Paulette, there is no simple, unique answer to your question. For myself, I began as an organic gardener because I started gardening as a youngster in the 1930s before chemical sprays and fertilizers were available -- or, if they were, we couldn't afford their cost. Since then, I have found that gardening by organic methods is kinder to me and my family and to the environment. And, once all the natural processes are reestablished, it works just as well, and it's a whole lot cheaper than buying and using a lot of chemicals.

At the same time, this isn't any philosophy or religion with me, as it is with some folks. And, with my professional background in the earth sciences, I don't suscribe to or tolerate easily a lot of the junk science (to be kind) that is passed off today as "organic gardening." By the same token, I don't believe that non-organic gardeners are evil people. To each his or her own, if you please.

I grow roses organically because there's lots of varieties that can be. I'm very good at ignoring the ugly bushes and enjoying the pretty ones. I can enjoy a flower on an ugly bush. Everyone says I need to look at the whole picture more often, but not doing so works for roses. I have a long time love affair with Mother Nature, and therefore I wouldn't enjoy growing roses if I sprayed lots of chemicals. I'm also lazy. P.S. I don't think there's any evil people on this forum.

Field:

I'm not looking for one answer, or even an easy one. I'm interested in learning more about the various reasons people go organic and how going organic effected other changes in their lives.

We recently decided to get a solar electric system that generates all our electrical needs. Even if the solar industry was as developed as it is today, I'm not sure I would have considered going solar 20 years ago when I wasn't an organic gardener and wasn't that worried about the environment.

Starting off small, with an organic garden, made it easier for me to become involved in the whole environmental picture. I thing being an organic gardener resulted in my eventual decision to go solar electric.

Paulette

I'm practicing organic gardening because I've learned that nature is harmonically balanced. (Rose) Gardening should enrich the environment and the soul; therefore such act should not upset the existing balance.

Taken, for example, when you spray with insecticides or even with fungicide, a lots of beneficial insects are killed along with the alphids, catepillars, beetles... So when there are no beneficial insects around, you have to keep spraying to prevent future attacks from the harmful bugs. In my no spray rose garden, I see a varieties of spiders and lady beetles that keep my roses clean - no sign of aphids. And the birds keep the catepillars and beetles under control. Yes, I did see a bird swooped down to catch a JB.

The fact that without using synthesis fungicides, you need to grow roses that are highly disease resistant. So then the choices are very much limited, you think. But I've collected more than a dozen varieties from climber to hybrid teas that do perform well, along with beautiful bloom forms and wonderful fragrances.

Have you noticed that when you spray regularly, you won't see birds around your roses garden. No butterfy. It's a still life - with cemetary effect. No other creatures, except you wandering around and enjoying the roses, inhaling the fragrances and possibly the toxic chemicals that no one knows for sure how they affect your health and the soil in the long term.

And going organic also makes use of organic fertilizers when you can. Organic foods feed the soil and the micro organisms. Good soil grows healthy roses that improves their resistance to BS, and many other diseases, and the effects last much longer than synthesis fert, which are quick acting, and also leaching fast in the streams and rivers and poison everything living in those environments.

Those reasons above drive me toward practicing organic gardening. But it's really simple. I choose good roses, plant them, feed them regularly, and water them. I then worry about nothing else, because nature in balance takes care the rest. The roses may still have some holes in their leaves or maybe some imperfect flowers. But who is going to see the minor imperfections while the garden is alive with colors, sounds and butterflies. It the choice I've made and I really enjoy the experience.

I am an organic gardener for simple, intuitive reasons. Just as I don't want to raise my children on processed foods lacking in fiber and micronutrients, I don't want to grow a garden under these conditions.
I do start by researching the best plants for my climate and yard conditions. I use compost and manure, fish emulsion and bonemeal. Unlike chemical fertilizers these things condition the earth and feed everything. There are lots of worms and strange bugs but it's all so interesting.

My current garden is pretty new but it's lovely to me and my family, and there are lots of birds around here and butterflies and bees, it's a charming place to be. It's not a sterile, perfect, or foul-smelling place to be.
I have about 15 roses, which isn't much compared to some of the people on this forum!--more than half are old garden roses. Some are more eaten or black-spotted than others but they'll put out a few blooms that are stunning and I'm happy. Some of the bigger bushes make the landscape look full and lush because they're so resistant to whatever is out there decimating roses. I intersperse all this with other perennials and annuals and vines so if my Don Juan has lost most of its leaves it's okay, it's not an eyesore, it'll get better.

Doing it all this way makes me happy and proud of my accomplishments. Everyone needs to choose their own way that will make them happiest--I think that's the best reason to have a garden.

Rose

I garden organically because I believe it is the safest, healthiest way to live. We started our new farm from bare land, and I didn't want to poison the land with any chemicals. I am slowing getting my rose garden started, and so far have had excellent luck with just my organic methods. I also have a small vegetable garden, also totally organic. I support organic farmers whenever possible, because I believe our future depends on cutting back on chemicals.

A lot of the products I was using gave me blinding headaches & sinus trouble, & made me itch.
I sold a house for a couple who had such a beautiful yard that a horticulturist bought the home! When they bought another home, they told me they had done research & were going to use organic methods for the long-term results. So I decided to try it.
The first couple of years were slow going, but the effect seems to be cumulative: Walking from my neighbor's lawn onto my lawn is like walking from a cement floor onto carpet.
And I do love having cardinals & mockingbirds nest in the trees & rose bushes, & having dragonflies, bumble bees, little wild bees, butterflies, & lately a firefly or two. And wasps & spiders. I have some champeen wasps & spiders.
I guess it's changed my life in that I have become more aware of what I do with things. When I change the coffee filter, what do I do with the used grounds? When my cut flowers get yucky, what do I do with them? Where does stuff go? I try to put it where it will add to the quality of life, whether my own or just life in general, and so far it seems that the changes are just different habits, not more difficult habits. In the same vein, I have begun to eat a little better: thinking of the food value available for my garden has made me think of the food value available to me!

I very much agree with roseleaf's observation about gardens without birds and butterflies. They're kind of eerie, like a ghost town. While I truly admire and salivate over the drop-dead gorgeous rose gardens I've seen posted on the Roses Forum, I also feel equal pleasure in watching a big fat happy bumblebee fumble his way through the many layers of petals on one of my rose blooms. It's just such a hoot!
I have tried to select roses that are disease resistant, but unfortunately, I also have a thing for yellow and peach roses, which are right off the bat going to be somewhat less disease resistant. So, I've tried to give excellent rose culture with organic fertilizers, lots of sun and water and mulch. Now, I'm just hoping for the best!
To me, a beautiful garden is more than just a one-dimensional visual "still life", but a connection to nature that is rich and sensual on many levels, and my own reason to go organic.

Perhaps the next pets won't die early of cancer...

I find gardening organically much easier and more pleasant. I now have a lot more time to enjoy my gardens instead of consistant spraying and whatnot. I just sit back and watch the birds, and beneficials go to work. It is also interesting to see all the many varieties of spiders that have been appearing out of nowhere. I also enjoy the fuzzy bumble bees and honey bees that do their dance on the flowers. It creates a much more enjoyable environment in my opinion.

I garden organically because it connects me to nature and the wonderful ebbs and flows that it involves. The garden is where I am most in touch with my spirituality and the magic of the season's cycles. All life forms are welcome here..each as important as the other, and I respect them all. I grow lots of roses and they are mostly healthy and beautiful and if the bugs are eating a few of the leaves, I don't mind, and I don't think the roses mind either. The bugs have to live too. The rose will grow more leaves and the bugs will get eaten or move on. The law of supply and demand keeps things in perspective and very interesting things happen in my gardens. The years of organic gardening
have allowed the roses to become strong so they can pretty much fend off disease on their own. My garden is full of life and it brings me much satisfaction and happiness.

I've been practically glued to the roses forum for the last while and this is my first foray into the organic side of things. It's been on my mind, though, which is why I'm here. I live in Oklahoma where black spot is wicked and I hate to see my beautiful rose bushes defoliated. There is no organic product than equal a chemical fungicide. However, I'm deeply troubled about spraying something that requires goggles and protective gear. What am I doing? I think. And for what purpose? Not to mention the fact I can't let my dog or five cats into the back yard for at least 24 hours and then I worry, worry, worry. And where is all this toxic stuff going? Certainly, it won't be staying in MY yard. And then as one of you mentioned, constant spraying and fussing is a helluva lot of work. The whole idea of growing things is supposed to be relaxing and soulful. I love all the comments mentioned so far. Next spring and summer I might allow myself an occassional spray but I'm going to try to choose hardier roses and get by pretty much organically. Something about chemicals feels hard and wrong to me. That must be my soul talking. I do believe that when you start changing one part of your life (waking up, maybe) other parts change too.

This is a response in particular to Oklahoma Rose. Please know that you can grow roses organically and deal with blackspot nonchemically.

First, visit Field Roebuck's Web site (he was the first response to my original question). Field lists a bunch of roses that are pretty disease resistant. You'll find mention of roses that went through the EarthKind trials at Texas A&M.

These trials were SEVERE. One-hundred seventeen varieties were planted, watered occasionally (literally), NEVER sprayed with anything -- NEVER, and never fertilized. They were observed for 5 years and then rated for overall health and vigor.

Blackspot is a big problem in Dallas where the EarthKind test was conducted and in the test, the disease pressure actually increased over time because diseased leaves were not removed from the ground.

The end result was a lot of the original 117 roses croaked, but a bunch survived and, in fact, did well. These are called EarthKind. EarthKind roses will probably do real well for you and if they do get any blackspot, it won't bother them much.

The other thing you should look into is using the Cornell Baking Soda formula. Field is a great proponent of this formula and I believe it's listed on his Web site. Make sure you get the actual Cornell formula and not a knock-off that has be altered.

The Cornell formula was developed at Cornell University to kill blackspot on roses. It works pretty good. It's also good for mildew. The trick with getting rid of blackspot is to stop it before it starts.

Good luck!
Paulette Mouchet

I've been gardening using organic methods for over 15 years. The main reason was that my very young kids loved eating peas and tomatoes right in the garden. Also, we were concerned about our English bulldog who weathered out New Mexico summers in the garden, among(and sometimes on) the zucchini. I've always sheet composted kitchen scraps (pureed in food processor) in the gardens and have had wonderful plants. Plant selection really is critical as I found when I experimented with tomatoes two years ago and lost the entire crop to diseases. Also, I find that I can't even be around the pesticide aisle at the store without the mild allergic reaction. Organic gardening really helps with the rapid deterioration of organic matter in our soil due to the heat. I start the season with bags of compost and amendments and add grass clippings etc all season long. I think that gardening organically help me make better use of precious water as the enriched soil holds the water better. I'm really fond of Jerry Baker's homemade tonics -- my seedlings are going gangbusters. I just find organic gardening to be an easy, natural way to bring life to the desert.

Thanks for asking such a thoughtful question. I've only been growing roses the last six years or so. I was already "green" long before I started growing roses so my organic gardening was an outgrowth of an already existing philosophy. Besides, I think it's kinda sad to see a beautiful rose garden that's sterile and devoid of all natural life. Walk into my garden and you'll find ladybugs, lizards and a spider or two all doing their part to help me grow roses.

I started organically a long time ago because I couldn't afford the chemicals. You had to buy so many and it seemed endless. Plus, being "hot natured", I couldn't stand having to wear protective gear. I figured if it could "kill me", did I really want to use it? So, hence the organic gardening. As I continued, every aspect of my life went organic. Then I found out if I used more "native" plants, bugs didn't seem to like them. Have you noticed that "weeds" don't seem to get eaten? So, I started going native which meant no excess watering or pampering. It all seems to evolve into a wonderful way of life. My garden is gorgeous,alive and soul-feeding. My friends come over and think I work myself to the bone keeping it pretty. All I do is patrol and enjoy. In early spring and late fall, there's alot of work but I enjoy that. So, basically, organics is alot easier and cost effective.
Hilary
PS, come aboard, you won't regret..

I went organic partially because my parents are both in the medical field & I got lots of "be aware of the potential danger of chemicals" direction from them when I was a kid. As an adult I became passionate about environmental conservation, and nearly completed a degree in conservation ecology (baby #3 ended that abruptly). Anyway, I learned so much in those classes, and probably the most important thing that I learned was that environmental protection begins with our own individual consciousness. We as individuals have to be responsible. We as individuals have to consider our impact on the rest of the community, environment included. I realized that I didn't need to be on the front lines of the fight for responsible treatment of the environment, I could do so much of it in my own little environment: my garden, my house, etc.

3 kids & a dog, and my own safety, reinforce the necessity of limited exposure to chemicals.

The other huge factor in my decision was the bee issue. I just can't put them in further danger because I genuinely love them.

People before me, have already said it so well..but here goes....I garden organically because I like to see the bees and dragonflies and the scary looking baby ladybugs! I have a friend who was having trouble with insects on his roses. I think they were Cucumber Beetles. He asked me, if I had them, and were they a problem with my roses? I told him yes, they were in my yard, but I hadn't noticed any damage. They are in the yard, I saw one yesterday...After about three years, I seem to have some sort of balance in my yard between the 'good and bad bugs'. There are so many LaceWings out there, that when I open an unscreened window, they come inside, I try to shoo them back outside but I haven't had good luck with that, sorry to say.

I have been taught to grow organicly since I was a very small child in the 1950's. When my father was transfered to duty outside of Madrid, Spain for 3 1/2 years, the entire family went ( 9 of us)1963-1967. Where we lived outside of Madrid was in a home where provisions were already for us to self sustain, nobody there were using any chemicals which I knew of or ever saw. (Exception! The military base where we moved to for 1 year in Spain weekly mosqito spraying down all residentual base housing...us kids always ran behind the fogger...soon after I came down with a skin rash and almost died- I was isolated from my family for 10 days! I was diagnosis with a disease and they showed me pictures of people with skin rashes where their entire body was peeling off.

There are many other stories I've heard and seen that convience me that organic is the only way.

And Feild...I disagree with your closing statement >

I believe that thats the problem...what someone else does effects my rights and prividges, it does not feel good to be forced to live in a manner that is not healthy when a neighbor or another person does as they please and those actions makes one compromised in health and thus the entire planet becomes slanted towards the trends of mass media brainwashing rather than the nurturing biodynamics of organic and sustainable life styles which produce the that of optimum health.

Besides, its not always as simple as just moving to find a place where it is ok to live where everyone can do as they please and everyone would be respecting others rights of environmental space usage.

I am not saying that all plastic and snythetic materials should become void. (although that would be rather interesting and well with me) What Iam saying in the wisdom I am limited with;

There is a common sense of understanding how chemistry is everything and that manwith manipulated constructs regarding our food, life style and evnvironment has greatly historicly altered the planet due to petroleum and of science. Science and petroleum in a free country can produce unusual and innovating possiblitites-( as we all experience)

What I would like to see is that all consummers start demanding more wholestic and healthy choices! I am not suggesting boycotts...Iam suggesting that people wake up and take responsibility for their actions- and I too, fault on this often however, I try to go into the direction that is responsible as often and frequently as possible.

I still drive and burn fossil fuels into the environment

I still buy organic material wrapped and packaged in plastic ( is that a oxymoron or what?)

I still use plastic all day long (toothbrush, hairbrush, computer, refrigerator, car, storage containers, washer, dryer, kids toys, videos, and fishing equiptment.

The ironic part is that I consciously try not to consume/purchase plastics...but plastic surrounds me and the sad thing is that the chemicals in plastics are not healthy or benefical directly as a substance in the human body.

Of course I realize that we have potioned ourselves to be dependent on plastic like an addiction of choice. We have been plastic sensationalized since the tupper ware queen was the greatest honor to have.

Enough said, let someone else tell their story.

Thank you for sharing such a passinate subject, and my apologies to you Field if I undermined your intent to accept others as they are, I understand the kind thought- to bad not everyone is educated or cares about leaving this planet having left enriched wholestic contributions for generations that follow.

I believe that most people are tried of all the hysteria and have grown addicted to their life styles and that organic is furthur from being healthy instead closer to disease and muck and dirt and unhealthy life style. Worms!
Manure! YUCK! Yuck! ( I have heard this too many times- it makes me very sad)

So I come here to find Iam still not the only one out there who believes in magic and that organic is better!

gardengardengardenga, (whew!)

I'm noticing an organic trend in the area I live. Our little local store has been offering more and more organic produce, sundry and canned goods. Almost anything I might need I can find an organic alternative for (yogurt, eggs, spaghetti noodles, spaghetti sauce, cereal, frozen foods, dish and laundry soap, t.p., 'feminine' needs, etc.).

I don't believe the store would be offering these things if people weren't buying them so I think there's a growing awareness (e.g.: trend) of respect for the earth and (I think) a desire to go back to (a) slower paced, "simpler times" - before chemicals were the mainstay.

What happened to you is a prime example of how dangerous chemicals are. People that think they can do what they want to the earth - as though it were a separate entity from themselves - aren't realizing that we're kind of ummm... dependant on the earth for survival! (duh!).

I'm seeing a growing awareness of our impact on the earth. I'm seeing progress - and it gives me hope.

To answer geomouchet; discovering I had a passion for gardening was the catalyst for becoming a lot more aware of the environment - and how what I (we) do impacts not just my tiny little plot but the entire area I (we) live (which covers the globe).

My love of animals and other fine little creatures (dragonflies, butterflies, hummingbirds, etc.) played into this new awareness too (I'm dedicating my back yard to native vegetation to do what I can to help offset the damage/displacement of wildlife (and the insects that help make the world go round) caused by all the construction going on around here.

I'm crazy about plants of all kinds and it never dawned on me before that as our native vegetation decreases, so decrease the homes that were once reserved for our native species of critters. I became aware of this phenomenon after reading Rosalind Creasy's "Earthly Delights" which I would have never read if I weren't into gardening - and especially if I weren't into organic gardening. As Creasy states in this great book: "By landscaping with an eye to restoring and preserving our natural ecosystems, and by stemming the tide of bluegrass that threatens to stretch from coast to coast, we can, with appropriate alterations create niches for ourselves, make safe corners here and there in which indigenous plants and animals can thrive. Each households contributions may be small, indeed, but the combined effort could mean the continued existence of many habitats and the living things that depend on them". Amen.

My garden has completely changed how I think and live.