic matter is, humus, how well that soil drains, how well that soil retains moisture, how the soil handles, tilth, and even what kind of life is there. These simple soil tests can help.
    1) Structure. From that soil sample put enough of the rest to make a 4 inch level in a clear 1 quart jar, with a tight fitting lid. Fill that jar with water and replace the lid, tightly. Shake the jar vigorously and then let it stand for 24 hours. Your soil will settle out according to soil particle size and weight. A good loam will have about 1-3/4 inch (about 45%) of sand on the bottom. about 1 inch (about 25%) of silt next, about 1 inch (25%) of clay above that, and about 1/4 inch (about 5%) of organic matter on the top.

    2) Drainage. Dig a hole 1 foot square and 1 foot deep and fill that with water. After that water drains away refill the hole with more water and time how long it takes that to drain away. Anything less than 2 hours and your soil drains� too quickly and needs more organic matter to slow that drainage down. Anything over 6 hours and the soil drains too slowly and needs lots of organic matter to speed it up.

    3) Tilth. Take a handful of your slightly damp soil and squeeze it tightly. When the pressure is released the soil should hold together in that clump, but when poked with a finger that clump should fall apart.

    4) Smell. What does your soil smell like? A pleasant, rich earthy odor? Putrid, offensive, repugnant odor? The more organic matter in your soil the more active the soil bacteria will be and the nicer your soil will smell.

    5) Life. How many earthworms per shovel full were there? 5 or more indicates a pretty healthy soil. Fewer than 5, according to the Natural Resources Conservation Service, indicates a soil that is not healthy.

  • Laurel Zito
    12 years ago

    I did not do it that way at all. I just started added some bags of supersoil in the early 90s. Then I found out it was better to add bags of OM until I started composting. I would just buy a bag of some brand of compost dig it. See how you like that. Add some more over time as needed. It is not super complex. But, if you have clay you need to research that more online. If you are not sure you could call a gardener to help you and give suggestions. Do you have a neighbor who gardens? They could give suggestions. Do you have a local garden club?

  • the_virginian
    12 years ago

    I agree with all the advice given here especially about adding organic matter...no matter what! LOL! If you have clay soil like I do, it is probably not short on trace elements, but will (as the others stated) benefit from adding the OM and some well balanced fertilizer, based on the results of the soil test.

  • jolj
    12 years ago

    I agree with kimmsr on everything,but#5, earthworms are not the only indicator of life.
    Many gardens do not have earthworms, because they have good drainage & are in the full sun for 8-10 hours.
    Many other life forms are there, just not earth worms.
    The red worm & night crawler are from across the pond.
    They are not from the U.S.A.
    So we had no life before they came over in root balls of fruit trees?

  • Kimmsr
    12 years ago

    jolj, nothing in #5 says earthworms are the only indication of soil life. Earthworms are one indication and one most people can readily see. The presents of centipedes, millipedes, sow bugs, slugs, earwigs, and many small insects are also indicators of soil life, although many people think of those as pests that must be eliminated instead of part of a healthy soil.
    Some time spent with The Soil Food Web Primer might help.

    Here is a link that might be useful: The Soil Food Web Primer

  • darth_weeder
    12 years ago

    but it does say that fewer than five "indicates a soil that is not healthy".
    Which isn't indicative of the whole truth.
    Fewer than five "could" indicate that the soil "might" not be healthy or it could also mean nothing at all.

  • ontheplains
    12 years ago

    felin, most soil test labs will offer a "garden soil test" package, which will include soil pH, P, K, residual N, Organic Matter, and other parameters, and most will also give you an interpretation of the data. As previously mentioned, I suggest checking with your county extension agent. It is important to make sure the sample you take is representative of the garden as a whole. If you have areas that are very different, you may want to collect two separate samples. For example, if one area has received soil amendments in the past, and on hasn't. Typically these samples are collected to a depth of 6 or 8 inches, from multiple locations, mixed together, and then submitted.

  • fortyonenorth
    12 years ago

    I agree with the advice to have your soil tested but with a caveat. I would strongly recommend finding a lab that will provide a "base saturation" test. This type of test will tell you the amounts and relative proportions of mineral elements and compounds in your soil. I use Logan Labs in Ohio, but there are others that will perform the same tests. Why do I recommend base saturation? Because, in my experience, county extension testing, as well as university testing, toe the "feed the plant" line. It's all about yield and what can be done to get more bang for the buck. In contrast, base saturation testing is going to help you achieve a balanced soil that will, in turn, grow excellent, nutritious crops - it's a "feed the soil" approach. Neither approach is necessarily right or wrong, but based on your opening post, it sounds like the "feed the soil" camp squares with your philosophy.

  • felin
    Original Author
    12 years ago

    Thank you all so much for your feedback. It is very helpful.

    fortyonenorth - Can you tell me how much you've paid for such a test? I am most definitely MUCH MUCH more interested in nutrition value as opposed to yield. It is first and foremost to us.

    Thanks again to all of you,

    Felin (Mindy)

  • feijoas
    12 years ago

    Mindy, if you're really, really interested in soil nutrtion, look out for a lab that does Reams testing. The results show you what's actually available to the plants, as opposed to what's in the soil, but may be unavailable.
    Reams testing is specifically designed for organic growers.

  • marshallz10
    12 years ago

    Kimmsr, your #1 should read "Texture", not structure, otherwise a fine summary of soil properties. Structure is observed in-place; cultivation often destroys native soil structure. Heavy traffic and some fertilizers can adversely affect soil structure, reducing the infiltrations rates of water and air.

    Mindy, your description of "great yields" followed by collapse of the garden under the weight of pest and diseases is sort of a typical pattern in newer gardens. In the future, by adding more and better organic material to the soil, you will find a greater degree of stability in your growing season. You do have to keep up on weeding so as to cut weed seed production, otherwise your gardens in the future will continue to become weed-infested.

  • pnbrown
    12 years ago

    I agree with Marshall, that is a very common first-season garden experience. The plants burned up the small amount of easily available nutrients in the soil and then ran up against mineral imbalance.

    For a new garden it is pretty safe to add any sort of rotted OM, with seaweed being the very best option. No need for a soil test to add seaweed.

  • gargwarb
    12 years ago

    look out for a lab that does Reams testing.

    Carey Reams didn't come up with the test. It's just a Morgan extract developed by (oddly enough) Dr. M.F. Morgan at the University of Connecticut. Calling it a Ream's test gives credit where none is due and completely ignores the creator.

    Also, when looking for a lab, most that run the test will call it a "Morgan extract" so searching for a "Ream's test" will exclude a lot of labs that do perform that test.

    Of course, Reams came up with her own interpretation critera. However, they are based on a prescribed lbs. per acre formula. ie. she wants 400 lbs. per acre of phosphorous. This is the next best thing to useless because the amount of nutrients that would be sufficient in a sandy soil are worlds away from sufficient in a heavy clay. (and a myriad of other factors play a role)


    You also aren't limited to Morgan extract to gie an idea of what is actually available rather than the total that you would get from a strong acid extraction. In fact there are many valuable weak acid extractions that follow the same basic principle. Mehlich 2, Mehlich 3 and DTPA are other examples.

    However, the best method will vary with your soil type. Following one "guru" style type of testing rather than choosing the correct method of analysis and interpretation (which touches on the whole religious mind set without the thinking to back it up scenario that has been such a popular topic lately) can result in poor information and results.

  • pnbrown
    12 years ago

    Actually Carey Reams was a man. He was born and lived in florida, so sandy soil was his world.

  • toxcrusadr
    12 years ago

    Carey, always a confusing name, like Pat. I worked for a Carey for several years here till recently. SHE got a promotion and moved to another office. :-]

  • feijoas
    12 years ago

    gargweb, thanks for the info on different tests etc.
    I'd really, really like to think I don't do 'guru' and 'religious', but as a layperson, it's easy to fall into unquestioningly accpting the word of 'experts'.
    I think a big part of my very positive experience with this test is more the lab itself: the technicians aren't recommending superphosphate to the farmer down the road and activated charcoal to me.

  • gargwarb
    12 years ago

    I'd really, really like to think I don't do 'guru' and 'religious'

    And you don't seem the type either. I've read a lot of your posts and you strike me as someone who really thinks things through.

    I totally understand where you're coming from about relying on the experts and I wouldn't say that to do so makes one a zealot. (though re-reading my post I can totally see how it could be taken that way. Expressing myself isn't exactly my strong point and I apologize if it came off that way.) What I was trying to point out is that exclusive reliance on a single person, method or idea can certainly have the tang of dogma. That probably feeds into what some folks have been talking about lately and I can see that point too. People have been asking for specific examples so I highlighted it with my uncanny knack for diplomacy.

  • feijoas
    12 years ago

    gargweb, I find your posts informative AND funny, precious commodities to me!
    Contributing to the great swill of online misinformation and dogma is not on my to-do list, but it's so easy to blurt out stuff that's interesting me at the time, completely forgetting that there's people out there reading it who might think I'm actually stating facts, rather than opinion.
    I generally try to remember to couch online comments with "I think" type language, so people know it's just my opinion.

  • lazy_gardens
    12 years ago

    Had a GREAT harvest last summer and then we were taken over by both bugs and disease

    You weren't ruthless enough with thinning early on, and probably watered too well. Lush growth and crowded plants are a heaven for bugs and blight.

    Also, pay attention to your plant varieties. Some do better in your area than others.

  • jolj
    12 years ago

    "What I was trying to point out is that exclusive reliance on a single person, method or idea can certainly have the tang of dogma."
    Well put, I do not like change in the garden & will be trying different types beds to see if the change is worth my time.
    Reading books & web sites are great.
    But one should try it before they prompt it.
    So I am going to put the money where my mouth is.

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