Other kinds of conifers get galls caused by aphids. The lack of a determination coming from university sources is curious, without knowing who looked at your material and how they dealt with your queries specifically I cannot suggest how to follow up on that. Did any of this process involve USDA Cooperative Extension personnel? I would think they would want to know about it if it was something new and rare - and would give you some kind of definitive follow-up.

I agree with Bboy that it's odd they could not be more helpful.
Is there any chance they got hit with herbicide overspray? Are you near farms? How big are they?

Where on the property are the trees? Do you or a neighbor have the lawn treated near the trees for weeds? Specifically in 2011. the damage looks a lot like Imprelis herbicide damage to me. The company I work for used this herbicide when it came on the market in 2011 and had a couple of hundred customers with trees damaged. Spruces, White pines, Arborvitae, Dawn redwood and Cedrus. Many of them show similar gall formation from the herbicide. Being the horticulturist I was put in charge of documenting and reporting this damage. While I have no experience with Redwoods (wish I could grow them in Ohio) based on the hundreds of trees I've seen with Imprelis damage, that's surely what it looks like to me. There is also another product for weed control that is still available as a bare ground herbicide that has the same active ingredient. Check to see what if anything has been sprayed. the active ingredient is: Aminocyclopyrachlor

The good news is, if this did occur in 2011 the trees will most likely recover. DuPont is still offering warranty on trees damaged until may of 2015 for those who filed claims.

Here is a link that might be useful: Imprelis herbicide (Michigan State U.)

That, surely is it. I'd get back to the university people you asked about it so they are informed about it.

First thing i thought of upon viewing pics.....Imprelis.

Yes!!!! This sounds right! The trees surround an acre of landscaped area and we had a yard guy spray to control weeds (it was all bare dirt, so there were a million weeds. We are using wood mulch now, which is working well. We spread out 300 yards of the stuff).

I always thought it was the chemical, but the guy SWORE it was the generic form of RoundUp and there was NO WAY it could have done this. Also, it was sprayed in early 2013.....could the company have bought the Imprelis in 2011 and still been using it?

It is making me so sad, all these sickly trees surrounding my house. I wish there was more I could do. Thank you so much for helping me!

That is weird-the Imprelis debacle-as you suspect-should have run its course before this happened. Hmmm?

+oM

As I mentioned there is still a product that is in use that has the same active ingredient, the name of that product escapes me though. It is labeled for use on bare ground so your situation makes sense. Seems you should have your plant material tested for Aminocyclopyrachlor. if tests come back positive, your landscaper may be liable for damages. There is little chance that "generic Roundup" would do that. I find the generic Glyphosates a waste of time and money. They just don't work well. Don't know about your state, but here in Ohio, we must leave a listing of chemicals applied at every property when treatments are done, and we have to keep meticulous records of registration numbers, lot numbers etc.

Even 3 years out, last spring a saw some "new" damage from imprelis 3 years after its application. It is very persistent in the soil (which is scary)

I went through my notes and thought this information would be helpful to you. The other products I mentioned with the same active ingredient as Imprelis are: Method 240SL and Method 50SG. These are both labeled as bare ground herbicides and based on the information you provided one of these may be what was used. If my notes are correct these two products were registered after the Imprelis fiasco.

Please keep us posted on the results, and best of luck!

Freds, that's some good info. I should have thought the active ingredient would be banished across the spectrum of products and labeling. Such is the craftiness of commerce though, that these materials should still be finding their way to landscapes.

I don't want to pull this thing off-topic but I find your comments regarding "generic roundup" perplexing, having used such items not for years but for decades. We sure wouldn't have been doing so if they didn't work! Can't get my head around that comment, but I digress.

OP, yes, do seek out application records. They should be available and once secured, would end this guessing game.

+oM

"Bare ground" to me means it is a sterilant that is not to be used around plantings. Another point I will mention is that there has been a problem in the past with active ingredients showing up in pesticide products that weren't supposed to be in that particular product - the implication being that chemical companies were unloading excess stocks of active ingredients by mixing them into other products.

In this particular case perhaps operator error came into it, with there having been residues from a previous application of Imprelis or equivalent in the tanks when the other material was mixed and applied to your property. Or some other mistake was possible, and did occur.

This post was edited by bboy on Wed, Jan 21, 15 at 14:22

After emailing my county extension, I am even more confused and it looks as though I may never know what's wrong with my trees.
He had received an email 1.5 years ago from a golf course manager with redwood damage photos exactly like mine. After emailing other experts, they decided they weren't sure what it was, but probably a genetic disorder. I responded to him with your info about the Imprelis, and he checked into it and said Imprelis (or anything else with that active ingredient) has never been licensed in CA.
My chemical guy says he only sprayed Ranger, which is also what the golf course sprayed......BUT, the active ingredient in Ranger shouldn't have caused this.
The golf course said they just pulled out the trees, which I may have to do, but I REALLY don't want to. I also had a lot of leaf and needle curling on other trees, so that wouldn't fit with the genetic problem idea.
Who knows, I guess.

I have used Roundup and generic products containing glysophate and it works just fine. It's not so good on clover or horsetail and some other products work better on brush, but I've been very happy with it for decades also.
Mike...digressing too.

Ok, A couple of points.

1) I was wrong in stating that the Imprelis related products were for bare ground use. They can be added to other herbicides for bare ground use. Aminocyclopyrachlor is a broadleaf selective contact, systemic soil active herbicide that can even be used in habitat restoration.

2) I should have only spoken of the generic Glyphosate product I used. I have used Banner Maxx fungicide. I find the same true of the generic for that, lousy results. My personal opinion. I actually prefer Lontrell for bed weed control, and it hammers Thistle! We all use what works best for us, Yes?

3) Many golf courses used Aminocyclopyrachlor (Imprelis) because of its effectiveness and its extremely low mammalian toxicity. THIS IS ONLY MY OPINION, but if a golf course manager sees a product (or goes to a seminar like my company did) that really works do you not think you would cross state lines to get it? Homeowners from Canada routinely cross into the States to purchase herbicides here (yes I know there's a lake in the way...doesn't stop them) because they cannot be sold in Ontario for "cosmetic" use, they can still be acquired.

Bottom line the way I see it: In 25 years I have only seen one herbicide cause the curling AND galls on conifers (Imprelis). Insects and diseases (that are known) have already been ruled out. Genectics are a farce, not all 50 trees are going to show the same unless they are grafted and of the same scion wood. So, again, I would ask to have the trees (especially the galls and curling tips) tested for Aminocyclopyrachlor. Only thinking deep in my mind, perhaps the reason the golf course "just pulled out the trees" is they did something they weren't supposed to. My company did in 1998 (there was residual herbicide in a tank, we toasted an entire driving range) we paid the price and it won't happen again.

Best of luck!

Full agreement, Freds. And this Imprelis thing is and has been a rolling disaster. Every time the experts have said we've seen the end of it, the experts have been wrong. Newer victims (after the big conifers) now appear to be various angiosperm trees.

A local golf course neatly rid itself-well, I don't know about "neatly"-of all of it's big Norway spruce. For this NS fan, that was heartbreaking to see. Up along Lake Superior, evidently one very large and extensive lodge did the same with all its NS and white pine. What I can't wrap my head around is how Dow failed to do due diligence in the testing of this material. I'm as much for low mammalian toxicity as the next mammal, but that's not the only issue.

OP, I don't think you got very good info. I know it gets tiring when you have to do all the digging yourself, but honestly, you may have excellent grounds for a suit. Some of these knuckleheads out there only understand one thing, that of course being money.

+oM

I had tomato plants die off a year after glyphosate killed off grass. Once the plants got 2 foot tall, they began to all die off. The glyphosate was still active in the soil a year after application. My neighbor had DuPont Imprelis applied to his lawn back in 2011. All of my trees were injured and some died. Imprelis did change the DNA of the trees. The so called tree expert didn't know beans about trees. He came out twice after I appealed the Dupont Imprelis settlement which to me was a joke. My white spruce was identified as a Norway spruce by the not so smart tree expert. I have been taking photos of my trees since 2011 and 6 years later, Imprelis is still very active in the soil. The white spruce did not recover to its former self. The DNA changed to where the side branches grew longer than the top leader. Seed cones abundant from bottom to top. The only parameters DuPont used was initial damage that occurred in 2011 and not long term damage over the years.

JenJane12's redwood trees most likely suffered herbicide damage, weakened the tree's immune system and changed the trees DNA.

" The glyphosate was still active in the soil a year after application."

That's just not supported by any research or practical experience of perhaps millions of end users of that compound around the world, for several decades now. Just doesn't happen. It's possible there was a longer-term additive in a formulation that also contained glyphosate, like imazapyr.

Mutagenic compounds have a way of not being approved by any of the first world's regulatory bodies for use in the environment. Some herbicides might temporarily arrest DNA synthesis but they certainly don't 'change' it.

seems to use round up and imprelis interchangeably ... really now.. ken

Some people do not realize that trees and plants have DNA. The lumber industry tinkers with tree DNA.

Glyphosate can be present in the soil for many months. Degradation of glyphosate depends on variables such as types of soils, types of bacteria in soil and other factors.

Giant companies like Monsanto and DuPont fund universities and these universities often give back desired test results. So that means that universities often will give biased test results.

http://www.highstrangeness.tv/0-9920-roundup-ready--death--disease.html

DuPont Imprelis is a growth regulator type of herbicide and the active ingredient is aminocyclopyrachlor. Information about aminocyclopyrachlor damage is very limited with most information compiled from 2011. What is unknown is long term damage. DuPont was in damage control to avoid paying out millions more and preserving profits.

JenJane12's photo suggests that the redwood species is a Coastal Redwood, judging by the needles. JenJane12's comment and photo was posted over 2.5 years so information is lacking. Did any of the 4 arborists test the soil and wood for herbicide? Did the needle curling occur first before the galls formed?

Davidrt28 mentions "some herbicides might temporarily arrest DNA synthesis but they certainly don't 'change' it." may have some validity but for 6 years the white spruce lateral branches have grown much faster than normal. The excessive number of seed cones from top to bottom was not noted last year.

I will take cuttings of this spruce and clone it as well as plant some of the seeds to see if the seedlings and rooted cuttings will resemble that white spruce, That will take few years to see the results.

Here is a photo taken of one of my Colorado spruce with excessive lateral branch growth. Note the excessive number of deformed seed cones on the lateral branch.

Nightwatcher, you have my attention.

What part of a plant does Round Up work on? I know for best results you have to hit the live green parts, but what is it that happens next?

When it kills it is there a DNA change? Well maybe on the Honeysuckle I apply it to and don't quite kill is there a DNA change? The foliage grows back small and contorted the next year.

I know this thread is years old at this point, but I’m going to jump on here in case some other poor soul comes across it as I did after many hours/months of scouring the Internet trying to figure out what is wrong with my once beautiful coastal redwood trees.

We live in central California, specifically Clovis. We purchased a house with four coastal redwood trees planted by a previous owner. Age is unknown, but the trees are about 40 foot tall and up until November 2023 they were extremely healthy. I have a background in the nursery industry, so I am able to care for my plants, and will always notice when there’s something wrong.

As I’ve already stated, I have been monitoring these trees since we’ve owned the house (5 yrs) to make sure they weren’t being stressed from heat or water deprivation, since both our common in our area. They were beautiful, lush, and healthy… Until November. I began started noticing the tallest tree on the very end and the tree next to it were experiencing a lot of brown/dead leaves. I was super busy at the time with the holidays, etc. and for some reason I didn’t really think it was anything to worry about. By January, the tree had shed almost half its leaves! Startled, I went outside to take a closer look and discovered the tree was covered top to bottom with huge tumor-like galls. The tree next to it has also experienced a little bit of the same in the area where the two trees touch. The other half of the second tree is healthy and fine so it’s only the half of the tree that touches the first tree. The other two trees in the series are absolutely fine.

I have no doubt based on the information in this thread and the pictures posted by the original poster that my trees were also chemically damaged. There’s literally no other explanation! I have had 2 certified arborists, and experienced landscape designers come out. I have probably had no less than six or seven “experts“ look at my trees, and no one can figure out what the heck it is. Insects have definitely been ruled out but everything points to chemical poisoning. I live on a corner lot; the other side of the fence is a 60 acre cow pasture where cows graze daily, so I doubt they have been applying any kind of herbicides. On the other side of my fence is a common HOA area that is maintained for weeds, but according to the HOA, they only use Ranger/ Roundup products. About 1 acre way is an almond orchard, and I am going to be investigating to see if they have possibly applied some sort of herbicide that drifted in the wind and affected my trees, which is extremely likely based on the fact that the only tree which was affected, is the one that is the most exposed to the outside areas around my backyard. It is so sad! Prior to this happening that tree was absolutely vigorous and beautiful. I have no idea if the tree will recover from this.

Are these redwoods getting weakened by some chemical and no longer having the strength to fight off a common problem?

Are these the same trees on reddit?

https://www.reddit.com/r/arborists/comments/1atgbvg/mystery_galls_all_over_my_coastal_redwood_tree/

Someone says they naturally don't do well in your area and you'll have to irrigate them well.

Hello Tornado3800

I am not sure what is causing these galls all over my redwood tree, but I am starting to become pretty certain it is in fact, the chemical discussed on this thread: Aminocyclopyrachlor- an ingredient found in some Dupont herbicides.

Yes, the trees on Reddit are my trees. I posted in the arborist forum, hoping for some help.

There are 4 trees planted right next to each other - all of which were very healthy and vigorous. 3 of the 4 are still doing great. Water is not an issue. They get plenty of water.